New

[Guest mamacat]

hello ~

i am new to the LDS church. since almost my first encounters with missionaries, i have felt such a strong sense of its reality. i felt the spirit grow and expand in my life, as though i were lifted way up, by a power i cannot describe. my heart and soul are filled more and more as the days go forward, and i know that there's something in my life now that was missing before, that i recognize with certainty, and an immense sense of grace.

so, i love the book of mormon, joseph smith, the word of wisdom, and all of that, but.....

attending sacrament meetings and sunday meetings is something else entirely different. i feel unwelcome and unhappy when i attend on sundays. i love the sacrament, and that is the reason i continue to attend. but since my baptism, i've had almost entirely negative experiences with the church itself. of course my heart is strong, with the presence of the holy spirit, and i understand that my relationship is primarily with God...but still....

i feel very sad and dejected about the experience i've had in the church thus far. i was thinking that perhaps it was just me, that i was misperceiving, or misunderstanding the dynamic there, but not long ago, i had reason to attend an Episcopal service. i was surprised at the kindness and warmth and love i felt there, the opposite of what i feel at the LDS meetings.

i understand that this isn't the same as the strength of the spirit i feel in my heart from the Mormon gospel; but i can't seem to understand why attending the LDS services, and interacting with LDS people is so difficult and painful.

i would be very grateful for advice or insight on this matter. thanks very much.

[BenRaines]

momacat,

I have attended the LDS church in many places around the world and have never experienced what you describe. I have heard others describe the same type of experience. Please share, in general terms, perhaps state or country you live in.

Are you outgoing? Everywhere I have lived when someone new comes in to the church they seem to be almost overwhelmed with people around them and the attention.

Please share more.

Ben Raines

[Guest mamacat]

momacat,

I have attended the LDS church in many places around the world and have never experienced what you describe. I have heard others describe the same type of experience. Please share, in general terms, perhaps state or country you live in.

Are you outgoing? Everywhere I have lived when someone new comes in to the church they seem to be almost overwhelmed with people around them and the attention.

Please share more.

Ben Raines

[mom42]

I'm so sorry to hear what you're going through. I completly understand what you are feeling. I've been an active member of the church my whole life and I've lived in Provo, Utah in the same ward for fifteen years. (utah my whole life) I was welcomed with open arms the minute we pulledin the drive way. I raised my children in this ward and grew spirtually in this ward then one day they spilt the ward bounderies. We were put in a differant ward, it was hard but I knew I needed to try to make it work. I NEVER in my life have felt so lonely, so sad, so unoticed and unneeded. I was given important callings, but no matter how hard I tryed I felt invisible, I even had one calling where I never got called or was given an assigment. If my neighbor wasn't there I'd sit alone in Relief Society. I cryed often. I had a child (15 years old) who was an outgoing person, liked by everyone. Was popular at school, involved in everything. When they went to this ward they were completly ignored, I know I was in class with them. In the three years we lived there they maybe got a contact three times, and it took a month to get the first one. They later became inactive, and was always a very active child. After three years we moved, Just a few block away in another stake. It was an answer to many prayers. We had more contact in the first month in our new ward that we had the whole three years in that other. We lived here now for a year and I feel like the life in me is coming back. I'm so happy!!! I feel noticed and needed all the time. I too know the gospel is true and don;t know what i'd do without it in my life. If it wasn't for my testimony I don't know what would of happened to me. It's so amazing how you can live in the same neighborhood and be in three differant wards and from one ward to the other the people can be worlds apart. I wish I knew what to tell you, for me starting over and moving(we moved for other reason too)changed my families life, but thats not the always the answer. I hope my experience has made me a better person and more aware of others around me. I say pray alot and keep trying, maybe reach out to other new members. I knew the people in my ward were good people that just didn't know. I pray things will get better for you, don't give up.

hello ~

i am new to the LDS church. since almost my first encounters with missionaries, i have felt such a strong sense of its reality. i felt the spirit grow and expand in my life, as though i were lifted way up, by a power i cannot describe. my heart and soul are filled more and more as the days go forward, and i know that there's something in my life now that was missing before, that i recognize with certainty, and an immense sense of grace.

so, i love the book of mormon, joseph smith, the word of wisdom, and all of that, but.....

attending sacrament meetings and sunday meetings is something else entirely different. i feel unwelcome and unhappy when i attend on sundays. i love the sacrament, and that is the reason i continue to attend. but since my baptism, i've had almost entirely negative experiences with the church itself. of course my heart is strong, with the presence of the holy spirit, and i understand that my relationship is primarily with God...but still....

i feel very sad and dejected about the experience i've had in the church thus far. i was thinking that perhaps it was just me, that i was misperceiving, or misunderstanding the dynamic there, but not long ago, i had reason to attend an Episcopal service. i was surprised at the kindness and warmth and love i felt there, the opposite of what i feel at the LDS meetings.

i understand that this isn't the same as the strength of the spirit i feel in my heart from the Mormon gospel; but i can't seem to understand why attending the LDS services, and interacting with LDS people is so difficult and painful.

i would be very grateful for advice or insight on this matter. thanks very much.

