Guest Bro_West Posted December 13, 2004 Report Posted December 13, 2004 I'm currently serving in our ward's bishopric. I'm so thankful for an inspired bishop who leads our ward. Today, he made a decision that I hope becomes a tradition in our ward and in many others.Next week, we will have our usual Christmas program, but our closing hymn will be Praise to The Man. What could be more appropriate for the Sunday before December 23, Joseph Smith's birthday?Of course, we join the rest of the Christian world in celebrating the birth of Christ in December, but we know that Christ wasn't really born then. Joseph Smith, on the other hand, was definitely born in December. And, we must never forget what another latter-day prophet, John Taylor, told us. Joseph Smith has done more for us than any person who ever lived in this world, save Jesus Christ.I hope we'll all take a moment to remember our beloved Brother Joseph this season. Quote
EmmaLeigh Posted December 13, 2004 Report Posted December 13, 2004 Interesting thought as a CofC member (for the time being) and... well.. interesting... :) Do you have "We Thank Thee oh God For a Prophet" in your hymnal?? Cant sing that without thinking about Joseph Smith. Quote
Jenda Posted December 13, 2004 Report Posted December 13, 2004 Since next year is the 200th anniversary of his birth, I believe that our church is planning some sort of celebration. Quote
Guest curvette Posted December 13, 2004 Report Posted December 13, 2004 I have a better idea. Let's take "Praise to the man" out of our hymnbooks and stick to celebrating Christ's birth in December (even if he wasn't born then.) Quote
Guest TheProudDuck Posted December 13, 2004 Report Posted December 13, 2004 Originally posted by curvette@Dec 12 2004, 10:14 PM I have a better idea. Let's take "Praise to the man" out of our hymnbooks and stick to celebrating Christ's birth in December (even if he wasn't born then.) I've always wondered if other religions have any hymns which praise individual people instead of God directly. Since I'm not extensively familiar with other churches' hymnals (other than the Presbyterian, which I picked up to practice a hymn to be performed at a funeral), I don't really know. The Anglican hymn "For All The Saints" comes to mind -- although the praise of the saints in that song is actually praise of God, once you get through the really long sentence: "For all the saints, who from their labors rest ... Thy name, O Jesus, be forever blest." I know that there are a lot of Catholic hymns addressed specifically to the Virgin Mary, so maybe there's a parallel -- not the first parallel between the LDS and the Catholics, the sentiments of returned missionaries to Latin America about the "G&A" notwithstanding. Quote
Outshined Posted December 13, 2004 Report Posted December 13, 2004 Perhaps we need top weed out any song that might offend feminists or ayone else. We'd still have eight or nine good songs left, I'm sure... Quote
Jenda Posted December 14, 2004 Report Posted December 14, 2004 Originally posted by Outshined@Dec 13 2004, 04:39 PM Perhaps we need top weed out any song that might offend feminists or ayone else. We'd still have eight or nine good songs left, I'm sure... You don't have to weed them out. Just change the words. That is what our church did. Quote
EmmaLeigh Posted December 14, 2004 Report Posted December 14, 2004 I'm with you Jenda when it comes to the changing of gender in things... the change to communion prayers was almost more than my lil head could take... (but then, i'm a girl that doesnt feel right about women in the presiding bishopric or the council of 12... )... ugh... Quote
Jenda Posted December 14, 2004 Report Posted December 14, 2004 I still sing the old words. It makes for lots of raised eyebrows in church. B) Quote
EmmaLeigh Posted December 14, 2004 Report Posted December 14, 2004 :) You sound like someone my dad would get along with... He loves wearing his 'church seal' t-shirt... It has Community of christ over a seal with a red and white ball on its nose... :) I dont know what I"ll do the first time I'm somewhere that the communion prayers are said differently... I've had them memorized since I was seven... I'll probably insist on them being repeated RIGHT... :) It always saved me at Conference when they would have them said in a different language... I still knew what was being said... :) Quote
Jenda Posted December 14, 2004 Report Posted December 14, 2004 Can you make them say them over? I just assumed my only option would be to refrain from partaking. Quote
