amightyfortress

Hands can be used to strangle people. Off with their hands!

It is very interesting to see the completely different viewpoints. Each side feels strongly about this subject. There really is no wishy-washy at all. I hope this thread does continue... because it gives people things to think about.

If they are willing to attack, kill, steal--yes--I would put that in the scum category.

I'm only prepared to kill those who are trying to kill me. The beans or any other reason are irrelevent. My first choice would be the intruder never shows up. My second choice is the sound of me readying my 12-gauge makes them decide to turn and leave. If that doesn't work, it's only then that I would take things to a final conclusion. It's something I hope I never have to do, but I will do if I have to.

When it comes to food storage--there's a big difference between someone politely knocking on your door and asking if you have anything to spare to eat and maybe even offering something in trade--either a good or perhaps a service--and someone with a shotgun, etc. busting down your door and willing to gun you down to take food from you and your family. As for me telling people not to expect me to feed and take care of them... they've received their warning. I've done them a favor. They can now go stock up and prepare knowing they can't count on me. If they are too lazy to stock up or are unwilling to stop spending money on stupid stuff, that's not my problem. I've given them the answer to their dilema: "Stock up now while times are good so you can take care of yourself". Just as a sidenote, if I knew someone was completely into preparedness and for some reason all their provisions were destroyed (fire, flood, etc.) I'd help them out a bit. It's the knowledgeable freeloaders I have an issue with. Knowledgeable freeloaders are those selfish people out there who are able to prepare, choose not to, spend their money on goodies/restaurants/gadgets/fun, and then plan to show up on other's doorsteps in an emergency. I just got off the phone with my mom. She just dropped about $1,000 today on more provisions. This is after spending every day the last couple of weeks stockpiling. It's not that she can't afford to stockpile, it's that she was too uninterested in doing it...until I set her straight and told her she'd better do it and not be counting on other people (myself included) to feed her. My viewpoint can be summed up kinda like Noah and the flood. He prepared, he warned, he prepared some more, warned some more... none of the people would change their ways. The flood came. You'll notice the unprepared/unrepented were not on the ark. Could Noah have opened the door to the ark and let a bunch of them in and risked his family dying? Sure. But he didn't.

Wow, I'm surprised nobody has jumped on me yet for having that viewpoint. Did I leave you all speechless? :)

"The reason I took this poll, is the number of people who figure they'll just take their neighbor's stuff when times get hard. 60% of the poll respondants on this thread say they might get more than they bargained for. " There are a limited number of people who know I do food storage. A few have commented, "I know where to come when times are bad". (The neighbors do not know because I bring stuff into the house after dark when they are not home). But anyone who visits my home, well it's hard not to notice I've basically turned the place into a very nice "bunker". I firmly, yet politely, tell them they are not welcome. I point out they (usually) earn more than I do. The stores are all open right now, nobody is forbidding them from stocking up now during the good times, and it's not my responsibility to feed and care for them. I tell them if they don't want to be cold/hungry/thirsty, they best go buy some blankets, canned goods, and water instead of wasting their money on other things. I tell them I will help them with any questions, etc. to prepare to take care of themselves, but they cannot count on me at all during an emergency, so don't bother making the trip. My home will be in shutdown-mode and the only people who will be entering are my two children. I even had to have a heart-to-heart with my mom who was refusing to prepare. I told her if it came right down to it, I'd have to do a family triage... and that means the young get fed and the old get nothing. Especially the very old, since they already have had a really nice life and it's unfair for the old to take food from the mouths of the young. If it appeared times were going to be awful for a long time, then even I would stop eating and give all my provisions and preps to my daughters (ages 21 and 28). Mom's now prepping... hahaha She's been out every day for the last couple of weeks. She's already got three months water and multiple cases of food, cat items, toilet paper, first aid, propane, etc. etc. Sometimes, a little tough love is what's needed.