I'm so sorry to hear what you're going through. I completly understand what you are feeling. I've been an active member of the church my whole life and I've lived in Provo, Utah in the same ward for fifteen years. (utah my whole life) I was welcomed with open arms the minute we pulledin the drive way. I raised my children in this ward and grew spirtually in this ward then one day they spilt the ward bounderies. We were put in a differant ward, it was hard but I knew I needed to try to make it work. I NEVER in my life have felt so lonely, so sad, so unoticed and unneeded. I was given important callings, but no matter how hard I tryed I felt invisible, I even had one calling where I never got called or was given an assigment. If my neighbor wasn't there I'd sit alone in Relief Society. I cryed often. I had a child (15 years old) who was an outgoing person, liked by everyone. Was popular at school, involved in everything. When they went to this ward they were completly ignored, I know I was in class with them. In the three years we lived there they maybe got a contact three times, and it took a month to get the first one. They later became inactive, and was always a very active child. After three years we moved, Just a few block away in another stake. It was an answer to many prayers. We had more contact in the first month in our new ward that we had the whole three years in that other. We lived here now for a year and I feel like the life in me is coming back. I'm so happy!!! I feel noticed and needed all the time. I too know the gospel is true and don;t know what i'd do without it in my life. If it wasn't for my testimony I don't know what would of happened to me. It's so amazing how you can live in the same neighborhood and be in three differant wards and from one ward to the other the people can be worlds apart. I wish I knew what to tell you, for me starting over and moving(we moved for other reason too)changed my families life, but thats not the always the answer. I hope my experience has made me a better person and more aware of others around me. I say pray alot and keep trying, maybe reach out to other new members. I knew the people in my ward were good people that just didn't know. I pray things will get better for you, don't give up.

hello ~

i am new to the LDS church. since almost my first encounters with missionaries, i have felt such a strong sense of its reality. i felt the spirit grow and expand in my life, as though i were lifted way up, by a power i cannot describe. my heart and soul are filled more and more as the days go forward, and i know that there's something in my life now that was missing before, that i recognize with certainty, and an immense sense of grace.

so, i love the book of mormon, joseph smith, the word of wisdom, and all of that, but.....

attending sacrament meetings and sunday meetings is something else entirely different. i feel unwelcome and unhappy when i attend on sundays. i love the sacrament, and that is the reason i continue to attend. but since my baptism, i've had almost entirely negative experiences with the church itself. of course my heart is strong, with the presence of the holy spirit, and i understand that my relationship is primarily with God...but still....

i feel very sad and dejected about the experience i've had in the church thus far. i was thinking that perhaps it was just me, that i was misperceiving, or misunderstanding the dynamic there, but not long ago, i had reason to attend an Episcopal service. i was surprised at the kindness and warmth and love i felt there, the opposite of what i feel at the LDS meetings.

i understand that this isn't the same as the strength of the spirit i feel in my heart from the Mormon gospel; but i can't seem to understand why attending the LDS services, and interacting with LDS people is so difficult and painful.

i would be very grateful for advice or insight on this matter. thanks very much.

[Guest mamacat]

thank you for your interest BenRaines ~

i live in the United States. the missionaries approached me the day after christmas, and my first meeting attendance was new years day. i was baptised a few weeks later.

since then, the negativity of my experiences is both subtle and overt. i was excited to participate in the baptism for the dead in the temple, overwhelmed actually, at my first temple experience. but it was quite darkened by my interview with my bishop. he asked numerous times if i were conducting several promiscuous relationships. not just one, but several. i was shocked to the point of numbess that he focused on this subject for such length. after i had answered him numerous times that i was not involved in any way whatsoever in anything even closely resembling a promiscuous relationship, he told me a story about another woman whom he knew to be lying in her temple interview, though he allowed her to attend anyway. so i understood that he did not believe me. i have felt very uncomfortable with him ever since. esp as this was only about a week after my baptism, for which i underwent many interviews, discussions and talks with lots of different elders and members of the priesthood. i was feeling so renewed after my baptism, and then to have my bishop express such faithlessness in my worthiness, and lack of respect for me and my honesty, crushed my newfound joy from my baptism in a harsh way, the effects of which i still feel.

he would not give me my member number in january after my baptism, and told me he would give it to me at a later time. i asked many, many times for it, different people, and it was never given me. finally my bishop called me a week after my birthday to say happy birthday, and i asked him if i could have my member number. he finally gave it to me, reluctantly it seemed, and then told me, in a very patronizing way it seemed, that i should consider that a birthday present. i've only just received it this week.

in meetings people would often give me looks of distaste and loathing, and walk out of their way to avoid me. through all of this i also had somewhat of a time conflict on sundays due to a family situation. i finally took this as an opportunity to change my meeting attendance to another ward in the same building at an earlier time. i thought, or desired perhaps, that i would not feel this same derision in a different ward. but it's almost worse, though in subtle ways.

one of my favorite areas about LDS is the strong focus on family and support of children. i was so pleased to have my son, who will be 5 yrs old soon, attend primary. and though i feel i can process and pray and try to accept the discord i feel directed at me, it felt like my heart being ripped apart to see it happen to my son. he was ok in primary in the first ward that we attended, though i felt more insulted and unwelcome there than anywhere else, as i had to attend with him. but in the new ward that we attend, in addition to the unwelcome and cold reception i receive there, i saw my son receiving the same treatment in primary, and i was crushed beyond belief. he attended a class the first sunday we participated in the different ward, and i helped his primary teacher with the activities in the class. i thought it had gone quite well. then we attended a festival for the primary children, and he seemed well received and loved the experience. but at the following sunday primary class, there seemed a deliberate attempt to exclude him. i asked him to sit in the group of children whom he had joined in his previous primary class. this particular teacher shook her head "no" at the primary leader, who then placed him with another group. then the groups partitioned off to perform a coloring activity. the teacher of his current group formed a circle of the children from which she excluded my son. he asked her what he should do, and she ignored him...standing there, while the other children sat in the circle and began the activity. he looked at me in desperation, saying, 'what should i do mama?' and i said, wait a minute and ask her again, so he did. the teacher wouldn't look at him, and ignored his question. that this was happening was totally incomprehensible at the time, so as he kept asking, in a more and more desperate voice, what i do i do mama, i kept saying, ask your teacher what she wants you to do. this exchange between us became louder, and it was impossible that the entire room, with several groups of children did not hear what was going on. but his teacher ignored him to the fullest extent, refusing even to look at him. he then began to cry, and still she sat with her closed circle of children and did not acknowledge him at all.

