blackknight5k

Please do, I'd like to know what this book is and what it's about. I have a friend who's really into the occult. He reads on everything from voodoo to shamanism and beyond. He has a little alter and some other weird stuff in his home. He believes in demons, ghosts, and whatever. Strange enough, he also claims to be related to Harold B Lee but has never been a member of the church. I have to say that he is plagued by spirits bothering him. Everywhere he lives is haunted - and I don't mean "haha that creaking is creepy" but more stuff flying off the shelves. At one time I did something that one of them didn't "like" and it annoyed me until I left. It started with feeling like a cold spirit went through my body, then tried to push me out of the house. I honestly believe with Joseph Smith said about evil things existing, but to not talk about them and let them be and they will stay out of our lives. He isn't the only one who does this in his group of friends, all of them seem to be pestered by spirits at all times. I'm the only one who doesn't. Are they lying/making it up? I don't think all of them are, I know he isn't for sure, but a few of them probably are.

Dude...I think I own more RPG systems than I have religious books at this point. The only problem I feel with PnP RPGs and games like 40k is that there is so much time you devote to them (if you're the GM). Right now I feel like my time would be better focused in other areas - however at times I miss sitting around the table rolling dice and pretending to be an axe swinging Dwarf of awesomeness. Right now my wife and I have a newborn and my 5 year old needs attention. I have a new job opportunity arising and a million other things going on that trump gaming. Maybe one day I will feel that it's ok to have a "game night" at the local game store, but right now my wife and I just play some easier games we have around the house that are quick and easy to play. Don't beat yourself up over it man.

The bolded part is the important part - no man can know every law in their state. The bishop, in this case, has just been pulled into a VERY serious situation with very complicated laws dictating what he is and is not suppose to do. He can't go jump the gun and call the police right away, he NEEDS the legal aid supplied by the helpline. It's kind of like what they teach you in most concealed carry courses, if you have to shoot someone in self defense your FIRST call should be to your lawyer. If the shooting was in public, more people are probably calling 911. If you are at home in your boxer shorts then you let your lawyer contact the police and meet you at your house. Whenever anything deals with the law, lawyer up.

So as far as I remember being taught, the gift of Tongues was a gift that seems to mostly help us communicate in another human language and is usually a story that a missionary tells us of "well I wasn't doing so great in the language, but this one time..." kind of story. However, I was listening to Past Impressions Episode 22 - Kirtland Temple and they said that Brigham Young spoke in tongues during the dedication. They talked like this was a common thing in the time, and I did some googling and they said that he was speaking the language of God or something. When did this stop and why? Are there any more recent accounts of an apostle or prophet speaking in Tongues?

See if your wife can go back there with you? Then you can have her "help"? I know at least 1 guy who did that.

Answering the OP - I did the same thing, don't sweat it. I feel the spirit just fine now and have been ordained a priest and will soon be an Elder this summer. If you really really really are worried, go talk to your Bishop. What matters is you're back and our Heavenly Father is happy with you.

I have a bit of experience with spirits at my friend's house - he had one that would knock stuff off tables, pick up and drop stuff, move things, etc. Before you give the whole "maybe it was the wind" thing I have seen this with my own eyes and there is no way to explain it otherwise. Anyway, this spirit followed him from home to home for a few years and it took a while to click that he was the one who was, for the lack of a better word, "haunted" and not the individual homes. So, I go over to his house a few times until I realize that weird stuff wasn't happening anymore and I asked him about it. He said "oh, I figured out who it was and he left me alone". He then proceeds to tell me about a friend he had a long time ago. See, my friend had cancer when he was in his 20's that was suppose to kill him. He made good friends with another guy who had cancer and was in the same situation. They made a pact together that if either one of them died that the person who died would do everything in their power to let the other person know if there was something beyond this life. As you've probably guessed, my friend's friend died of the cancer. Since his death my friend has been "haunted" by this spirit that would not leave him alone, and did everything in their power to let him know that there is something beyond this life. I can't remember exactly what the spirit did that finally "clicked" in his mind - it involved a game piece or card that they would play together all the time falling out of a book or off a bookshelf or something. I have done some research tonight on the spirit world - we keep our opinions, personalities, and beliefs when we enter the spirit world. As I stated before, there is no sign when we enter the spirit world that says "THE MORMONS WERE RIGHT" - spirits who didn't accept the word in our life can still choose not to accept the word. I suggest listening to this Podcast from the church - Mormon Channel QA: Episode 26 - The Spirit World - it's very informative.

And we're also taught that those who are "in" spirit prison don't have to convert in the spirit world, therefore there could be tons of those souls who are in the spirit world who don't believe the apostles, prophets, or the rest of us. It's not like there is a sign when you enter the spirit world that says "HEY GUYS MORMONS WERE RIGHT!" I was actually talking to my wife about this today, I asked her as a former catholic what they believe happens after you die. Her response was "you go straight to heaven". So I said, well what would they think if instead they were just...well...here but not in the body. She said they would probably think they were in purgatory. So, put yourself in this person's shoes. You were a good Catholic, you did what you needed to do, why are you in purgatory? You don't think you'd be "gnashing your teeth"? Now this guy comes and says "hi I'm so and so and I want to tell you why we're here and not in heaven" - well you could either say "Ok tell me" or say "no, let me tell YOU why we are here - blah blah blah blah purgatory" Bottom line is, why would we be missionaries in the afterlife if there was no one to convert?