"I'm hoping this won't turn into a US vs. UK bashing thread. It's primarily intended for folks in the US. Indeed, America has a rather unique situation not shared in most any other country in the world - we were created by rebels who'se notions of govt are very much different than the subjects of the British Crown. " hahaha my excuse is my bloodline is a mix of Menominee Indian and French-Canadian fur-trader. I'm not sure if I should shoot 'em, trap 'em, or scalp 'em :)

Well, it's clear to see we have those who are very pro-gun for self-defense and those who aren't. Let's step another direction... For those who are pro-gun and own guns, what would you do if Marshal Law was declared and/or another country took over and wanted to confiscate guns and/or all citizens were ordered to turn in their guns and/or guns were outlawed in your community? Would you comply? Would you follow the new laws and rules or would you go the civil disobedience route? My answer: I WILL keep my guns.

Ka-Bar -- excellent knife! I love mine. Oh, and I've learned if you pull out your ka-bar to cut a loose thread off your skirt, it freaks people out... hahaha :) Because I have a couple years food storage, lots of water and a Katadyn, and up to 20 years other items in storage, I don't worry much about food shortages, job loss, being forced to stay home a few months during a pandemic, etc. Because I have guns, I don't worry much about someone breaking into my home. My gun is always loaded and ready.

I feared for my life. Those are the magic words.

This is all reminding me of poor little Shasta Groene from Coeur d'Alene, Idaho. Pervert comes to the home, ties up and then kills her mother, teenage brother, mom's boyfriend... just so he can abduct Shasta and her brother Dylan for sex. That was the intruders goal. That's what he was after. Then after a couple months of Shasta and Dylan being tortured and raped...only little Shasta survived. The creep killed Dylan, too. What if there had been a firearm in the home when that creep showed up? Would the story have a happier ending? Oh, and LOCK YOUR DOORS. He entered through an unlocked door. When the cops interviewed him, he said he was thinking of not committing the crime and then thought to himself, "if the door is locked, I'll leave" and "if the door is unlocked it's a sign to proceed". At least make the intruder have to work to get into your home. That little bit of noise he'll make might be enough to give you time to react.

"A criminal will use a bomb, threat, guns, knives, cars, glass, whatever means at hand to attack. They often do not have mercy, they will not listen to a plea to stop, and they certainly often do not care about who they hurt or what they do to get what they want." Very true, Auroasungem. Not only will they not have mercy or listen to a plea to stop, but some of them actually get off on that sort of thing. They WANT to torture you just so they can enjoy listening to your pleas. Must be some psychotic-God-complex power trip for them or something. I live alone, so I only have to worry about myself. But I can't imagine what it would be like to be a parent, have some intruder break in, tie me up... and then have some "fun" with my kids while I had to hear them crying and calling out for help. Can you imagine that? Or the husband who gets tied up and has to see his wife and daughters raped in front of him. I know this is grim... but these are things that happen in the real world now... when we have still reasonably low unemployment, food available, etc. Can you imagine how much worse people's souls will become if times get worse? I'm sorry to be so doom-n-gloom, but there are dark souls out there and we are to be prepared for anything and I hope this gives some of those people sitting on the neutral-fence something to think about. Better to have a gun and never use it... than need a gun and not have one.

Actually, me having a 12-gauge could save the intruders life. If I pull back on that thing and he hears that sound, he's either going to turn and run... or maybe I can hold him "hostage" until the police arrive and can arrest him. (Or, he'll be fool enough to keep approaching and end up full of whatever amount of buckshot and slugs it takes to stop him from approaching)

I'm kinda laughing here about the comment that because there aren't many guns around in that other country, the criminals tend to use knives. Is that supposed to be reassuring? I know with 100% conviction to the bottom of my very soul, that if I was given a choice between being quickly shot to death, or stabbed over-and-over-and-over-and-over-somemore... I'd totally choose the bullet. I have no intention of just sitting there quietly in my home if I hear someone breaking in. Even if a person could make a call for the police to come... how long will it take them to arrive? They'd be arriving to a murder scene, probably mine, if I didn't have a gun. That's why I have a gun and need a gun. Yes, NEED a gun. I am not the type to listen to what the intruder says. I'm not the type to allow myself to be tied or ducttaped up. For what? So I can be tortured and raped for a few hours before he ends up killing me anyway? I'd be fighting the entire time with everything I could get my hands on. My 12-gauge shotgun is so much easier.