at this point it occurred to me that what was happening was deliberate, so i took his hand and we left. i was quite at a loss about what to do. i felt such a very cold reception from the entire ward that i didn't feel that there was anyone with whom to discuss this. i'm still very new to the church and to the ward. very few people speak to us when we attend scarament meeting.

what we do now is attend sacrament, then return to our home and watch LDS videos and read the book of mormon for kids. my son doesn't understand why we don't attend primary anymore, and neither do i really. yesterday he asked me why the people dislike us so much. i didn't know how to explain. i didn't realize that something could hurt my heart this much.

these are a few of our experiences.....but as i said, i feel the presence of the holy spirit and Jesus Christ in my life as nothing else and never before....i feel them in my heart and soul, and feel an innocuous joy in my heart that is unyielding and profound. i also love that my son will grow up amidst the strong principles of this church, and i feel this that this ideal for him. so i know that i will endure these temporal ordeals, yet, my heart aches so much at the distress these things cause us...i thought that someone here might help us understand. thank you again.

[Guest mamacat]

hi Mom42 ~

thank you so much for your reply. it helps knowing that you understand. i'm sorry about my first reply in this thread, i don't know how i did that.

i'm happy to know that you feel the spirit in such a strong way as well, even in the face of these kinds of hardships.

feeling your support is so wonderful. i'm glad that you found a good place, that sustains you.

much love to you and your family,

mamcat

[Aphrodite]

mamacat I am so sorry for the way you have been treated. Reading your story made my blood boil. How dare these supposed christians treat you this way? Ben is right though, this is not typical of the church as a whole in my opinion. This is my advice to you:

I would seek out and speak to your stake president or one of his counsellors about your experience with the Bishop. He is totally and utterly out of line. I'm disgusted by his behaviour. But if the 'highest' person in the ward is giving you no support, go to the Stake. Those primary leaders should not be allowed to call themselves christians with a pathetic attitude like that. Ooh Im so angry!

Second, I would, in this case perhaps, seriously consider attending another ward. I know you have switched once already, but maybe you need to go to one in a completely different building, away from this one and all to do with it. Sometimes its necessary. When my parents were divorced my Dad still lived in the same town but did not feel he could attend the same close knit ward as My Mum, that we had attended our whole lives. So he went to the one in the next town even tho he didnt live in the ward boundaries. He was welcomed with open arms and also met his now wife. The stake president attends that ward and was more than happy to authorise my Dad to be there. He's now the YM pres. So I'm sure a similar situation could work for you.

Have you thought about why the members are treating you this way? From what you've said, it seems quite likely that the members have heard things about you that are not true and are shunning you because of it-i.e, having lots of promiscuous relationships with men???? Just a guess but I would ask the people you have been having problems with outright what their problem is with you and try to get to the bottom of it for your own sanity by the sounds of it.

It does ###### when members act little better than children in some situations. My now ward split 10 years ago and for some unknown stupid reason the ward who now dont meet in our building 'hate' the Luton ward. We are always hearing about how the dunstable ward cant stand the Luton ward, even tho they used to be a part of it. It could be because they then had to meet in a school until they had their own building built. Silly and petty, but true.

When I went to uni I started attending the ward there. They also had 2 wards that met in the same building. I asked one of the bishops which ward I was in-he didnt know, neither did the other one. They never really bothered to find out so I eventually just picked one. I recieved no support whatsoever. I sat alone in sacrament meeting as I didnt know anyone. No one bothered to find out who I was or even say hello. I was a member, but I was new to the ward and still needed support. Then one of the YSA girls started giving me dirty looks and whispering and laughing in front of me like a 5 year old. She then started spreading rumours about me to all the girls in both wards. (Turns out she thought I was after a bloke she was interested in. I wasnt, but he eventually befriended me and was the only friend I had in those 2 years there). I repeatedly asked for home and visiting teachers and never got any in 2 years. Then, a year in to my stay the bishop called me in to his office and said I was attending the wrong ward-theyd only just bothered to look at my address and realised. I refused to move, saying I had repeatedly asked this in the beginning to make sure it didnt happen. In the end, I started going home to my home ward at weekends as I hated the ward so much. I tell ya, I can understand why some people go inactive even if they know the church is true because of the horrible sunday experiences.

mamacat, you have had a rough start. Stay true to the gospel-it is still true and will bring you so much happiness. Pray for guidance on what to do. Speak to the stake. The gospel is perfect-unfortunately, the members are not.

[rosie321]

hi Mom42 ~

thank you so much for your reply. it helps knowing that you understand. i'm sorry about my first reply in this thread, i don't know how i did that.

i'm happy to know that you feel the spirit in such a strong way as well, even in the face of these kinds of hardships.

feeling your support is so wonderful. i'm glad that you found a good place, that sustains you.

much love to you and your family,

mamcat

Glad you are here and that you made the post. Seems like you needed to. After all your awful experiences in your ward this site will seem as heaven to you. There are many wonderful LDS brothers and sisters on this site as well as many non-LDS friends. Know that your ward is not indicative of the worldwide church or how Christ would want His Church to be acting.

Don't be sorry for your post. I felt the same way on my first post. Why did I do that? It was my last hope though. I was so burned out and disgusted with everything. I just spewed out everything that came to mind. I felt a great discrepancy in the church also, amongst other things. But as a result of that first post I have come back a number of times, have been able to see things differently and have found ways on how to deal with situations and my comprehensions have increased.

Not sure quite what to specifically tell you to do about how to counteract this unrighteous behavior.

