Guest Starsky Posted June 30, 2004 Report Share Posted June 30, 2004 Not only did Laban need to be killed to prevent him from killing Lehi and his family, but he need to be killed to keep Laman and Lemuel from being able to go back to Jerusalem.... If they had returned...they would have been put to death for the death of Laban....it was very wise of the Lord to have Laban killed.... :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TheProudDuck Posted June 30, 2004 Report Share Posted June 30, 2004 I dunno -- who in Jerusalem knew that Nephi had done the dirty deed? He took the only witness (Zoram) with him. And couldn't Laman and Lemuel have returned and given state's evidence, so to speak? "My brother did it. He went thataway." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Starsky Posted June 30, 2004 Report Share Posted June 30, 2004 Well...I am sure there was more than just the servant of Laban who knew that the family was after the plates...and that having them missing and nothing else would sort of give a BIG hint as to who killed Laban.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
srm Posted June 30, 2004 Report Share Posted June 30, 2004 Originally posted by Starsky@Jun 30 2004, 10:20 AM Not only did Laban need to be killed to prevent him from killing Lehi and his family, but he need to be killed to keep Laman and Lemuel from being able to go back to Jerusalem....If they had returned...they would have been put to death for the death of Laban....it was very wise of the Lord to have Laban killed.... :) I does not seem that that was a factor. They DID go back for the girls. And they DID want to kill Nephi and return to jerusalem. No mention was made of the fact that they could not return. if this was a factor it is not mentioned in the text. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Starsky Posted June 30, 2004 Report Share Posted June 30, 2004 No it wasn't mentioned in the text...but it was an abridgment.... And going back for the girls was hardly the same thing as trying to go and live there... doing business...and owning homes etc.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted June 30, 2004 Report Share Posted June 30, 2004 "Not only did Laban need to be killed to prevent him from killing Lehi and his family, but he need to be killed to keep Laman and Lemuel from being able to go back to Jerusalem.... If they had returned...they would have been put to death for the death of Laban....it was very wise of the Lord to have Laban killed.... " So much for free agency.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snow Posted June 30, 2004 Report Share Posted June 30, 2004 Originally posted by Starsky@Jun 30 2004, 02:49 PM No it wasn't mentioned in the text...but it was an abridgment.... Pray tell, how did you come by the knowledge that it was an abridgement? A divining rod? Casting lots? Tea leaves? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted June 30, 2004 Report Share Posted June 30, 2004 I'll bet she found a neat ole rock at the bottom of a well, and threw it into her wool NY Yankees ballcap, and stuck her head in and saw that it was an abridgement! (Disclaimer: Im just joking around here, no real offense intended) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snow Posted June 30, 2004 Report Share Posted June 30, 2004 A peep stone it is then. You used a peep stone didn't you Peace? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TheProudDuck Posted July 1, 2004 Report Share Posted July 1, 2004 Originally posted by Snow@Jun 30 2004, 04:52 PM A peep stone it is then. You used a peep stone didn't you Peace? Isn't a "peep stone" the preferred means of execution for blasphemous Easter marshmallow rabbits? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Starsky Posted July 1, 2004 Report Share Posted July 1, 2004 Well....I thought Mormon abridged all of the records.....but maybe he decided not to abridge Nephi's part.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Unorthodox Posted July 1, 2004 Report Share Posted July 1, 2004 Should we just role play a trial for Nephi and be done with it? It might be fun. We need someone to be Nephi, someone to be Nephi's lawyer, someone to be the prosecuter, etc. Oh and we need to choose 12 jury members to make a final vote at the end. 6 LDS and 6 non-LDS. Volunteers? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted July 1, 2004 Report Share Posted July 1, 2004 While I do have a prejudice against him, I'd be happy to sit on the Jury and listen to arguments.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Starsky Posted July 1, 2004 Report Share Posted July 1, 2004 Good grief....LOL.... I think we all need to be tried..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted July 1, 2004 Report Share Posted July 1, 2004 C'mon...it'll be fun. We can get Snow and PD to be the lawyers, and turn it into a real OJ Simpson type thing! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Unorthodox Posted July 1, 2004 Report Share Posted July 1, 2004 So who wants to be the lawyers? I agree PD would be a good choice, since he IS a lawyer. He could probably give a good case as a prosecutor or defense attorney. Snow? That would definately be interesting... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Starsky Posted July 1, 2004 Report Share Posted July 1, 2004 Okay....I think you have chosen the two to be lawyers....PD and Snow.... I want to be a juror...I want to be the lead juror....(idon'tevenknowifispelledthatright) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Unorthodox Posted July 2, 2004 Report Share Posted July 2, 2004 Jason chose the lawyers...I don't know if they would be interested. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snow Posted July 2, 2004 Report Share Posted July 2, 2004 Unfortunately the terms of my court-ordered probation preclude any involvement in most legal matters. Interestingly, I used to be on amateurbation but I got so good at it that I had to turn "pro." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Posted July 2, 2004 Report Share Posted July 2, 2004 I'm the judge - or I'd be happy to be an expert witness. Is this a civil case? If the damages are less than $40,000 (in Nevada) then you're going to have to arbitrate in which case I'd be happy to be the arbitrator. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nina Posted July 2, 2004 Report Share Posted July 2, 2004 Nephi killed Laban because the Lord told him to and because we would need the records ... I am not sure there was a bigger grander scheme between the lines although I would concede that the Lord probably has a miriad of reasons for everything He does given his omniscience. As to why the brothers didn't go back to Jerusalem I think it was because they knew the truth. They just couldn't handle it. They were willing to fight and complain and murmur but they were not willing to just walk away. I have seen many people, member of a church, leave the church and then cling to their ties to it. They are afraid to stray too far, either because they know it is true but just can't live up to the effort, or because they feel they have to prove that they are right (in not believing or in believing something else). I have seen others just walk away and never look back. I think Laban and Lemuel were more likely the first. They seemed to be bound not only by their familial relationships but by their uncertainty(or fear?) ... I think of all of them I probably admire the ones who walk away and don't look back. They choose what side of the fence they belong on and go forth with conviction. It's not MY side of the fence but at least they are not standing ON the fence waiting to jump(or Fall) on me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Starsky Posted July 3, 2004 Report Share Posted July 3, 2004 I don't admire anyone who walks away from anything and doesn't look back....though I understand your point.... It is difficult to deal with people who are struggling with things ... in such a way that it draws from us a greater amount of charity, and conviction to allow them their struggle.... But....that is actually the place where we must be our best selves....so I am thankful for their needs....so that I can be of service.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bizabra Posted July 4, 2004 Report Share Posted July 4, 2004 Originally posted by Nina@Jul 2 2004, 11:16 AM Nephi killed Laban because the Lord told him to and because we would need the records ... I am not sure there was a bigger grander scheme between the lines although I would concede that the Lord probably has a miriad of reasons for everything He does given his omniscience. As to why the brothers didn't go back to Jerusalem I think it was because they knew the truth. They just couldn't handle it. They were willing to fight and complain and murmur but they were not willing to just walk away. I have seen many people, member of a church, leave the church and then cling to their ties to it. They are afraid to stray too far, either because they know it is true but just can't live up to the effort, or because they feel they have to prove that they are right (in not believing or in believing something else). I have seen others just walk away and never look back. I think Laban and Lemuel were more likely the first. They seemed to be bound not only by their familial relationships but by their uncertainty(or fear?) ... I think of all of them I probably admire the ones who walk away and don't look back. They choose what side of the fence they belong on and go forth with conviction. It's not MY side of the fence but at least they are not standing ON the fence waiting to jump(or Fall) on me. How could any of the Nephites (or Lamanites for that matter) be members of THE CHURCH? They all left the Middle East BEFORE Jesus was even born! AFTER Jesus died and came to visit (IF you buy that story) then they could be, but PRIOR to that?I thought Jesus did not found his church until he was alive. It was then supposedly taken from the earth due to humanities evilness. Joe Smith was the instrument for it's "restoration". So how could any of the descendants of Nephi, et al, be members of THE CHURCH? Also, if THE CHURCH was brought over to the descendants of Nephi,etc. but the TRUE CHURCH authority was stripped from all those back in the "old world", was it also taken from all those over here who ahd been baptized or converted when Jesus came over to visit after his death? Questions questions questions Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bizabra Posted July 4, 2004 Report Share Posted July 4, 2004 Originally posted by Starsky@Jul 3 2004, 11:35 AM I don't admire anyone who walks away from anything and doesn't look back....though I understand your point....It is difficult to deal with people who are struggling with things ... in such a way that it draws from us a greater amount of charity, and conviction to allow them their struggle....But....that is actually the place where we must be our best selves....so I am thankful for their needs....so that I can be of service.... Even if the thing they walked away from was abuse or poverty or a former life of crime or whatever? Wouldn't it be a good thing o "walk away and not look back" at a previous life that was deleterious to the person walking away?I would say that a person who walks away from a life of alcoholism and who never looks back is admirable.I would say that a person who tears themselves away from an abusive parent or spouse and goes on to live a good decent life and who never looks badk is admirable.I would say that a person who leaves a life of crime and never looks back is admirable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Starsky Posted July 4, 2004 Report Share Posted July 4, 2004 Originally posted by bizabra+Jul 4 2004, 09:33 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (bizabra @ Jul 4 2004, 09:33 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin--Starsky@Jul 3 2004, 11:35 AM I don't admire anyone who walks away from anything and doesn't look back....though I understand your point....It is difficult to deal with people who are struggling with things ... in such a way that it draws from us a greater amount of charity, and conviction to allow them their struggle....But....that is actually the place where we must be our best selves....so I am thankful for their needs....so that I can be of service.... Even if the thing they walked away from was abuse or poverty or a former life of crime or whatever? Wouldn't it be a good thing o "walk away and not look back" at a previous life that was deleterious to the person walking away?I would say that a person who walks away from a life of alcoholism and who never looks back is admirable.I would say that a person who tears themselves away from an abusive parent or spouse and goes on to live a good decent life and who never looks badk is admirable.I would say that a person who leaves a life of crime and never looks back is admirable. I don't believe you can be a whole person and not admit....as alcholics do....that they were an alcholic....or were abused or whatever...Your idea just doesn't hold water.....No one leaves an abusive home....and not look back and try and put their lives together from....that past....they don't just pretend it doesn't exist....or live in deniel....with any success....They have to look back and deal with it.....work through it.....but always....looking back and seeing what they don't want to continue in.....and why...I think you are mistaking....walking away....and walking away without looking back....at what they left.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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