I don't think you've payed attention to the last years - the bar has consistently been set higher: Read a book campaigns push for higher education no smoking or drinking, it's bad for you and causes cancer use protection against STDs when picking that woman up from the bar The problem is most people DON'T CARE - Do you know how many people I work with who are otherwise "educated" (holding up to and including doctorates) that refuse to read any book now? They think that they are done and all they want to do is watch the idiotbox when they get home and spew out the pollution that is fed to them by the "main stream media" (see cnn, fox news). They just care about what's new and "exciting" today. Yesterday it was the conflict on the Ivory Coast, today it's the Earthquake in Japan. You can't let those people decide for YOU how to live YOUR life. Also - these same people who would be voting and comprising the "majority" have neither read nor care about the constitution or how it was formed. They form their opinions on kneejerk reactions to rare events. It sound to me like you have one pet issue that you want to force through no matter what, and since the "in place" means are not working for you so you're grabbing at whatever straws you can. Stop thinking about "what good this can do" and start thinking about "how can this be abused and used to help the tyrants who abound".

Yes, because the constitution sure does protect the government from INFRINGING on my 2nd amendment rights to bear arms - let me just run down to the hardware store and get a thompson submachinegun, a suppressor, and ... OH WAIT. Most politicians don't care about the constitution anymore, we're living in that day where it's hanging by a thread...well maybe not by one thread but not many more than one. More examples - Permits to have a protest or other large FREEDOM OF SPEECH event. 1st amendment zones (hahahahaha) The 4th amendment's confusion - enough said The 3rd amendment is good though, right guys? I mean, don't want those british soldiers in our houses during peacetime.

Look around you at our culture. The general population is too ignorant to vote on issues, instead they will vote on whichever side has the best PR campaign. As was stated above, you have to watch out for the wolves. Take for example our religion - what if there was a bill to ban practice and worship of mormonism. We are a minority, therefore with a successful PR campaign they could get that voted in, and it appears like in your world we would be in trouble. Your system is even more flawed than our current system. Keep in mind that those who follow the true word of God are in the minority, and the majority are severely influenced by Satan. I have prayed extensively on the government's place in our world and how it fits into our lives and insinuating any less is personally insulting to me, like you are saying "I'm right and God approves" however he does not.

up until July of 2009 I was borderline alcoholic - I drank nearly daily and 2 or 3 times a week I would get completely utterly drunk. I was going to work hungover, I'd go see my LDS family hungover, etc. etc. hungover. In July of 2009 I quit cold turkey, I have not had a drop since then. It isn't easy to quit cold turkey, but you have to keep your goal in mind. What's better, eternal life, marriage, and happiness or a little bit of tipsy tonight? Ignore the ads, don't look at them. Don't walk through the wine, beer, whatever isle. Don't go into the liquor store PERIOD. I can honestly tell you I'm tempted every single time I go into the grocery store, but my willpower overcomes the craving. Put these things out of your mind and find something else to think about. Lastly, I'm going to be frank here. If you can't quit drinking and your boyfriend can't keep "breaking the law of chastity by himself" then you two do not need to get married in the temple in august. My wife and I have been working long and hard for us to be able to get sealed in the temple and we still can't go until March of 2011 at the earliest and the fact that the two of you have told your bishop of these issues and he's going to sign off on this makes me more than a little uncomfortable.

Church isn't about the people, it's about you and God. Just go to get closer to our Heavenly Father. My dad had a hard time getting back into church for this same reason, but after fighting through it he and my step-mom were able to get sealed in the temple a few months back. He is happier than I can ever remember him being and that helped push me into activity. Keep going, don't give up.

It wouldn't hurt to go to the bishop, though it may be a little embarrassing. I honestly don't see it as fornication or breaking the law of chastity. It's good you recognize you need to hold back on the makeout sessions. However, i do suggest you go see a doctor about it. Masturbation of that frequency for an extended period of time can cause some issues like what you're experiencing.

Again, your "reason" is influenced by the way you were raised. In ancient Rome it was "reasonable" to go off to a foreign land and kidnap and rape their women until they accepted their fate and became the man's "wife". Oh yeah, they murdered the men to - two things that we've all established in this thread are "evil". I'm not saying that an athiest can't be good or have a moral code. In nature, all actions are "neutral" unless labeled good or evil by someone's opinion.

Please show me where I said that anyone who doesn't believe in god is inherently evil? I know plenty of athiests and they do believe in some sort of "natural good" or moral code, however that "natural good" or moral code was defined by the society we live in. I believe that man, as created by God, is inherently GOOD. Also, saying that it would be "defined by reason" is illogical because our reason is also defined by our society.