Going to the stake president would probably be the best idea. If that doesn't work I believe it would be ok just to keep going up the leadership lines. Maybe they will allow you to go back into the other ward you were in or will help address the problems in your current one.

The treatment you are recieving is not Christlike nor should it be tolerated in Christs church. You recognize that it is wrong and may have been placed there to help people get back on to Christs path. Keep standing tall and proud as God's child.

With your heart in the right place who knows what good may come about.

[Guest mamacat]

dear Aphrodite ~

i so appreciate your kind response to my situation. thank you for sharing your experience and highlighting my thoughts about the truth of the spirit. the things you have said, your support and generosity have helped tremendously. i know i should discuss my concerns with someone in the church; it's just that at this moment i feel a sense of rejection from the entire church body in my area, and a vulnerability to the derision i feel from it. i feel very strong in spirit, but not strong in absorbing any more negativity from the people in the church, esp as they have now directed it at my son. i don't want to have to process anymore of it for a while, as it feels too overwhelming at the moment.

as for your question ~

Have you thought about why the members are treating you this way? From what you've said, it seems quite likely that the members have heard things about you that are not true and are shunning you because of it-i.e, having lots of promiscuous relationships with men???? Just a guess but I would ask the people you have been having problems with outright what their problem is with you and try to get to the bottom of it for your own sanity by the sounds of it.

in the last ten years the only relationships i've had were with my now ex-husband, which was one of extreme emotional and physical abuse, and after he filed for divorce, a relationship with a man who was a friend, whom i had considered marrying, though he ended the relationship very soon. since then, almost a year, i have not dated, nor have i had any type of physical relationship with anyone.

i've only lived in this city since 2005, and i don't have any friends here. i don't understand why members of this church would spread such rumors...esp the bishop. i really would think that if he had had such concerns that he would have expressed them before my baptism, not a week after. i was counselled so thoroughly before my baptism about the promises that i would be making as i entered into the baptismal covenant, and about the redeeming nature of baptism. i was happy to accept these conditions, such as the word of wisdom, chastitiy before marriage, et al....as a matter of fact, i was already practicing all these things, for quite a long while, before even discovering the lds church. i discussed all these things thoroughly with church members before being baptised. so it's with great bafflement that i ponder the bishop's demeaning words, just a week after being baptised. he did attend my baptism as well.

additionally, i understand the humanity that permeates our condition as incarnates of this earth. however, isn't baptism supposed to be a renewal, the start of a new way of life, in the light of Christ and the spirit? it seems very harsh, and renders much of what i was told about baptism untrue, if one gauges one's experience by the behavior of church members who would wreak such judgment and ill will toward a new convert. such behavior seems to negate all that i was told about the nature of baptism. why should someone convert, only to experience such negativity from follower's of Christ?

and not only that, but to extend it to a child, a 4 yr old, who has nothing whatsoever in his innocent life to provoke such treatment. that is something i honestly cannot comprehend. as i said, i tried to absorb it and understand it as perhaps something that i was supposed to endure for some reason, but seeing my son suffer such ill will is too much for me justify. i really would think that those of such a strong church and belief system as LDS would be above hurting a child in this way. so i remain very disappointed in this respect as well.

but anyway, thank you so much for having this dialogue with me, and allowing me to express my sadness at this. i know that these temporal things will not stand in the way of my relationship with the spirit....and in some sense it has almost made my faith stronger, as i know that what i know of God is true, even in the face of such opposition. i love what Rosie said ~ "Keep standing tall and proud as God's child".....thank you for that. i would love expressing more of the positive things that my LDS experience has conferred upon me, and i will soon. i was just feeling at such a loss about some of these things, that i felt the necessity of seeking some kind of understanding here first.

thank you again for your sharing your time and wisdom,

much love from mamacat

[StrawberryFields]

Maybe I am just different but I would go directly to the bishop and talk to him about the way he has been acting and explain that he needs to get control of his members of his ward as well. If it is not likely that you can pick up and move a change needs to happen within your ward and it needs to happen quick. It is then his responsibility to make it known to the leaders in the ward that there has been a mistake, he can do this in a meeting he has with them. Once the leaders know there can be a trickle down effect and possibility a change.

Also the problem with just making a move is that this could be on your membership record. This ward owes you a great apology. If you were to first go to the Stake President the bishop may hold the embarrassment he will have in this against you.

Fist and foremost you need to dispel this rumor it has the potential to hurt you for a very long time.

I wish you all the best in this. It isn't fair that you even need to deal with something of this nature but people are human and unfortunately this mistake has hurt you. Again I would suggest that you hit this head on, you have nothing to lose IMO.

[Guest mamacat]

thank you also Rosie for your reply. i am grateful for you kindness as well. i wasn't referring to my original post though, but my first reply in this thread, wherein i quoted Ben Raines, but added nothing in response. Mom42 replied to that post. that was my first attempt at responding to a post, and i didn't intend to quote what benRaines had said, nor did intend to post that. i don't know why it appeared as it did.

but thank you for expressing your thoughts at my frustration. as i mentioned to Aphrodite, i do wish to express more of my positive LDS experiences soon. these are much closer to my heart and fill me with so much more joy and happiness, that i try to focus on these way more often than the other stuff. including situations that i have not expressed here either. i will return soon to do so.

i would love spending the entire day perusing these forums, there is so much love and light here....i feel very blessed to have found this place.

love and blessings,

mamacat

[miztrniceguy]

mamacat,

i agree with aphrodite and suggest you talk to your stake pres, and see about going to a completely new building.

it's sad how some members treat others.

miztrniceguy

[StrawberryFields]

Just about the worst thing about members of the church are the self-righteous...I personally can't stand em...but I know that they have been blind sided but their own righteous living.

