Guest Member_Deleted Posted October 4, 2005 Report Share Posted October 4, 2005 Did you know that MOUNTAIN of the Lord is only referring to the PRIESTHOOD POWER AND AUTHORITY? ..←So you're changing your story now? Do you ever admit that you're wrong? Based on what evidence do you state that the Mountain of Yahweh is Priesthood power/authority? ←I am not changing... but adding to. You must know the difference... LOL As for the evidence... what kind would you accept? Along this same line of understanding you will find that different trees like Oaks, cedars are symbols of leadership and power...Also the eagle's wings... and wings in general are symbols of priesthood authority and power.... end result of the atonement... which is the greatest work of the priesthood or power of God on earth... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Member_Deleted Posted October 4, 2005 Report Share Posted October 4, 2005 Except that Palestine (Jerusalem) is of the capitol of the house of Juda - In my previous post we learn that the power to unite the world will come from Ephraim which means that it will begin some were else. In reality "there's absolutely no reason to even begin to suggest" (to quote someone) that the top of the Mountain has reference to only to Palestine. -- Not from history or Christian thinking. The Traveler←Have you ever noticed that Utah/Salt Lake...and Utah counties.. are almost the identical reversal of Jerusalem and surrounding areas?Where the dead sea is.... opposite side is the great salt lake... ( I have a broken pinky and am resorting to not capitalizing to save some pain)... anyway... if you take a map of Utah and a map of the dead sea area etc... you will see how the jordon river here... works the same as there.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Posted October 4, 2005 Report Share Posted October 4, 2005 The final Zion will be built in America...even Masons know that...dah! -eric Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted October 4, 2005 Report Share Posted October 4, 2005 Originally posted by Please@Oct 4 2005, 10:45 AMDid you know that MOUNTAIN of the Lord is only referring to the PRIESTHOOD POWER AND AUTHORITY? ..←So you're changing your story now? Do you ever admit that you're wrong? Based on what evidence do you state that the Mountain of Yahweh is Priesthood power/authority? ←I am not changing... but adding to. You must know the difference... LOL As for the evidence... what kind would you accept? How about quoting a source for once? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray Posted October 4, 2005 Report Share Posted October 4, 2005 Originally posted by JasonIm fairly confident that it is a Mountain, not a building. This coincides with the ancient worship of rocks by the primitive Hebrews. Look at Jacob, who anointed a rock and called it "beth'el" or the "house of El".Ancient people of the Lord didn't literally worship rocks, they worshipped the LORD on altars made of rock, and some of those altars were made of huge piles of rock called mountains.So, if we were to substitute the word “mountain” for the word “altar” or a word to convey the idea that this “mountain” is a “central place of worship”, we would have the idea that:It shall come to pass in the latter days that the [central place(s) of worship] of the house of the LORD shall be established in the top of the [central place(s) of worship], and shall be exalted above the hills [or lower place(s) of worship]; and all the nations shall flow to it, "Or in other words, this scripture merely conveys the idea that people or nations of people will flow to Church headquarters to worship the LORD. And as a matter of fact, Church headquarters is now in Utah, and nations of people do flow there to worship the LORD.And btw, someone recently told me that “Utah” literally means “top of the mountain” in the language of Ute people. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted October 4, 2005 Report Share Posted October 4, 2005 Originally posted by Traveler@Oct 4 2005, 10:33 AMSince the record of the Bible covers about 3 weeks in the life of Jesus your presumption that he never spoke of Melcihzedek would indicate that you know more than those of his time that recorded what they did. There is a great deal in Hebrew tradition to reference Melcihzedek. We have historical records such as the Dead Sea Scrolls, Nag Hammadi manuscripts, Apocrypha, Pseudepgrapha, Josephus and rabbinical writings. So you're saying that Melchizedek founded Salem based on texts outside of the Bible. That's fine. Which text? All Im asking for here people is a source. I don't give a blow about your opinion unless asked for. For you to call a rabbi