Some Russian Leaders Propose Legalizing Polygamy.

[Outshined]

I don't mind being called Aristotle...but Aristotle being referred to as a "she" is incorrect.

Get used to it.

True! It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that polygamy is demeaning to women.

It doesn't take a "rocket scientist" to figure out that you're merely projecting your personal feelings on the subject.

Actually, the sisters can speak for themselves...when not intimidated into silence. And I do read...alot...and comprehend what I read...but my reading is not selective! I have read exactly what the sisters have to say about polygamy. History is past, and polygamy will not be an accepted practice in the future.

Oh, I love a conspiracy! And the sisters have spoken, which is why I called you on your silly claim. If you don't "accept" polygamy if it were commanded, that's your own problem. More putting yourself above God.

Snow's theory about my not being LDS is in fact, theory! And I never called the prophet a liar.

(That sounds like another theory. LOL)

Actually, you said polygamy was not of God. In fact, scripture and our prophets have said it was, so you are in effect calling them liars.

Untrue! I have made no such claim, and I have called no one a liar. However, those who falsely accuse me of the ridiculous prove who is guilty of telling falsehoods.

No "falsehood"; you said it was not of God, the prophet says it was.

False! Totally false...and you have no right to judge me.

Facts are facts. You deny that polygamy was of God, in spite of what God said, what the scriptures say, and what our prophets have said.

To understand Aristotle, or Mrs. A, it helps to read each and every word while trying to understand exactly what she means, which is pretty much what anyone should do when trying to understand anyone else.

For instance, Mrs. A. stated that:

"Latter-day sisters are not intimidated into accepting such a practice. Polygamy [as of now, in this day in age] is not of God; therefore, sisters [today] are not obliged to accept or support polygamy."

Hopefully it is now clear that Mrs. A. is speaking the truth, and why she keeps getting offended when people claim she said something she did not mean when she spoke.

Then she should make more sense in her posts instead of arguing for the sake of argument. If she only means it is not a command NOW, she needs to make herself clear.

So she agrees that it was of God?

[Ray]

<div class='quotemain'>

False! You have never lived under such a system, and so are bound by your imagination. You have no more insight on it than any man, and it was not "demeaning".

True! It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that polygamy is demeaning to women.

Perhaps you would care to explain why you believe polygamy, practiced righteously, would be demeaning to women.

And btw, I don't believe it would be, if practiced righteously.

[Aristotle]

"We are faced these days with many newspaper articles on this subject. This has arisen out of a case of alleged child abuse on the part of some of those practicing plural marriage.

I wish to state categorically that this Church has nothing whatever to do with those practicing polygamy. They are not members of this Church. Most of them have never been members. They are in violation of the civil law. They know they are in violation of the law. They are subject to its penalties. The Church, of course, has no jurisdiction whatever in this matter.

If any of our members are found to be practicing plural marriage, they are excommunicated, the most serious penalty the Church can impose. Not only are those so involved in direct violation of the civil law, they are in violation of the law of this Church. An article of our faith is binding upon us. It states, “We believe in being subject to kings, presidents, rulers, and magistrates, in obeying, honoring, and sustaining the law” (A of F 1:12). One cannot obey the law and disobey the law at the same time.

There is no such thing as a “Mormon Fundamentalist.” It is a contradiction to use the two words together.

More than a century ago God clearly revealed unto His prophet Wilford Woodruff that the practice of plural marriage should be discontinued, which means that it is now against the law of God. Even in countries where civil or religious law allows polygamy, the Church teaches that marriage must be monogamous and does not accept into its membership those practicing plural marriage."

Gordon B. Hinckley, “What Are People Asking about Us?” Ensign, Nov. 1998, 70

[Outshined]

Perhaps you would care to explain why you believe polygamy, practiced righteously, would be demeaning to women.

And btw, I don't believe it would be, if practiced righteously.

Exactly. I don't believe God put His children in a demeaning situation. I don't believe that Abraham or his wife were demeaned, nor any other who practiced it under His command.

[Ray]

<div class='quotemain'>

I don't mind being called Aristotle...but Aristotle being referred to as a "she" is incorrect.

Get used to it.

True! It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that polygamy is demeaning to women.

It doesn't take a "rocket scientist" to figure out that you're merely projecting your personal feelings on the subject.

