torn between my family and keeping the sabbath

[Guest mormonmusic]

You misunderstood me. I said you CAN pontificate. As in, it's okay. You can. Because, it has truth to it. (About your point of setting an example). What I tried to point out is that I can follow your advice of setting an example doing it the other way.

I never dismissed what you said out of hand. I just showed you that there is no right or wrong answer here like you tried to say. Just because we chose to go to the restaurant with family doesn't mean we abandoned God.

Breathe... I didn't mean to cause you to be upset.

I agree with this -- had we been constantly misinterpreting everything you said, restating arguments against statements you never made etcetera, there might be cause for a firm statement. However, not the case in this thread.

Back to the issue -- I think one factor that has to be considered is the emotional/mental set of the non-members involved, and the costs and benefits of the decision you ultimately make to resove the trade-off here.

In my case, my family already had anti-Mormon leanings given their evangelical and born-again Christian roots, as well as the steady stream of anti-Mormon propaganda from their own church members. If I punctuated their experience with decisions which seemed to isolate them from me, this would reinforce the perception we're a cult, isolating children from their roots and families. It would do nothing to set the example.

Remember when Nephi cut off Laban's head? There was a utilitarian argument at the root of it -- better that one man perish than a nation perish in unbelief. Two benefits in conflict, and Nephi chose to end Laban's life, although he didn't like it.

The benefits outweighed the costs in this case, and given my family's roots, I choose them time and time again over the Sabbath Day.

[Hemidakota]

It was not his own choosing for Nephi to kill Laban but the Spirit [ministering angel] telling him to carryout the act. If Nephi had his way, Laban would live to a drunken-stupor old age. :) He was coached beyond the veil to carryout this act. This is again, the same scenario, no different from the above story of Adam. Knowing Adam was a purist [black and white and no gray], he would have remained in the garden. What we are not aware for now is the full account of the record provided, there is more that is not being told to why Adam and who his coaching angel was. Same as to the Savior, even He was coached by an angel [suspect is Gabriel]. It was then the Savior chooses the atonement act. Even I at times, need to be coached to carryout a specific act. All of these brethren had a common pattern – they knew how to listen to the Spirit before making the final choice. This is the recommended path.

Now, can I hold a party on a Saturday vice Sunday? Yes! If there are means to carry out the same objective without loosing any spiritual loss, than go for it.

[Guest mirancs8]

thanks guys, this really helps. I would definately go with the saturday idea if it weren't for the fact that's when we're travelling/arriving so would not be possible. Will make sabbath friendly suggestions and fingers crossed the weather will be good (but this is England!) that way we can maybe just have a picnic on the beach. Will go with what my sister wants I think, it's her birthday and to force my values would only create bad feeling and if anything push my family away from church.

I just hope I can articulate how I feel to my Husband so as not to cause contention within our family and hopefully have him come along with us as a united family. But then is it wrong for me to expect him to change his view of the situation?!

OK, this adds a bit to what I said previously in my post. I didn't realize that your husband was not engaged in the conversation from the start. It is important that you speak to your husband about how you are feeling regarding this situation, and seek his advice to gain some clarity on the situation. He should be a part of your decision process as I would think it would make him feel a bit alienated. When we marry we cleave to each other... we are partners working together to do right by the Lord and help each other to reach for those things eternal.

“Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife: and they shall be one flesh (GEN 2:24 KJV).

If we don't keep the commandments such as keeping the Sabbath day holy we are diminishing the importance of that commandment. It's either you follow the commandments or you don't. It's not easy by any means I know. But in marriage your husband needs to be a part these decisions. I know it's your family and it so difficult when you are the only one keeping the Sabbath holy. But do keep this in mind (as I learned from my own mistake early on) that if you do it once they will likely say to you, "well what's the big deal? You came last time." Let's say the next time your husband says no we are not going to sacrifice our beliefs in following the commandments will you then cave to your family's pleas or will you stand by your husbands request? In the end he should really have a say in this decision. I'm not a man/husband but I would imagine it would be very upsetting that his wife would be so willing to be a Sabbath breaker.

I would like to refer you to an Article by James E. Faust from 1991. This is one of the articles I read when I first converted and it really gave me the clarity I needed to realize the great importance of keeping the Sabbath day holy.

Seek to bring forth and establish my Zion. Keep my commandments in all things. And, if you keep my commandments and endure to the end you shall have eternal life, which gift is the greatest of all the gifts of God. (D&C 14:6-7)

It's not only about not going out and shopping. No it's about what we should do on this day to bring us closer to our Savior Jesus Christ. These are things that you and your husband (children as well) can do together. The more you justify to yourself that it's no big deal the more you will be likely to do it. Talk to your husband and talk about the pros and cons of breaking the Sabbath and if it's really worth it. You may be able to work together to find a solution to the birthday dilemma. I can't tell you the number of times I have disappointed my family when it came to my observing the Sabbath. I can't wait till the day comes if I ever get married again and they find out they can't come into the Temple... ow yeah that will go over well... NOT! But in the end I know I am doing right by the Lord and that is what is important to me. I will have to answer for myself in the end as will they... I prefer to answer that I did keep the Sabbath holy.

“The Sabbath is a holy day in which to do worthy and holy things. Abstinence from work and recreation is important but insufficient. The Sabbath calls for constructive thoughts and acts, and if one merely lounges about doing nothing on the Sabbath, he is breaking it. To observe it, one will be on his knees in prayer, preparing lessons, studying the gospel, meditating, visiting the ill and distressed, sleeping, reading wholesome material, and attending all the meetings of that day to which he is expected. To fail to do these proper things is a transgression on the omission side.” President Spencer W. Kimball 1969

Your devotion should be first and foremost to your husband and your children. Talk about it with your husband, and look at what would be the right choice in this situation for your family. If need be you and your husband might want to have a sit down with your family to discuss the importance of keeping the Sabbath is for both of you. Also if you are open and honest to your sister I'm sure she would be very understanding. There's always another day you both can go together to celebrate.

I know the choice is not an easy one and I can imagine you feel very conflicted. My advice would be to look at the decision excluding your family's feelings and see what you would then decide to do. If you see that now the Sabbath surely takes priority well then your decision is right there before you. These are the times when we prove our strength in the Lord when we overcome these very real obstacles which run deep in our hearts.

[Guest mormonmusic]

If we don't keep the commandments such as keeping the Sabbath day holy we are diminishing the importance of that commandment. It's either you follow the commandments or you don't.

I've never bought into the either/or argument on this one. There are definitely times when you need to sacrifice obedience to one commandment to serve another one that is more important.

In this case, we have the "cleave unto your spouse" scripture, and the oft quoted scripture about bringing a sword among members of families. But on the other hand, we have scriptures that tell us to honor our father and mother.

You can't paint every situation with the same brush, and you do want to maintain positive relationships with family members.

It's not easy by any means I know. But in marriage your husband needs to be a part these decisions

Agreed. After you leave your mother and father, it's true that spousal interests should be more important. My wife sided with her parents's culture and beliefs a number of times in the early days of our marriage, and it alienated me and made me feel unimportant in our relationship.

However, this doesn't mean there isn't room to compromise. You can get his agreement on one issue, by promising to do better in another area in return. Think about what it would take to make him say "yes" because you're willing to do something incredibly important to him in a different area.

Edited May 7, 2010 by mormonmusic