[Guest mamacat]

hi Strawberry Fields ~

thanks for those insights and suggestions. as it is, i feel quite numb from all of this right now. admittedly, i am afraid to talk to my bishop, as i still sense such hostility from him. i honestly can't determine why this ward rushed me so much to be baptised, so quickly, only to chastise me indefinitely for things unknown to me. i suggested that i perhaps should wait for my baptism, in order to become more familiar with the Mormon scriptures, as well as contemplate further the depth of my repentance, and embrace more the meaning of my being baptised. but they all insisted, dramatically almost, that i was so ready, so full of the spirit, and so prepared for baptism.

so my confusion arises from this as well....it renders my distress that much more confounding, in that my bishop continues to treat me in this derogatory fashion. i emphasized in our temple interview that of course he was mistaken about his assumptions. i was thrown so totally off balance by that, that i was quite unsure of myself for a long time.

i feel a very low sense of self esteem these days, esp as i ponder the days before i began attending LDS church. yet i also feel such a sense of well-being from my association with the scriptures and my experience of the holy spirit. so it is somewhat of a condundrum. each sunday i feel a deep nausea at the thought of attending church, but i try to breathe deeply, and thank God for the experience anyway, and for the privilege of participating in sacrament.

my confirmation was on the day of our stake conference, at our church, so i was confirmed in the presence of the entire stake. why would they allow me to do this, if they felt such apprenhension about me? i don't feel a sense of kindness or accpetance from any of them though....thus my repeated statement that i am afraid to talk to them.

i suppose i should...it never occurred to me that doing such a thing would be feasible. but hearing from all of you here has caused me to rethink this. i'm sure that through prayer and meditation that i will arrive at an appropriate action. it does help to discuss this here, so much! i didn't even realize how much this was weighing on my heart till now.

ao again, i very much appreciate all of your kindness, support and suggestions.

you too, miztrniceguy. :)

love, mamacat

[mom42]

Mamacat,

I just cryed when I read your experiance. I have never heard anything so sad. You are an amazing woman, you inspire me with your faith and determination to live the gopel and not deny the feelings you feel. I KNOW your Heavenly Father is so aware of you and your precious son and I'm sure he's sad that his sons and daughters are treating you this way but your day is coming I'm sure if you can just hang in there. You are going to make an incredible leader some day. You could be the one that could make a differance in someones life because of your faith and this experiance. So many people become inactive because of things just like this. I am so in awe of you, that you keep going. I feel so bad for these people, they have so much to answer for you on the other hand are doing eveything right. As hard as it may be keep smiling at these people, kill them with kindness, you may be the one to change their hearts. Your Heavenly Father will be with you and direct you. Keep a prayer in your heart as you go to these meetings and hopfully soon things will turn around for you. I will be praying for you.

KEEP INSPIRING, YOR AMAZING!

thank you for your interest BenRaines ~

i live in the United States. the missionaries approached me the day after christmas, and my first meeting attendance was new years day. i was baptised a few weeks later.

since then, the negativity of my experiences is both subtle and overt. i was excited to participate in the baptism for the dead in the temple, overwhelmed actually, at my first temple experience. but it was quite darkened by my interview with my bishop. he asked numerous times if i were conducting several promiscuous relationships. not just one, but several. i was shocked to the point of numbess that he focused on this subject for such length. after i had answered him numerous times that i was not involved in any way whatsoever in anything even closely resembling a promiscuous relationship, he told me a story about another woman whom he knew to be lying in her temple interview, though he allowed her to attend anyway. so i understood that he did not believe me. i have felt very uncomfortable with him ever since. esp as this was only about a week after my baptism, for which i underwent many interviews, discussions and talks with lots of different elders and members of the priesthood. i was feeling so renewed after my baptism, and then to have my bishop express such faithlessness in my worthiness, and lack of respect for me and my honesty, crushed my newfound joy from my baptism in a harsh way, the effects of which i still feel.

he would not give me my member number in january after my baptism, and told me he would give it to me at a later time. i asked many, many times for it, different people, and it was never given me. finally my bishop called me a week after my birthday to say happy birthday, and i asked him if i could have my member number. he finally gave it to me, reluctantly it seemed, and then told me, in a very patronizing way it seemed, that i should consider that a birthday present. i've only just received it this week.

in meetings people would often give me looks of distaste and loathing, and walk out of their way to avoid me. through all of this i also had somewhat of a time conflict on sundays due to a family situation. i finally took this as an opportunity to change my meeting attendance to another ward in the same building at an earlier time. i thought, or desired perhaps, that i would not feel this same derision in a different ward. but it's almost worse, though in subtle ways.

one of my favorite areas about LDS is the strong focus on family and support of children. i was so pleased to have my son, who will be 5 yrs old soon, attend primary. and though i feel i can process and pray and try to accept the discord i feel directed at me, it felt like my heart being ripped apart to see it happen to my son. he was ok in primary in the first ward that we attended, though i felt more insulted and unwelcome there than anywhere else, as i had to attend with him. but in the new ward that we attend, in addition to the unwelcome and cold reception i receive there, i saw my son receiving the same treatment in primary, and i was crushed beyond belief. he attended a class the first sunday we participated in the different ward, and i helped his primary teacher with the activities in the class. i thought it had gone quite well. then we attended a festival for the primary children, and he seemed well received and loved the experience. but at the following sunday primary class, there seemed a deliberate attempt to exclude him. i asked him to sit in the group of children whom he had joined in his previous primary class. this particular teacher shook her head "no" at the primary leader, who then placed him with another group. then the groups partitioned off to perform a coloring activity. the teacher of his current group formed a circle of the children from which she excluded my son. he asked her what he should do, and she ignored him...standing there, while the other children sat in the circle and began the activity. he looked at me in desperation, saying, 'what should i do mama?' and i said, wait a minute and ask her again, so he did. the teacher wouldn't look at him, and ignored his question. that this was happening was totally incomprehensible at the time, so as he kept asking, in a more and more desperate voice, what i do i do mama, i kept saying, ask your teacher what she wants you to do. this exchange between us became louder, and it was impossible that the entire room, with several groups of children did not hear what was going on. but his teacher ignored him to the fullest extent, refusing even to look at him. he then began to cry, and still she sat with her closed circle of children and did not acknowledge him at all.