Actually, the sisters can speak for themselves...when not intimidated into silence. And I do read...alot...and comprehend what I read...but my reading is not selective! I have read exactly what the sisters have to say about polygamy. History is past, and polygamy will not be an accepted practice in the future.

Oh, I love a conspiracy! And the sisters have spoken, which is why I called you on your silly claim. If you don't "accept" polygamy if it were commanded, that's your own problem. More putting yourself above God.

Snow's theory about my not being LDS is in fact, theory! And I never called the prophet a liar.

(That sounds like another theory. LOL)

Actually, you said polygamy was not of God. In fact, scripture and our prophets have said it was, so you are in effect calling them liars.

Untrue! I have made no such claim, and I have called no one a liar. However, those who falsely accuse me of the ridiculous prove who is guilty of telling falsehoods.

No "falsehood"; you said it was not of God, the prophet says it was.

False! Totally false...and you have no right to judge me.

Facts are facts. You deny that polygamy was of God, in spite of what God said, what the scriptures say, and what our prophets have said.

To understand Aristotle, or Mrs. A, it helps to read each and every word while trying to understand exactly what she means, which is pretty much what anyone should do when trying to understand anyone else.

For instance, Mrs. A. stated that:

"Latter-day sisters are not intimidated into accepting such a practice. Polygamy [as of now, in this day in age] is not of God; therefore, sisters [today] are not obliged to accept or support polygamy."

Hopefully it is now clear that Mrs. A. is speaking the truth, and why she keeps getting offended when people claim she said something she did not mean when she spoke.

Then she should make more sense in her posts instead of arguing for the sake of argument. If she only means it is not a command NOW, she needs to make herself clear.

So she agrees that it was of God?

Based on what she said, Yes, it was of God.

And btw, when someone says something, they don't need to state that they don't mean something else.

[Outshined]

<div class='quotemain'>

Aristotle says polygamy was not of God.

False! Aristotle and I, Mrs. A, state that polygamy IS not of God.

Then you need to get your story straight and stop playing word games. It gets old trying to talk down on your level.

Based on what she said, Yes, it was of God.

And btw, when someone says something, they don't need to state that they don't mean something else.

Cetainly they do when they are being deliberately obtuse. She never made herself clear on that even when it was being directly challenged. The onlt thing she was clear on is her hangups concerning polygamy and the fact that she would defy the prophet if it was commanded again.

[Aristotle]

Edited by Aristotle

[Ray]

<div class='quotemain'>

<div class='quotemain'>

Aristotle says polygamy was not of God.

False! Aristotle and I, Mrs. A, state that polygamy IS not of God.

Then you need to get your story straight and stop playing word games. It gets old trying to talk down on your level.

Based on what she said, Yes, it was of God.

And btw, when someone says something, they don't need to state that they don't mean something else.

Cetainly they do when they are being deliberately obtuse. She never made herself clear on that even when it was being directly challenged.

Go back and read it yourself, Outshined, to see that she said it IS not of God. It was YOU who stated that she said it WAS not of God, when she had said it ISN'T, so you owe her an apology.

[Outshined]

It may be too much to ask her to converse in a reasonable manner...

Go back and read it yourself, Outshined, to see that she said it IS not of God. It was YOU who stated that she said it WAS not of God, when she had said it ISN'T, so you owe her an apology.

I "owe" her no such thing. I've read and re-read her drivel, and can see her stance. She has said she would not obey such a command from the prophet.

[Ray]

<div class='quotemain'>

To understand Aristotle, or Mrs. A, it helps to read each and every word while trying to understand exactly what she means, which is pretty much what anyone should do when trying to understand anyone else.

For instance, Mrs. A. stated that:

"Latter-day sisters are not intimidated into accepting such a practice. Polygamy [as of now, in this day in age] is not of God; therefore, sisters [today] are not obliged to accept or support polygamy."

Hopefully it is now clear that Mrs. A. is speaking the truth, and why she keeps getting offended when people claim she said something she did not mean when she spoke.

It was clear before, but thanks for the clarification! LOL

Your statement, clarified:

"It is clear that Mrs. A. is speaking the truth, and why she keeps from getting offended when people claim she said something she did not mean when she spoke clearly."

- Mrs. A

It was clear to anyone who can read and interpret English, Mrs. A, but it wasn't clear to Outshined, so I was trying to help him SEE why he was having trouble understanding you.

[Aristotle]

Edited by Aristotle

[Ray]

It may be too much to ask her to converse in a reasonable manner...