EmmaLeigh Posted December 14, 2004 Report Posted December 14, 2004 I'm not sure - but I'd sure be tempted... I came from one of hte most conservative areas of the church and now am in one of the most liberal... it is strange... but i havennt been somewhere that the new prayers have been used... I just am so diametrically opposed to the whole idea... shrugs... it makes my skin crawl... :) Quote
shanstress70 Posted December 14, 2004 Report Posted December 14, 2004 Would either of you care to explain why it bothers you so to have women in these positions you speak of? The pastor of my church is a female, and she brings so much to the church. I'm not trying to argue about it... I'm truly curious. Quote
StrawberryFields Posted December 14, 2004 Report Posted December 14, 2004 Originally posted by Bro_West@Dec 12 2004, 07:19 PM I'm currently serving in our ward's bishopric. I'm so thankful for an inspired bishop who leads our ward. Today, he made a decision that I hope becomes a tradition in our ward and in many others.Next week, we will have our usual Christmas program, but our closing hymn will be Praise to The Man. What could be more appropriate for the Sunday before December 23, Joseph Smith's birthday?Of course, we join the rest of the Christian world in celebrating the birth of Christ in December, but we know that Christ wasn't really born then. Joseph Smith, on the other hand, was definitely born in December. And, we must never forget what another latter-day prophet, John Taylor, told us. Joseph Smith has done more for us than any person who ever lived in this world, save Jesus Christ.I hope we'll all take a moment to remember our beloved Brother Joseph this season. This is just too strange for my liking and I would be disappointed if this happened in our ward the Sunday before Christmas.Brother West where do you live? Quote
Jenda Posted December 14, 2004 Report Posted December 14, 2004 Originally posted by shanstress70@Dec 14 2004, 06:15 AM Would either of you care to explain why it bothers you so to have women in these positions you speak of? The pastor of my church is a female, and she brings so much to the church. I'm not trying to argue about it... I'm truly curious. I just believe that mens and womens talents lie in different areas. They have different ministries, and should have different priorities. Women in the priesthood has caused a lot of family problems, and some ministries are going unfulfilled because the women are now focused on different things. Quote
Amillia Posted December 14, 2004 Report Posted December 14, 2004 Originally posted by curvette@Dec 12 2004, 11:14 PM I have a better idea. Let's take "Praise to the man" out of our hymnbooks and stick to celebrating Christ's birth in December (even if he wasn't born then.) Will wonders never cease? I fully agree with you Curvette. Quote
EmmaLeigh Posted December 14, 2004 Report Posted December 14, 2004 I am simply uncomfortable with the idea... It doesnt seem right, even though I know there were prohetesses in the scriptures... Women pastors dont bother me near as much as a woman APOSTLE and a woman prophet... and the office of bishop and patriarch (evangelist now) are so historically male that it is difficult to see a woman in the presiding bishopric....I also agree about many women not being focused on the right area of ministry... it has certainly opened a can of worms...Brother West where do you live?Making sure moving there isnt on your agenda in the future??? :) Quote
Guest curvette Posted December 14, 2004 Report Posted December 14, 2004 Originally posted by EmmaLeigh@Dec 14 2004, 12:06 PM I am simply uncomfortable with the idea... It doesnt seem right, even though I know there were prohetesses in the scriptures... Women pastors dont bother me near as much as a woman APOSTLE and a woman prophet... and the office of bishop and patriarch (evangelist now) are so historically male that it is difficult to see a woman in the presiding bishopric....I also agree about many women not being focused on the right area of ministry... it has certainly opened a can of worms...Brother West where do you live?Making sure moving there isnt on your agenda in the future??? :) I'm curious. Besides the obvious (belief that the priesthood is strictly a men's only club), what is it that is objectionable about a woman in a priesthood office? I agree that once a woman is a mother, her children deserve to be the undisputed top priority. If young mothers were burdened with the priesthood, the children would suffer. But what about unmarried women? Or married women who are unable to have children? Or older women whose children are grown? From a simply logical perspective it seems that these women have the human qualifications to hold priesthood offices if they have the organizational skills they require. Obviously, having a blanket rule banning women from the Priesthood is the simplest solution, but I think many women would make fine priesthood holders. Quote