at this point it occurred to me that what was happening was deliberate, so i took his hand and we left. i was quite at a loss about what to do. i felt such a very cold reception from the entire ward that i didn't feel that there was anyone with whom to discuss this. i'm still very new to the church and to the ward. very few people speak to us when we attend scarament meeting.

what we do now is attend sacrament, then return to our home and watch LDS videos and read the book of mormon for kids. my son doesn't understand why we don't attend primary anymore, and neither do i really. yesterday he asked me why the people dislike us so much. i didn't know how to explain. i didn't realize that something could hurt my heart this much.

these are a few of our experiences.....but as i said, i feel the presence of the holy spirit and Jesus Christ in my life as nothing else and never before....i feel them in my heart and soul, and feel an innocuous joy in my heart that is unyielding and profound. i also love that my son will grow up amidst the strong principles of this church, and i feel this that this ideal for him. so i know that i will endure these temporal ordeals, yet, my heart aches so much at the distress these things cause us...i thought that someone here might help us understand. thank you again.

[BenRaines]

Sorry for all the questions and no reply yet but I am trying to get a grip on this type of behavior in a ward when a new member is baptized. Where in the US is this? I have lived in California, Utah, Nevada, Florida and out of the US and never witnessed this type of behavior. I want to make sure I don't move there that is for sure.

Ben Raines

[anniem]

That is one of the saddest stories i've heard for awhile, momacat. i'm impressed that you've hung in there. Is the relief society president someone you might be able to talk to? She would keep a confidence and try to help you navigate this situation.

[Vanilla]

*Hugs* for you Mamacat. I experienced this kind of treatment as a pre-teen after moving into a ward where most of the families had lived in the same houses and neighborhoods for 10 or more years. The kids had all attended primary, school and other activities (tee-ball, swimming and dance classes) together for their entire lives. I was clearly an outsider and treated as such. I too had an interview with my bishop that went something like yours, only mine was for me to get my Patriarchal blessing. I remember walking home with my mother after that interview and in anger telling her that I had been through enough and was finished with the church. The minute we walked in the door my mom called our Stake President who told her to bring me to his office right away. After talking to him I felt better, but my situation in my own ward never changed. Thank Heavens we moved shortly after that and I was able to go to a "normal" LDS ward.

A good friend once told me something that I will never forget. "The Church is perfect, the members are not". I stayed because of the love and support I had from my family. The fact that you are staying active shows that you are an incredible woman with a very strong testimony. Don't give up....the church and the blessings that come from membership are wonderful. I agree with Strawberry Fields, schedule an appointment with the Bishop and make sure that he understands how you perceived your interview with him. Give him the chance to explain and/or apologize, and if that doesn't happen, take it up with your Stake President.

Good luck and always remember that you are a daughter of our Heavenly Father and that He does know who you are, what you are going through, and that He loves you!

[Guest mamacat]

oh my goodness....well, just finding a place such as this, with the love that you all have shown, is more than i expected as an answer to my prayer. i was overwhelmed with the loving kindness i felt in your words. i know that there is a design inherent in all the events that we encounter in our lives, and i'm sure that this trial is part of that design as well. perhaps it was to allow me to connect with the amazing grace that is here. :)

i really do love sharing ideas, thoughts and love in this medium, and i searched for quite a while for an LDS message board to inhabit. i don't know why i didn't discover this one until i feeling such an ache in my heart...but it may be for that precise reason ~ in order to speak from the honesty of my heart, not necessarily of the challenges i encountered, but more of the faith and love that i know that LDS is all about that has sustained me. doing so has reinforced this even further. so i am grateful to all of you for allowing me that.

interesting, because immediately after making my first posts here, i was reading a book to my son called Who's Your Hero, llustrating some gospel stories and how to emulate the actions of the people of God. the very first story was about Nephi and how he never complained! how he took each opportunity to improve the situation, and to ask for guidance in approaching the situation with what intention God had for him and his family. well my face was flushed and i felt some reproach, as i considered whether my intention here was simply to complain.

in my defense of myself, lol, i was quick to protest, that no....i really did wish to seek advice and understanding in how to make our interaction in the church more positive. yet i still feel that complaining was indeed part of what i had done. however, i must admit that it relieved my heart a tremendous amount to be able to speak openly about this in this format. and i feel that i was given this forum at the time that i found it, for this purpose.

Mom42, your words filled me with joy. i felt my entire spirit lighten when i first read them, and my heart felt soothed and softened. thank you so much for offering such compassion and sympathy. and Vanilla, thank you too for sharing your experience and reminding me of the love and the truth of Heavenly Father. in answer to BenRaines, i live in texas, but i certainly don't wish to discourage you from exploring this big ol' state!! about relief society president, that's a strange story as well. i haven't had much involvement with relief society, though i was anticipating it so much! such a new concept to me as well, i love the idea of the sisterhood working and sharing together. women need support from each other more than ever i believe. however, i find myself more in the realm of primary these days, as my babe needs me to stay with him for a while. i did receive a letter from a relief society sister asking to make an appointment for a home visit, but after i tried to contact her, and mentioned to my bishop that she had contacted me, i received a call from another member telling me not to contact her, but to arrrange a meeting with home visiting teachers instead. i thought it strange at the time, but not so much, in the context of everything else. but talking to relief society president might be an appropriate option, anniem, thank you for that suggestion. i certainly feel much more comfortable with that, at least at present, than anything else. i admit, i feel rather weak and timid about all this, and very reluctant to make any waves whatsoever. but again, there is something so strong in my heart, that tells me that this is good, that spirit guided me in the this direction, and i feel a great emptiness at the thought of abandoning my newfound Lds spirituality.

i am anticipating sharing the wonderful ways that this spirituality has permeated and transformed my life. feeling the strength from God and the power of the holy spirit in my life, and esp the love of Christ, is the most phenomenal miracle that i've known. and again, i'm so grateful that my experience has brought me here.

love and blessings,

mamacat

[Guest mamacat]

well i was reading another thread a moment ago, and i was struck by this quote of joseph smith', though i know must have heard and/or read it quite often now...

