32 Killed At Va Tech

[JcDean78]

As for chasing down people who are mental. Please define mental? Would you say it is very subjective? There have been calls to take action against people who deny Global Warming... perhaps they could label me mental for that. Or how about the fact that I advocate conceled carry laws for firearms? And also am a supporter for them in the class room? I have been called nuts by the loony left for those stances. So please lets no go there, or else the thought and PC police will come after us all.

How could this have been prevented? Well first, ARM THE STUDENTS AND TEACHERS!!! This guy should not have been allowed to get those firearms but somehow they are saying it was indeed legal. If he had not be able to get them through legal channels, he would have found other ways... they always do. So if we can agree that this guy would have gotten a gun anyway, then the gun laws would not change anything.

Arm the teachers and arm the students. All those who want to carry the ability if they go through a VERY detailed background check and must take classes in firearm safty and handling. One student in that entire building with a firearm other that cho would have stopped this whole thing.

Besides... if I were a criminal who would I rather rob? Somebody who is armed or somebody who is not? How about a shooting spree? Am I going to go to a place that prohibits firearms or am I going to go to a place where there is a chance somebody will have them? In most recent shooting sprees they have been in "gun free zones", thats one huge reason schools are such easy targets. When people try this in public places such as even a shopping mall, they dont get off more than a few rounds before somebody is firing back.

If you think "Oh nose, this is not the Wild West!" well guess what, the states with conceled carry permits have lower crime!!! When Florida adopted the laws for carry permits, the anti gun wackos howled that police would be dying in the streets and gun crimes would go through the roof. In reality where the rest of us live, gun crime went down. Crime in general went way down and now Florida is a safer place to live. Same results in the rest of the country too in those states who enacted such laws. Imagin if this was nation wide, crime would drop so drasticly it would not even be funny.

Carry permits are the only answer.

Here is a GREAT article on the subject.

http://www.townhall.com/columnists/column....2007&page=1

[rosie321]

JC,

I agree with you gun control wasn't the answer here obviously. They tried that and the only one armed was the gun man. Thats what gun control usually does unarms the innocent and arms the criminals. Also as is typical, after disarming the school they did nothing to increase other means to provide safety for their students. Their safety was meaningless. As was shown miserably in this situation..

The idea of going after people unfairly or because they are a little different concerns me also . But I don't think it is wrong to be keeping our eyes open and identifying potential risks to protect ourselves. The extreme cases, such as the shooter should be identified even just within the leadership and security of that school. This guy had serious issues going on, for some time that was more than someone being a little odd. He had some serious disturbances which raised eyebrows. Concerns like that should be addressed quickly not dismissed. He should have been better monitored, considering all the concerns raised so he did not create harm to himself or others.

As for chasing down people who are mental. Please define mental? Would you say it is very subjective? There have been calls to take action against people who deny Global Warming... perhaps they could label me mental for that. Or how about the fact that I advocate conceled carry laws for firearms? And also am a supporter for them in the class room? I have been called nuts by the loony left for those stances. So please lets no go there, or else the thought and PC police will come after us all.

How could this have been prevented? Well first, ARM THE STUDENTS AND TEACHERS!!! This guy should not have been allowed to get those firearms but somehow they are saying it was indeed legal. If he had not be able to get them through legal channels, he would have found other ways... they always do. So if we can agree that this guy would have gotten a gun anyway, then the gun laws would not change anything.

Arm the teachers and arm the students. All those who want to carry the ability if they go through a VERY detailed background check and must take classes in firearm safty and handling. One student in that entire building with a firearm other that cho would have stopped this whole thing.

Besides... if I were a criminal who would I rather rob? Somebody who is armed or somebody who is not? How about a shooting spree? Am I going to go to a place that prohibits firearms or am I going to go to a place where there is a chance somebody will have them? In most recent shooting sprees they have been in "gun free zones", thats one huge reason schools are such easy targets. When people try this in public places such as even a shopping mall, they dont get off more than a few rounds before somebody is firing back.

If you think "Oh nose, this is not the Wild West!" well guess what, the states with conceled carry permits have lower crime!!! When Florida adopted the laws for carry permits, the anti gun wackos howled that police would be dying in the streets and gun crimes would go through the roof. In reality where the rest of us live, gun crime went down. Crime in general went way down and now Florida is a safer place to live. Same results in the rest of the country too in those states who enacted such laws. Imagin if this was nation wide, crime would drop so drasticly it would not even be funny.

