charity

Another e-mail? I am flooded with e-mails. So thank you for helping me out with a good one.

Thanks, Steuss. How do you hear about these things?

jadams, please don't get your hopes up too high. I was proxy for the endowment for both of my grandmothers. One grandmother I knew, one had died before I was even born. I loved my grandmother that I knew, and she was a wonderful person. But when I was the proxy for her, I didn't feel anything special. But then when I was the proxy for my grandmother who had died before I was born, the experience was almost overwhelming. I t hink it does depend on if the person is ready right then to recieve the ordinance you are performing for them. There will be very special experiences in the temple. We just can't tell when they are going to happen. But going to the temple is always a time for quiet reflection and for loving the Savior and our Heavenly Parents.

If you live in an area where a new temple is being built, before it is dedicated and thereafter for members in good standing only, there will be an open house with tours.

WE have quarterly enrichment activities, but we have many, many enrichment groups going on that meet every month, and some even oftener. We have group that goes hiking, one that does freezer meals, one that does a greeting card swap, we have quilting (that's my group), scrapbooking, weight loss, computer skills, a writer's group (my other group), a toddler's play group, clutter busters, a gardening group, ladies at lunch group, dinner and a movie group, and probalby some I don't know about. If two sisters have a common interest, they can make a group. We are going to have a Girls Night Out. At the stake center, in the gym, 6-midnight. We are going to do speed visiting, plus a bunch of personal care things, making sachets, manicures, facials, color analysis, chair massage, and just plain old hanging out.

But it does get confusing when you tell a non-member or investigator you had a meeting at the "stake house" and they think "steakhouse!"

Siousie, often times people help out different elders, usually anonymously. When a young man is being called on a mission, and people know that the family would find it a real stretch to support him, ward members can tell the bishop they would be able to donate a specific amount, and the family would never know who had. 50 years ago, my husband's extended family help support him on his mission. We have helped others along the way since then.

I didn't notice the e-mail address, sorry. I will post there. Please give us your results when you get them, so maybe we can use it for an activity. Thanks.

Is that being saved IN our sins?

For young men who are already members, deacons are ordained at age 12, teachers at age 14, and then priests at age 16. Usually young men are ordained as elders right before they are called on missions, so usually about age 19. avatar is right about men who join the Church as adults.

Deborah, I, too have been shown the Father's love and care in very small, but signifcant events, too. I think the OP is correct. We do tend to overgeneralize. And many people do go through challenges to their testimonies because of this.

I think we will do all the good things we did here, but just not the bad things. We will eat, but not overeat, we will have sex, but not for any lustful reason, we women will have babies, but without all the unpleasant stuff, we will get to be parents to babies without the spit up, and toddlers without the tantrums, and teenagers without cars. What bliss.

I think our bodies look like our spirits. More or less. I think some of the mortality, imperfectness, has some impact. But I think when we have progressed to where we are perfect, our attitudes will be perfect too, and we will think all are beautiful, and it won't be because of straight teeth, or nice noses, or big eyes, or whatever.

I was 19 years old and a sophomore in college. I had heard of Brigham Young, but not Joseph Smith. I was led to the Church and knew the minute I walked in the doors that was where God wanted me to be. I took the missionary discussions and was baptized a month later. And that is 46 years ago. (I'm old.) I have been a devout member ever since.

I am not sure what the "beard or no beard" argument has to do with anything. I just offer the following link as a curiosity. There is no identification of to place of time with these men. http://content.lib.utah.edu/cdm4/item_view...amp;CISOPTR=456

MA&D is Mormon Apologetics and Discussion, which is another message board. That community is us ordinary TBM folk, some TBM scholars and academics, a couple of really nice non-members, and a bunch of not so nice, but still tolerable exes and critics. The debate can get pretty hot over there. The mods do a great job of reigning us all in when we need it, but still it isn't a place for the timid. A lot of us from MA&D come over here to sit back, put our feet up, and enjoy a little nice social time. Then when we have rested up we dash back over and get back into the fray. Welcome here.

I tried to pm this, but it bounced back. What I said to you said nothing about how carefully or thoughtfully you made your decision. But you cannot deny the basic fact that morals, personality, etc. are not what makes up the totality of an individual. There is a very basic difference between believers and non believers. Now, you do not share with your believing family members the most important part of their existence. They can easily, even if wrongly, see you turning your back on what had been your faith to be the same action to them. They shouldn't, but some of them probably do, ask "how can you do this to me?" Your parents feel they have lost a child. They may be asking themselves anguished questions about what they did wrong, how did they fail you? If they mention Church activities, or going to the temple in your presence, there is probably some hestitation now. We have all been taught "he that is not with me, is against me." If you are not a believer anymore, that puts you in that camp, whether you act benignly or not. Maybe you aren't on Temple Square waving a placard, but your siblings have to answer uncomfortable questions about why "Uncle/Aunt doesn't go to Church anymore." What do they say that a child can understand? Remember, it is not them that changed. It is you. It is your responsbility to reassure them that they aren't at fault, that you still love them, and calm their fears. You ask for their unconditional love, that no matter what you do, they don't change. That is an unrealistic expectation. I don't know your mind, but I have seen this in the actions of others. They want to do what they want to do, and they want to chose the consequences. We have our agency. We can chose. But the consequences are fixed. You can jump off a bridge if you want, but you can't chose not to land hard on the rocks below.

No, you aren't the same person you have always been. You are now an unbeliever. This shouldn't mean that your family doesn't love you any more. But the relationship is different. And yes, our relationship with our Savior is the most important thing, above any other individual. When a person leaves the Church, that is worse than death to the believing family members. They are in deep grief. You are not the victim here. Since you have dealt the blow, it is up to you to do what you can for them. If you love them unconditionally, that is.

In the mid 1800's the land west of the Mississippi River all the way to the Rocky Mountains was called The Great American Desert. The reason for the settling of the west coast states of America by pioneers in the 1800's was that they didn't think they could have farming in the Great American Desert. That area now is called America's Breadbakset with a highly productive farming industry.

Larry, this sounds like a FAIR brochure or a FAIRwiki piece. Are you planning either one?

I, personally, am looking for the Middle East stuff. The two prophets. . . .etc.

Or maybe you can point your finger and organize the atoms in your glass to be milk without having to go to all the work of milking a cow. Same with the cookies.

I know in the Millenium I have 3 of my own to raise. So I suppose the spirit babies happen after the Millenium. GG, I don't think we agree on how this happens. But that is okay. It is all speculation because we haven't been given that information.

You are too sensible for a message board. That's pretty much all we talk about.