<div class='quotemain'>

Go back and read it yourself, Outshined, to see that she said it IS not of God. It was YOU who stated that she said it WAS not of God, when she had said it ISN'T, so you owe her an apology.

I "owe" her no such thing. I've read and re-read her drivel, and can see her stance. She has said she would not obey such a command from the prophet.

Based on your track record, Outshined, I'm inclined to believe you have another misunderstanding, but I will read what she said if you will find and quote that statement.

[Outshined]

It was clear to anyone who can read and interpret English, Mrs. A, but it wasn't clear to Outshined, so I was trying to help him SEE why he was having trouble understanding you.

Oh boy, Ray wants to get into the personal insult game! Hold onto your hat, Nancy...

Just because you find yourself in agreement with the obtuse one doesn't make you anything special, okay? I suggest you get over yourself, and quick.

Based on your track record, Outshined, I'm inclined to believe you have another misunderstanding, but I will read what she said if you will find and quote that statement.

What "track record" is that Ray Baby? May we assume you have actual examples to offer instead of empty rhetoric? Sounds more like a little "sour grapes" action...

Let's see it.

The practice of polygamy is determined [now, in this age, today] by the Prophet to be unrighteous.

I think we all know that. And if it were reinstated, you have said that you would not accept it unless told by Jesus Christ himself. What does that say about your acceptance of the word of the Prophet?

History is past, and polygamy will not be an accepted practice in the future.

By the way, this is incorrect, as we've been told that it probably will be after the Second Coming.

[Aristotle]

Edited by Aristotle

[Outshined]

Aristotle and I obviously disagree about polygamy in the early Church. I do not believe it was "demeaning" or "misery" for anyone involved. They were living the higher law commanded by God, just as others had before them, and God makes no empty commands.

[Aristotle]

Edited by Aristotle

[Outshined]

False! No projection is necessary; the sisters can speak plainly for themselves.

They have, ma'am, and they defended it.

True! By your own admittance, you love to engage in Snow's conspiracy theories! LOL

False! I don't make silly claims. ;-)

The whole "demeaning" claim is, in my estimation, silly. And who doesn't love Snow's theories?

What part of "IF we are commanded personally by Jesus Christ to practice polygamy, we would" don't you understand?

Does that include being told by the prophet?

I don't put myself above God, nor beneath man.

I certainly hope not.

Actually, I said that polygamy IS not of God.

We agree on that. It WAS, but IS NOT NOW. Then yes, now, no. We are on the same sheet on that...

False! I have called no one a liar, except for those putting words in my mouth. ;-)

Scripture and our prophet have declared that polygamy IS not of God.

Then YES, now NO.

Facts are facts, and inuendo is inuendo.

And never the twain shall meet...

False! I stated that polygamy IS not of God, as per our prophet/scriptures.

Then YES, now NO...

I agree, polygamy IS not of God.

All together: Then YES, now, NO!!!

Glad we go that straight. B)

[Aristotle]

Edited by Aristotle

[Outshined]

So you'd accept the word of the prophet if he reinstated polygamy?

And yes, you do often play word games, mostly with semantics.

Man, talk about a thread getting off-topic...

[Amphiblitz]

On another board I frequent, we call exchanges like this "post count padding".

[Aristotle]

Edited by Aristotle

[Outshined]

On another board I frequent, we call exchanges like this "post count padding".

AHEM!! >cough!cough!<

ON TOPIC: Shanstress' comments fall directly into the actual topic! Russian government wants to legaklize polygamy because they've lost so many men to war. (Which is still incredibly sad)

[shanstress70]

So you'd accept the word of the prophet if he reinstated polygamy?

Ari, would you please answer this question of Outshined? First you said the only way you would practice polygamy is if Jesus Christ personally told you to do it.

Logically, that means that you would not do it if the prophet told you to.

Then you said, "Who said I would defy the prophet? Certainly not I."

Would you please answer this question with no silly word games? We're all curious.

[Outshined]

First she said she'd never accept it, then that she'd accept it if told personally by Jesus Christ, then (maybe)if the prophet said so (which is not the same as being told personally bt Jesus Christ).

It's that kind of thing that lends itself to misunderstanding.

She also has not addressed how a commandment she acknowledges was from God caused the women to be "demeaned." How can His commandments demean His children?

[Aristotle]

Edited by Aristotle