A better question than who is a Christian

[Dravin]

You don't have to "drink the koolaid" to come over...just the Joe. :-)

I just had a mental image of somebody replacing the water with coffee in the sacrament...

:)

[prisonchaplain]

I just had a mental image of somebody replacing the water with coffee in the sacrament...

:)

It could be worse. Imagine if a church decided to use...wine!

[Dravin]

It could be worse. Imagine if a church decided to use...wine!

*Gasp*

Sir, I beg , there are those with delicate minds and hearts about, be careful what you utter.

[Moksha]

It could be worse. Imagine if a church decided to use...wine!

This could be the reason why we prefer the expression, "choose the right", instead of "what would Jesus do".

:)

[bytor2112]

The words of this beautiful song sum up the way I feel rather nicely:

Ah, turn me not away, receive me though unworthy.

Ah, turn me not away, receive me though unworthy.

Hear Thou my cry, hear Thou my cry,

Behold, Lord, my distress!

Answer me from Thy throne,

Haste Thee, Lord, to mine aid!

Thy pity show in my deep anguish, Thy pity show in my deep anguish.

Let not the sword of vengeance smite me,

Though righteous Thine anger, O Lord!

Shield me in danger, O regard me!

On Thee, Lord, alone will I call!

O divine Redeemer, O divine Redeemer!

I pray thee grant me pardon, And remember not

Remember not my sins!

Forgive me!

O divine Redeemer! I pray Thee, grant me pardon

And remember not, remember not, O Lord, my sins!

Night gathers round my soul

Fearful, I cry to Thee,

Come to mine aid, O Lord!

Haste Thee, Lord, haste to help me!

Hear my cry, hear my cry

Save me, Lord in Thy mercy;

Hear my cry, hear my cry!

Come and save me, O Lord!

O divine Redeemer! O divine Redeemer!

I pray Thee, grant me pardon, and remember not

Remember not, O Lord, my sins!

Save in the day of retribution

From death shield Thou me, O my God!

O divine Redeemer, have mercy!

Help me Savior!

Edited October 18, 2009 by bytor2112

[AnthonyB]

PC,

At Australian AOG's, baptism doesn't do anything or alter the state of anybody, it is merely an act of obedience of no much more merit then say tithing or attending a worship service. Infact at an AOG churches, I've heard many more admonintions to tithe or not to be a spiritual "oncer" (someone who only attends 1 service a Sunday) then to be baptised

Baptism is only really used as an act to get membership, but since membership wasn't particularly encouraged (At the AOG church and I also attended a Christian City Church were membership was delibarately discouraged).

So unlike the RC's and the LDS, the validity of baptism to the AOG people I've meet was a non question. My Church of Christ baptism has been held valid for applying for memebrship at all the Pente, Baptists chruches that I've attended.

So for an LDS person, who wanted to hold that their LDS baptism was valid but decided to attend a Pente church and made no noise about their situation but just professed faith in Jesus (I know it is a very unlikely situation) , their baptismal status would have very little effect on what they could and couldn't do. Formal membership and ministerial ordination would be about all they would be excluded from but they could baptise others, serve communion, teach Sunday school.

Is it any different in the US?

[prisonchaplain]

Anthony, largely yes. Our membership is usually about half our Sunday attendance. We do not plug membership, and when folk show an interest we explain that expectations are higher. You're joining a community now, and that means some commitment.

I would be surprised if baptism did not come up during membership application. On the other hand, if an LDS convert were asked, "Were you baptized in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, by full immersion?" yeah, I suppose they could simply say yes, and the matter of where this happened may never come up. On the other hand, if an LDS member converted to AoG church membership, my guess is that s/he would bring it up, and may well ask to be rebaptized.

My wife was baptized, by sprinkling, in a Presbyterian church. While we do not prefer this method, it's not been raised as an issue in the three churches we've been members of, over the last 14 years. BTW, I'd be highly surprised if an AoG allowed non-members to officiate baptisms. In churches I've been in, clergy did the officiating.