Carry permits are the only answer.

Here is a GREAT article on the subject.

http://www.townhall.com/columnists/column....2007&page=1

[shanstress70]

The idea of going after people unfairly or because they are a little different concerns me also . But I don't think it is wrong to be keeping our eyes open and identifying potential risks to protect ourselves. The extreme cases, such as the shooter should be identified even just within the leadership and security of that school. This guy had serious issues going on, for some time that was more than someone being a little odd. He had some serious disturbances which raised eyebrows. Concerns like that should be addressed quickly not dismissed. He should have been better monitored, considering all the concerns raised so he did not create harm to himself or others.

I don't want to act like I have the answers, bc I'm clueless about what could have been done. Although I'm in agreement with you guys about how harmful it is to disarm the good guys.

But what do you propose they could have done with this guy? Yes, he exhibited worrying signs. But they made him go to counseling, which obviously didn't help. Should they have kicked him out of school? Talk about a lawsuit! I'm not saying they shouldn't have... just saying what the school admin was probably thinking. Did anyone at the school have the authority to have him committed? I don't think so. I'm thinking only immediate family members can do that. As far as him not being able to afford mental health, I don't think that's true. I know that in my state of NC, everyone gets mental health care regardless of their ability to pay, through the health dept. I would imagine each state has a similar program. You can't force someone to get help if they don't want it.

[JcDean78]

Well that is just the thing, there is nothing they could have done. Though the guy should not have been able to perchase a gun for many reasons IMO but they are telling us it was legal.

I do think they had grounds to remove him from school though because of his stalking and creating a hostil environment. That could have been the boiling point and sent him over the edge sooner.

There is nothing 100% to prevent such things. The only thing they could have and should have done is allow students to carry, it is the only chance those kids had.

[rosie321]

Its too late for this guy. I really agree with you that ultimately if someone is really determined they can do anything but I don't believe everyone falls into that category. Some can be stopped. I don't want the few extreme examples causing the deaths or suffering of innocent victims. Nor do I want them to be able to control everyone from fear of what they might do. If I'm going to die let it be from trying to do whats right.

I think the shooter points out the need to maybe start closing the loopholes and changing our public mindset. People need to be able to provide for their own safety and realize there are people out there who want to do harm. Don't wait until after your robbed to lock your doors. Prepare yourself and protect. In cases like this where the average person isn't allowed access to that information or the proper means to protect themselves then it should be made clear that responsibility is taken on by leaders, administrators, security, police, etc. They should be the ones making sure people are safe.

Why do we have school adminstration in place if we will not give them the power to act in the best interest of their students? This guy screamed time bomb. If they were afraid before of lawsuits and firings, I wonder what they're thinking now?

If they had been able to legally kick him off campus, why shouldn't they be able to get a restraining order of some kind to keep him away from campus? Alerts should then be given to campus security or police to keep their eyes open for him. As a society we need to get back to prevention and stop expecting everyone else to do it. (I know keep dreaming these are the last days)

Where are our leaders? Who is raising the "standard of liberty"?

The judges should be more proactive in their decisions. Seeing the troubled signs don't they have the power to mandate help or have him commited until no longer a threat? They should be able to put in place restraining orders.

As to the comments of the media. I don't understand why they are spending so much time on it either. Its encouraging it. The media isn't offering any solutions. Except gun control I suppose. What they are doing is encouraging it and seeing who can outdo this guys efforts.

It just seems like there's more that we can do then wring our hands and say why all the time. Or its going to happen again anyway. Thats thinking is just wrong to me. Even the appearance of putting a stop to this may make the next person think before trying it.

People get more upset when they lose their cable or internet for a time than for stuff like this.

Well that is just the thing, there is nothing they could have done.

But what do you propose they could have done with this guy? Yes, he exhibited worrying signs. But they made him go to counseling, which obviously didn't help. Should they have kicked him out of school? Talk about a lawsuit! I'm not saying they shouldn't have... just saying what the school admin was probably thinking. Did anyone at the school have the authority to have him committed? I don't think so. I'm thinking only immediate family members can do that.

I do think they had grounds to remove him from school though because of his stalking and creating a hostile environment. That could have been the boiling point and sent him over the edge sooner.

There is nothing 100% to prevent such things. The only thing they could have and should have done is allow students to carry, it is the only chance those kids had.

.