that is a professor of Hebrew at the university of Jerusalem ill informed on the history of Jerusalem indicates that it is you my friend is MOST ill informed. First, you just said "some rabbi". That mean's nothing. Now you qualify your rabbi, and now I can make a better assessment of your rabbi friend. First, being a professor of Hebrew is impressive. However, he's not a professor of History. That leaves him wanting in my estimation. Second, I've met far too many professors to be impressed by a title. I've known many a professor and associate professor who knew less that me about things I consider interesting. They know things I don't, but they don't know things I do. Now you claim Paul was pagan??? Certainly. Or at least not an Orthodox Christian. Likely he was a Gnostic who believed in a supernatural Jesus. Look at how he advocates Celibacy as greater than Marriage. He was a super-ascetic. From where do you think the Monks drew their inspiration? Not the Gospels. Not the writings of John, James or Peter. Think about it. Paul was Jewish - As was Jesus. Jewish descend does not make a Jew in religion. Please my friend I beg you - become informed before you convince us all you have nothing what-so-ever to offer.The Traveler←Qualify your sources, then I can make better qualified responses. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted October 4, 2005 Report Share Posted October 4, 2005 Originally posted by Eric@Oct 4 2005, 01:04 PMThe final Zion will be built in America...even Masons know that...dah! -eric←Will be? The USA is Freemasonry's Zion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted October 4, 2005 Report Share Posted October 4, 2005 Originally posted by Ray@Oct 4 2005, 01:58 PMAncient people of the Lord didn't literally worship rocks, although they did worship on rocks, and some of those altars were made of huge piles of rock called mountains. Oh, I forgot...you were there, huh Ray? Seriously, the Ancient Israelites did worship all kinds of things, besides Yahweh. Fairly often, it was a single Rock, not a pile, that was worshipped. Otherwise, we wouldn't have ol'e YHWH getting so uptight about people ignoring him or placing him lower on the list of Who's Who of Divine Beings. As an aside, that doesn't mean that it was approved, or that they literally worshipped the Rocks per se. They may have venerated the rocks as a representation of the gods they adored. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Member_Deleted Posted October 4, 2005 Report Share Posted October 4, 2005 Originally posted by Jason+Oct 4 2005, 01:56 PM--><!--QuoteBegin-Please@Oct 4 2005, 10:45 AMDid you know that MOUNTAIN of the Lord is only referring to the PRIESTHOOD POWER AND AUTHORITY? ..←So you're changing your story now? Do you ever admit that you're wrong? Based on what evidence do you state that the Mountain of Yahweh is Priesthood power/authority? ←I am not changing... but adding to. You must know the difference... LOL As for the evidence... what kind would you accept? How about quoting a source for once?←You haven't accepted anything that JS did... so what would be the use? But for those others following this thread... I will give my reference...Joseph Smith and our Destiny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Member_Deleted Posted October 4, 2005 Report Share Posted October 4, 2005 Originally posted by Ray+Oct 4 2005, 01:58 PM--><!--QuoteBegin-JasonIm fairly confident that it is a Mountain, not a building. This coincides with the ancient worship of rocks by the primitive Hebrews. Look at Jacob, who anointed a rock and called it "beth'el" or the "house of El".Ancient people of the Lord didn't literally worship rocks, they worshipped the LORD on altars made of rock, and some of those altars were made of huge piles of rock called mountains.So, if we were to substitute the word “mountain” for the word “altar” or a word to convey the idea that this “mountain” is a “central place of worship”, we would have the idea that:It shall come to pass in the latter days that the [central place(s) of worship] of the house of the LORD shall be established in the top of the [central place(s) of worship], and shall be exalted above the hills [or lower place(s) of worship]; and all the nations shall flow to it, "Or in other words, this scripture merely conveys the idea that people or nations of people will flow to Church headquarters to worship the LORD. And as a matter of fact, Church headquarters is now in Utah, and nations of people do flow there to worship the LORD.And btw, someone recently told me that “Utah” literally means “top of the mountain” in the language of Ute people.