“While I was thus in the act of calling upon God, I discovered a light appearing in my room, which continued to increase until the room was lighter than at noonday, when immediately a personage appeared at my bedside, standing in the air, for his feet did not touch the floor. "

because one thing that remains utterly vivid in my heart and mind is the day that i was invited to the lds church. and i promise, there was a light such as this surrounding me. the events of this day seem otherworldly in some sense well.

so here's the story...

it was the day after christmas, and i was feeling sad at the way our christmas had turned out. so i took my babe and our puppy out driving, to get some fresh air and do a few errands. it was a beautiful day, drenched with bright winter sunlight. and as i was driving, i began thinking of the sad things, of a friend's sadness, and an email i had written about that, mentioning Jesus Christ and the kingdom of heaven. as i my thoughts turned to this email that i had written on this day, the brightest, luminous light suddenly infused my car. i literally felt the energy lighten up around me, and my spirit lift as though a soft wind had taken it and freed it from all gravity. this light filling my car was of a fine and higher vibration than the sunlight...and just now, reading the words of joseph smith ~ "which continued to increase until the room was lighter than at noonday" ~ i thought, oh my that's it, that's the light i felt that day!!....before i realized that i was comparing my experience to his....and really i'm not, it's just that was the thought that rushed into me, unconsciously so, the moment i read his words!

so, as i was driving, and experiencing this light, which filled me with such joy, that i was crying with an ethereal kind of happiness, my thoughts turned to a mormon author and how sustaining her faith was for her...thinking i should mention her to the friend i had emailed earlier about Christ. i was not far from my apartment at this point. so it was with this ethereal light surrounding me and my senses, and thoughts of the mormon faith -- about which i knew absolutely nothing -- that i turned into the parking lot of my apartment complex.

i sat in my car for a few moments, feeling kind of tired and drained, relishing a few quiet moments as my babe was sleeping in his carseat, wishing i could avoid some of the things that the day seemed to contain. as i sat there, i noticed across the parking lot some missionaries on their bicycles. i had seen some missionaries there before and had tried to avoid talking to them. so i was exiting my car, extracting my sleeping babe from his car seat, the missionaries rode over to my car. as i saw them, i thought, what now, and in a second the thought was in my head that, funny, i was just thinking about mormons....oh my gosh they're going to talk to me...what should i say....and then they were there, asking me to go to church with them. and i just let go of every conscious thought i had, and then heard myself thinking, why not?, and simply saying 'sure' out loud. we all seemed somewhat stunned and silent for a moment.

and i looked in their faces and their eyes and became intensely aware again of that supernatural light filling the area around us -- surrounding them....surrounding me...my body felt light with it, as though we were all floating in this superfine, gossamer light. my consciousness seemed to be on an entirely different wavelength, and the missionaries were glowing with this light as well.

at this moment, i realized that their presence was also functioning as a barrier to an enounter with another person that i had wished to avoid that day. as he approached us, it seemed that the missionaries on their bicycles, emanating this light, comprised a physical barrier between this person and me. i felt my spirit lighten tremendously, again, and suddenly, it occured to me that these elders, with their glowing light...well, i thought, they were like angels! i felt ensconced in such a profoundly strong and spiritual protective, soothing light, as though i were being lifted up and held in the arms of the strongest spirit...far away, and shielded, both emotionally and literally, from all that had weighed so much on my mind and heart.

i was filled with this lightness and happiness that i had real angels surrounding me at that moment. from that moment i referred to them, in my mind, as my 'mormon angels'...haha...(i wasn't that familiar with the 'latter day saint' terminology, and it took quite a while before i could say all that in one phrase...)

so the person left, and i stood there in awe of the missionaries, the spirit that i perceived in them, that i had not encountered elsewhere, this beautiful light, and the love i felt surrounding us. they asked if they could visit us before sunday, and again i said sure, something i never imagined myself doing. i allowed very few people into home, esp people i didn't even know!

i watched them ride away on their bicycles, stunned and astounded at the events of the day, the supernatural light, their presence there, just as i was pondering the mormon faith, the protective shield i felt with them....and the fact that i was going to have real angels visiting my home in just a few days!!

what a day that was! lol, it was amazing. and more events such as this continued to occur in the next few days...not as dramatic....but still...

and i have come to recognize this protective shield as characteristic of the priesthood in general. i have pondered the priesthood and its magic (for lack of a more appropriate description) to great extent, and again, i anticipate discussing this further. suffice it to say that i felt the power of the priesthood of that day, and i know it to be a miraculous and powerful gift bestowed by God....it is His hand working through the priesthood members, and i feel so very privileged and honored to have this gift in my life now.

it has enhanced my life in such profound ways, and i continue to feel and ponder its miraculous nature.

well, as must be evident, my thoughts and words about these subjects are abundant and overflowing, so i'll rest with this for now, and attend to my babe.

thanks for reading my words, and allowing me to share here...