I'd convert that old high school friend into a veryyyy veryyyy distant old high school friend. What an awful thought process he has. I wouldn't want to risk being anywhere near someone like that or letting them have any kind of contact with any of my family members.That unfortunately 85 year old lady probably doesn't even know she has a potential psychopath living next door who has no qualms about attacking her to take her food. That story is just so sad. Terrible. How can people even think such things?

I'm really sorry to hear you feel that way and have to deal with such issues. As things stand, it's probably best to avoid firearms. It's good you recognize your strengths and weaknesses and are working through the issues.

I have a beautiful Mossberg 500A Persuader/Cruiser that I love very much. I also have a "generous" amount of ammo :) I have some other random guns around, but I really love that Mossberg. My gun is for home defense and for just plain old fun. It's fun to go to the shooting range or to a nice piece of land in the middle of nowhere, set up some targets, and shoot at them. I like knives, too...and bows and arrows :) When times get bad if someone asked for for help, that's one thing... but if someone plans to harm me in order to take from me, well, they better hope they've got me outgunned because things may not be as easy as they thought it would be. It's one thing to have a need and ask... it's a whole different thing to try to overpower and/or kill someone to steal. I would never go out of my way to cause trouble, but if trouble comes through my door, I'm prepared to deal with it.

I guess I'm just use to it. I love my Back to Basics grainmill and use it almost every day. I think it goes really fast (the faster you crank, the faster the flour comes out :) It only takes me about 10 minutes to grind enough flour for 2 loaves of bread. The concept of time might be relative to lifestyle. I still do my laundry on a washboard, so spending 10 minutes of enjoyable time doing something simple like handgrinding grain while I daydream goes really quickly for me.

Loudmouth-Mormon: That "get out of debt" link in your post was a wonderful article. I enjoyed it alot. Thanks :)

I get teased alot about "grinding wheat with a rock". Without a grainmill, you'd really be reduced to about that point to crack wheat. But you don't need to do that. Go to Emergency Essentials - Be Prepared Emergency Preparedness Food Storage and you can get a great handcranked "Back to Basics" grainmill for $69.95. It doesn't use electricity. You can grind grain into flour, or set it to a very course setting to make your own cracked wheat. It's easy and it's fun. You can use it on wheat, oats, spelt, corn, etc. It's a nice mill, cheap, and I love mine very much :) Here, I just looked up the address for the page with the mill on it (click on the words below): Hand Grain Mill

Day after day of bad news lately. In times like these, it helps to step back and be grateful. So I wanted to start a thread where people can type something they feel grateful for. I'll start by saying: I'm grateful for this wonderful, friendly, helpful website we can all come to for sharing ideas and tips which makes it easier for ourselves and others to gain the knowledge they need to care for themselves and their families. Please feel free to add things you are grateful for.

Clown scary! :)

Why are so many people so anti-wheat, anti-grainmill? My stash of a variety of wheat and my handcranked Back-to-Basics grainmill are my favorite part of food storage. The grainmill is always attached to my kitchen table (unless enough company is coming over that someone needs to sit on that side of the table) and I use my mill and my wheat almost every day. I make yummy muffins, delicious pancakes, bread, cookies, cakes, flour for gravy, noodles, etc. The cheapest and tastiest way to round out your food storage is to purchase bulk wheat, a grainmill, and then use it all the time.

Natural disasters happen, too. Did you see the footage from Hurricane Katrina, Hurricane Ike, the icestorm a few years back in Saint Louis area? Sure, if your home is utterly destroyed, your food storage won't do you much good (except that which you were able to quickly take with you as you evacuated).But statistically the chances are in your favor that your home/apartment won't be destroyed. But that doesn't mean your life won't be miserable for a few weeks. Depending on the "emergency", there could be no water, no gas, no electric, a run on the stores and no food, no ATM machines, etc. For instance, all those people in Houston who's houses were fine after Hurricane Ike, but they quickly ran out of food and water and they had no electricity. Did you see them all standing there for hour-after-miserable-hour in the FEMA line waiting for their gov'ment handout of bottled water and some food the gov'ment decided they should eat? Do you want to be one of those people? I know I don't want to have to stand in line like that. I'm also non-Mormon, yet I have about a three year stash of food now, and a few months of water (working on storing more, and I also own a Katadyn filter and can see Lake Michigan from my backyard). Be prepared. It's a great feeling.