I don't see how my logic is fallacious - without Religion or Society labeling something as "evil" then it could be labeled any other way by a different society or religion. We believe that these things are "evil" because our society and religion says they are evil, however in another they might not be. If you raise a child in the middle of the wilderness with no societal influence then how would they define "good' and "evil"?

The list provided seems to break down as defining the following things as inherently "evil: rape stealing murder assault slander fraud Looking at the list, all of us and even those people at the Markkula Center for Applied Ethics have been raised in our current society together. That society has been shaped for thousands of years by religious influence. If you create a hypothetical "godless" world then I believe each and every one of those things could be seen as "good" or "neutral" by societies with different roots from our own. Nature itself favors rape, assault/murder, and deception (encompassing the rest of the things in the list) for the continuation of the individual organism to reproduce, thus passing on its genes into the gene pool. Rape obviously would further that basic need most immediately, as a male organism of the species would simply scout out as many fitting females and mate with them without their consent and then they would have their offspring, thus furthering the genes of the male species along with the female. Believe it or not, there are people in our society today who think rape should not be seen as a crime but necessary to the continuation of our species and a more "natural" way to reproduce. I am not one of these people, I think rape is a horrible evil. Murder/assault is seen in nature when males of the pack challenge the alpha, or a pack moves in on another's territory to steal their resources. Societies around the world as a whole have been doing this since Cain killed Abel for his flock, and there are those out there who would also argue that this is just the natural order of things. Through the Book of Mormon it is taught to defend ourselves, but do not go on the offensive. When we defend ourselves the power of God is with us, but when we attack we do so by our own strength alone. Those who believe in no God would obviously come to the conclusion that defense and attack would both be by their strengths. One may argue that tactically it is easier to defend on your own ground than attack in unfamiliar ground, but I didn't come here to argue the art of war. Again, in closing, I reiterate that even the most die hard athiest of our time has been shaped by a society which, in turn, has been shaped by religion. There is no way to say that a society shaped by no religion would define the same acts as "good" or "evil" that our society has come to have. You can say until your face is blue that "you can define your own morals on your own", however YOU are a product of the society you are raised in. No matter how much you hate it, it is ingrained in you.

Then who would define it?

Love the Sinner, hate the sin is what I was always taught. I can't and try not to judge - aside from homosexual activity, I think I've done everything else to violate the law of chastity in my life before now. Note: I have fully repented of all of this.

Well, at this point we will just have to respectfully agree to disagree, my friend.

Well, in my religious beliefs it is not that simple. It's not just one area of translation, it is a sin in the OT and in the NT, it is against the law of Chastity as defined by our church leaders. Also, I feel as if it is a sin - which you may not understand. I have no doubt in my mind that it is a sin, I just want to know why my brothers grew up to be this way.

That would be my desired solution as well, however it seems that now it's an "all or nothing" thing within the political world and no one will consider just removing "marriage" from legal definition. I have a large amount of gay family. I have 2 gay brothers, my mom has had lesbian relationships, one cousin is a lesbian, I have a gay uncle, and multiple cousins beyond "first cousins" that are lesbians - and this is all on the same side of my family (mom's side). Not counting anyone outside of immediate family, that is 5 out of 20ish (25% - 20% if you don't count my mom) people in that one side of my family that are either gay or bi. This makes a rather compelling argument to the whole "gay may be genetic" theory. That being said - I do believe that homosexuality is a sin (as the majority of the people here agree to) and I believe that it is one of those sins that has been since Adam and Eve, though I have no doctrine to support it. I do, however, want my family to be happy in this life. I don't want them to be hurt because of their sexuality, nor do I want them to live a miserable lonely existence on this earth. I wish I could ask God what was up, why my brother who refused to play "boy toys" and only wanted to dress up in dresses and play with barbies since as far back as I remember - and to get a clear concise answer from him. I have prayed about this, and before I hit submit on this post I prayed with this question. But, I don't think I'll ever know the answer in this life, but maybe in the next.

Placing yourself inside an Athiest's shoes, I don't really understand how they can believe in any sort of "natural good". If there is no God and we are all just a mass of cells with no purpose, then there would be no good or evil because there would be no define it. In a hypothetical world with no god(s) then if 2 humanlike beings are in the woods and one wants to take what the other has and bashes them over the rock, how could you define that as "evil" or "bad" without basing that off of religious beliefs we've had for thousands of years?

This sounds very interesting and I would love to help in any way, and I'd also love to see the finished project. Though I was baptized in my childhood, I can't say that I've been an active Mormon until the last year or so. I have done a ton of research on the different issues with the way people see the church and mostly I think it comes down to 2 things the fact that the hard core antis will not sit down and take a non-biased look at the church. Now, that being said, a lot of members will not do that either. However, I have done so for many years and found that the church is a wonderful thing, very different than any other religion out there and very special for that reason. I do not believe that Joseph smith could have written the Book of Mormon from scratch in the time frame he did, there are too many arching and intertwining "story lines" and "plots" in the book for it to be just written from scratch without re-writing over and over again. Anyway, I'll end my rant here and see you in the other areas of the forum.