love, mamacat

[Guest mamacat]

well, as i ponder the prospect of attending sacrament meeting tomorrow with dread....and prayer....the thought occurs to me that i'm obsessing over the most trivial things....

like, what should i wear???? will they hate my dress, will i choose the wrong color of clothing, jacket and skirt...is my clothing perhaps inappropriate??...

before my first attendance i tried to find information on what etiquette is expected, what appropriate attire, etc....looking through the book Mormonism for Dummies at the bookstore answered most of these questions. i always wear skirts and stockings to LDS church, to be respectful, though i can't remember the last time i wore stockings. i invested a lot, for me, in stockings, skirts and shoes and clothing, in order to show respect at the meetings. in proper clothing for my son as well.

so now as i sit here in a semi-panic over what i will do wrong tomorrow, i am thinking....why am i so distraught about this?

when i first began my asscociation with LDS i asked, scrupulously, all these questions and more. i asked whether my everyday dress, and church attire, were appropriate as a mormon, my makeup, etc....they assured me that these were fine.

i asked if politics and political beliefs had any bearing on being LDS and was told in no uncertain terms that they did not. i think that the current war in the middle east is wrong, and i asked if this was ok for LDS and they said of course.

i showed them my myspace page....asked if having a myspace page was ok -- they said of course...and shared various myspace pages of their friends with me. nothing wrong whatsoever with my myspace page, they said.

the word of wisdom was so awesome to me....i asked if being vegetarian was ok with LDS, as i have long considered my body a temple....veggie's fine they said. i have followed every point of the word of wisdom -- no alcohol, ciggies, drugs, illegal or otherwise, even pharmaceutical and over the counter i try to avoid -- for about 10 years....except that i didn't know about the hot drinks part, though i was desirous of ending my caffeine intake. the moment i learned about coffee and tea, i stopped them altogether. and caffeine as well, almost as immediately. and i was grateful for this.

but still, i sit fretting and distressed that it is something that i am doing, wearing, eating, drinking, or something, that is so wrong....that will cause tomorrow to be as disastrous as before. i keep going over in my head what of these things i have done wrong to cause all the discord that i've experienced, what wrong i will inadvertantly do tomorrow....

a confession ~ the day that my son was rejected from primary, i was almost unable to breathe with untenable feelings....and i suppose rather than return home and fume, i decided to go to the coffee shop and get a de-caf latte. though i know this was wrong, it was soothing and calming for me, and helped me adjust my perspective -- at the time. i know better now, that the appropriate thing to do was to pray, and to ask God for soothing and perspective. i did learn from that.

anyway these feelings are washing over me atm, i'm sitting here all stressed and worried about all these things....thanks for letting me express them here. it's a healing exercise.

wishing everyone love and light,

mamacat

[Guest mamacat]

again, if this appears as complaining, i apologize....i'm trying not to complain....just trying to make today and tomorrow be good, for my babe esp. so i wish good days, sans complaints, for us all.

[mom42]

Mamacat, you never need to apologize for anything!!! That what this site is for.

I'm feeling for you and your fears and concerns for tomorrow. I wish so bad I could be there for you in person, but since I can't I'm with you in spirit. I want you so bad to feel safe and needed and feel that you belong. The gospel is suppose to be just that.... a place to feel safe, safe from the world and critisim and persecution.....but I know somtimes thats not the case. The people are not perfect, I know I probably at times have been one of those people, it's hard to say. ( I hope not though)

Just want you to know I'm think about you often, and feel your pain. This afternoon my husband and I went to the temple and I put your name in.... "Mamacat" I figure Heavenly Father knows who you are. lol

I'll be waiting to hear how things go. Once again hang in there never give up. Your Father in Heaven will be right beside you.

[Guest mamacat]

dear Mom42 ~

wow you are so so kind...thank you so much for this sincere message of support and love. i think everything will be ok, i think i should simply relax about some stuff a little more. :)

i'm sure that things will work out with my church issues....my personal life isn't in the best shape either, but it's quite a lot better than it used to be. and i do believe it is due to the guidance of the spirit -- i've prayed for this direction for such a long time, i feel that my LDS experience, and all its attendant issues, are actually answers to my prayers. we'll see where they continue to take me.

but really, what a fine lady you are...i know that you have your own challenges in your life, and i am impressed with your fortitude and strength. i've thought of posting in your thread about your daughter, but i don't wish to say anything that will sound too wayward....more than anything, i think that God gives us our children, and our families, and that we should do everything we can to love and support them. your daughter seems determined to love her baby, and what could be more important than that? there is a special connection between babies and their mothers, that is irreplaceable. when God gives you a baby, He also gives you the strength and the power to love, nurture and protect that baby, if only you will allow Him to guide and work through you. and what more amazing mother could yor daughter have than you? your love for her is awesome to behold, and with your strong foundation of love and experience, i'm sure that her baby will know a life filled with love and happiness, as will you, with this new life in your heart.

it can seem daunting i know, but i believe that babies are a gift from heaven, and that God provides the love and strength necessary to provide for them, if you let Him, even in challenging circumstances.

thank you again so much for your kindness here Mom42, it's a blessing.

love, mamacat

[mom42]

Mamacat,

Thank you so much! Your words of encouragement and support mean so much, I need them because this situation is not good at all and seems to get worse everyday. These two kids come from two differant planets, they aren't and never will be on the same page so I'm constantly at my wits end because I have no say in anything. The only thing that gets me though is the temple, prayer, scriptures and knowing my Heavenly Father is with me so on those days when I feel like the worlds falling in around my family I try to remind myself all things are possible though him......and then I feel peace,..... until the next emotional breakdown, then I start all over. I try to make my moto "I CAN DO THIS"

Thanks again for responding, I've been wondering how you're doing cause you haven't responded for a few days. Good luck and hang in there.