Guest curvette Posted December 14, 2004 Report Posted December 14, 2004 Originally posted by Amillia+Dec 14 2004, 09:59 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Amillia @ Dec 14 2004, 09:59 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin--curvette@Dec 12 2004, 11:14 PM I have a better idea. Let's take "Praise to the man" out of our hymnbooks and stick to celebrating Christ's birth in December (even if he wasn't born then.) Will wonders never cease? I fully agree with you Curvette. Now we're really and truly sisters! Quote
Outshined Posted December 14, 2004 Report Posted December 14, 2004 Originally posted by Bro_West@Dec 12 2004, 07:19 PM I'm currently serving in our ward's bishopric. I'm so thankful for an inspired bishop who leads our ward. Today, he made a decision that I hope becomes a tradition in our ward and in many others.Next week, we will have our usual Christmas program, but our closing hymn will be Praise to The Man. What could be more appropriate for the Sunday before December 23, Joseph Smith's birthday?Of course, we join the rest of the Christian world in celebrating the birth of Christ in December, but we know that Christ wasn't really born then. Joseph Smith, on the other hand, was definitely born in December. And, we must never forget what another latter-day prophet, John Taylor, told us. Joseph Smith has done more for us than any person who ever lived in this world, save Jesus Christ.I hope we'll all take a moment to remember our beloved Brother Joseph this season. More power to you if that's what you have in mind. I won't pretend that celebrating JS's birthday somehow elevates him to Christ's level, nor am I offended at the subject matter.Added onto the end of your Christmas program, I doubt a reasonable person will hold against you one song about JS. Quote
Guest cjfigero Posted December 16, 2004 Report Posted December 16, 2004 I think the idea of singing praise to the man is wonderful. Joseph Smith should be remembered for all he did for our church, and at what better time than his birthday. Why not celebrate two people who have done so much for everyone at this time of year. Quote
StrawberryFields Posted December 16, 2004 Report Posted December 16, 2004 Originally posted by EmmaLeigh@Dec 14 2004, 01:06 PM Brother West where do you live?Making sure moving there isnt on your agenda in the future??? :) Naw, Not at all.I just think that putting such emphasis on JS the Sunday before Christmas is "Way Out There". Quote
Guest cjfigero Posted December 16, 2004 Report Posted December 16, 2004 I'm curious. Besides the obvious (belief that the priesthood is strictly a men's only club), what is it that is objectionable about a woman in a priesthood office? I agree that once a woman is a mother, her children deserve to be the undisputed top priority. If young mothers were burdened with the priesthood, the children would suffer. But what about unmarried women? Or married women who are unable to have children? Or older women whose children are grown? From a simply logical perspective it seems that these women have the human qualifications to hold priesthood offices if they have the organizational skills they require. Obviously, having a blanket rule banning women from the Priesthood is the simplest solution, but I think many women would make fine priesthood holders. Although women don't hold the priesthood like men do they still recieve all of the blessing of the priesthood without all of the responsibility. We are lucky to have men in our lives who are worthy priesthood holders, whether hometeachers brothers husbands or fathers. I personally love the fact that I can call on one of many of my brothers in the church for blessings. I am also glad that I don't have to have the responsibility that comes with it. I think that men are given the preisthood to be reminded that they need to serve where women serve more naturally without the need of the reminder. I may not agree with a lot of people my age who are pushing for women to have the priesthood, but I know that men have it for a reason. Quote
Outshined Posted December 16, 2004 Report Posted December 16, 2004 Originally posted by Strawberry Fields@Dec 15 2004, 09:19 PM I just think that putting such emphasis on JS the Sunday before Christmas is "Way Out There". "Such emphasis"? Singing one song at the end of sacrament? Quote
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