Treble.clef

I agree with you and appreciate your answer but how do you do that exactly? I know I need to improve. (I don't mean this sarcastically) Do you think you people get to a point where there is no need to improve? It sounds like you have it down to a science.

If you have not already done so, Mormon.org is a great site to explore the faith as well :) Best wishes in your exploring!

Personal mini goals- spend less time on the internet , read more.

nvm

Imperfect, opinionated, anonymous, diverse, chosen online versions of Church memembers/brothers and sisters/internet strangers with keyboard courage.

If we have the guts to share something on the internet, should we also have the guts to take the responses?

I agree with/appreciate both The Folk Prophet and Eowyn's comment. Christ did offend people all the time, yet he was/is perfect. Christ is an example to us. He spoke up. On the other hand, we can't really hold a candle to Christ. We aren't perfect, we did not perform the Atonement. I think the topic of contention has grey areas. Other people may say no, it's always black and white. Maybe the black and white offend the grey. No, the grey offends the black. No, the black clearly offends the grey. No, the white offends only the grey, but never the black. If the spirit prompts you to say something, then you should say it, regardless of possible hurt feelings. Let the Holy Ghost be your guide. I don't think the spirit will lead us astray.

Respectful, civil, silly- those are your opinions. Other people may not agree. What is non-civil to you can be civil to someone else. We have the moderators for this site. I think they do their job. We have to use our own best judgement but full speed ahead

It is a strength to keep things respectful and civil. It is not always easy to do. I don't always think of fighting, being passionate comes to mind. I think passion is a good thing. It is an impossible balance, being passionate and not stepping on anyone's toes. There is always someone that might be offended or disagree. I don't think we should go out of our way to offend either, even if it provides mental stimulation. It really is a delicate balance with inevitable offending and being offended. Do we give up and shut up or keep on going? My one cent.

I think I could use a little Led Zeppelin right now

You were calling both mine and Leah's examples silly and extreme. What I am saying is, examples (in general) are okay, even if other people think they are silly, extreme, or whatnot.

lagarthaaz- have you talked to your Bishop and Primary President about your feelings regarding your primary? It might help you feel better. It could initiate a change for your primary kids. Maybe you and your fellow church leaders can come up with something to do for the kids that feel left out, unloved, etc. You could ask parents for suggestions too.

I did not know this, that is awesome

. I say, please keep opening your "big yap"

I grew up in a very contentious home. I think a little contention is inevitable since we are imperfect people. Resisting the natural man is a life long battle, and we will fall sometimes. I think the degree of contention in the home can be a gauge. It can serve as a yellow or red flag for specific problems that need to be addressed. I know contention in the home is not a good thing. The less contention, the better. The spirit will not stick around with contention, but it can come back :)

I am guilty of this sometimes and need to improve. Thanks for your comment, omegaseamaster75.

Yeah, Leah's post may not have been the perfect example It could still help someone. Laughter is the best medicine they say. I am sorry you feel like you were mocked. I think sarcasm can be helpful sometimes, but that is really subjective and circumstantial. I am glad Leah spoke up. Maybe it can inspire someone else to speak up again or jump into this thread if they are not already in it. There is no need to apologize that you think I have completely understood lagarthazz. Who is to say whether it's appropriate to form an opinion/speak up? To go a little further, who is to say (other than the moderators and kudos to them for what they do) whether expressing an opinion/speaking up is appropriate or not? I think the answer for this forum is (moderators aside) we each need to decide for ourselves.

I don't agree with your view on opinions. I think everyone has a right to their own opinion, whether or not they have experienced the same thing. I think no one has the right to declare that someone else does not have a right to their own opinion. You have a right to your opinion regardless of whether you can relate to something or not.

Silly, extreme examples are okay. Silly and extreme are YOUR opinions that other people may not agree with. Maybe those examples really helped other people that aren't participating on this thread. Maybe it was an example that someone really needed to read. Good for Leah for expressing what she wished.

Nope, no pats on the back over here. I am sorry if I have upset you, as it seems I may have. That was not my intention. My intention is to express my views. I am also sorry for what you have had to go through. I know life is not easy for anyone and some issues are very sensitive. I agree my examples were extreme but I could not think of better ones at the time. Do you have some examples you would like to share that aren't extreme?I can relate to feeling different, excluded, and hurt when I reflect on primary songs and my childhood. You have shared some of what you have gone though. I do not wish to share. Why do I still encourage the singing of all primary songs? Firstly, because I have deep love and appreciation for all primary songs. One primary song in particular helped me get through hard times. Secondly, because some of the primary songs are the ideal family life for every child. Every child deserves to not have a broken home, and to have good, loving parents around who live the Gospel. Unfortunately, this world is not perfect. Satan targets families. Mistakes are made. Parents may pass away. I will root for the happy/for the celebration of ideal family life/for the primary songs. It is a hope I have for every child.

This site may be my forte after all This may be the last full measure for this thread (is thread the correct term? I thinks so..?)

I do think it is okay to sing primary songs regardless of what the background might be. I think it is good to be sensitive but we each have to draw the line for ourselves. Should the children with fathers miss out because other children are fatherless, fostered, or abused? It is a question of do you cater to the majority or minority? How could both be catered to? I don't know the answer to that. I know the following aren't near as common and not the best examples. I will say them anyways though- should we stop praying in sacrament because some people may be deaf? Should we stop eating bread at sacrament because some people can't eat anything by mouth? There are interpreters for the deaf though. Would it be possible to have some sort of "interpreter" figure work for children in broken homes regarding primary songs? I don't know. What I do know is I trust the Prophet and the apostles to receive revelation at the right time if changes need to be made. Maybe it is a problem that will initiate change in the future. Until then, I will encourage my children to belt out those primary songs that warm my heart!

Ouch

I agree. How often do kids look up to an elementary or primary school teacher, regardless of whether she may have her own biological children? One of the best mothers I know could not have biological children so she adopted. She is as much a mother as anyone with biological children! Her children were also sealed to her in the temple. They are her children.

We disagree but that is okay. That is a good point, there are male obstetricians and they do help. I am not opposed to male obgyn's just for the record. I think they do just as good of a job vs a female obgyn (maybe better in some cases). Anyways though, think about why they have support groups consisting of people going through the same thing? I think it is because it's easier to relate to and understand each other. Example- child birth is definitely not the same experience for everyone yet two females who have both given birth can relate more to each other versus a male who never will give birth. I'm not trying to offend anyone and sorry if I have. I am expressing my opinion. Take it with a grain of salt.