←You have the right idea... :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray Posted October 4, 2005 Report Share Posted October 4, 2005 Originally posted by Jason+Oct 4 2005, 01:14 PM--><!--QuoteBegin-Ray@Oct 4 2005, 01:58 PMAncient people of the Lord didn't literally worship rocks, although they did worship on rocks, and some of those altars were made of huge piles of rock called mountains. Oh, I forgot...you were there, huh Ray? Seriously, the Ancient Israelites did worship all kinds of things, besides Yahweh. Fairly often, it was a single Rock, not a pile, that was worshipped. Otherwise, we wouldn't have ol'e YHWH getting so uptight about people ignoring him or placing him lower on the list of Who's Who of Divine Beings. As an aside, that doesn't mean that it was approved, or that they literally worshipped the Rocks per se. They may have venerated the rocks as a representation of the gods they adored.←Heh, that isn't what I was talking about, although you have made some good points. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray Posted October 4, 2005 Report Share Posted October 4, 2005 Originally posted by Please+Oct 4 2005, 01:19 PM-->Originally posted by Ray@Oct 4 2005, 01:58 PM<!--QuoteBegin-JasonIm fairly confident that it is a Mountain, not a building. This coincides with the ancient worship of rocks by the primitive Hebrews. Look at Jacob, who anointed a rock and called it "beth'el" or the "house of El".Ancient people of the Lord didn't literally worship rocks, they worshipped the LORD on altars made of rock, and some of those altars were made of huge piles of rock called mountains.So, if we were to substitute the word “mountain” for the word “altar” or a word to convey the idea that this “mountain” is a “central place of worship”, we would have the idea that:It shall come to pass in the latter days that the [central place(s) of worship] of the house of the LORD shall be established in the top of the [central place(s) of worship], and shall be exalted above the hills [or lower place(s) of worship]; and all the nations shall flow to it, "Or in other words, this scripture merely conveys the idea that people or nations of people will flow to Church headquarters to worship the LORD. And as a matter of fact, Church headquarters is now in Utah, and nations of people do flow there to worship the LORD.And btw, someone recently told me that “Utah” literally means “top of the mountain” in the language of Ute people.←You have the right idea... :)←Heh, thank you, Please. I'm sure you could have said what I was trying to say better than I could, but I appreciate that you understood my point. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted October 4, 2005 Report Share Posted October 4, 2005 Originally posted by Please+Oct 4 2005, 02:15 PM-->Originally posted by Jason@Oct 4 2005, 01:56 PM<!--QuoteBegin-Please@Oct 4 2005, 10:45 AMDid you know that MOUNTAIN of the Lord is only referring to the PRIESTHOOD POWER AND AUTHORITY? ..←So you're changing your story now? Do you ever admit that you're wrong? Based on what evidence do you state that the Mountain of Yahweh is Priesthood power/authority? ←I am not changing... but adding to. You must know the difference... LOL As for the evidence... what kind would you accept? How about quoting a source for once?←You haven't accepted anything that JS did... so what would be the use? But for those others following this thread... I will give my reference...Joseph Smith and our Destiny←Joseph Smith and our Destiny? Is that a book, and article, who published it, and when. What page number are you giving us to refer too? That's not much of a source yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Member_Deleted Posted October 4, 2005 Report Share Posted October 4, 2005 Originally posted by Jason+Oct 4 2005, 02:29 PM-->Originally posted by Please@Oct 4 2005, 02:15 PMOriginally posted by Jason@Oct 4 2005, 01:56 PM<!--QuoteBegin-Please@Oct 4 2005, 10:45 AMDid you know that MOUNTAIN of the Lord is only referring to the PRIESTHOOD POWER AND AUTHORITY? ..←So you're changing your story now? Do you ever admit that you're wrong? Based on what evidence do you state that the Mountain of Yahweh is Priesthood power/authority? ←I am not changing... but adding to. You must know the difference... LOL As for the evidence... what kind would you accept? How about quoting a source for once?←You haven't accepted anything that JS did... so what would be the use? But for those others following this thread... I will give my reference...Joseph Smith and our Destiny←Joseph Smith and our Destiny? Is that a book, and article, who published it, and when. What page number are you giving us to refer too? That's not much of a source yet.←It is sufficient... the whole book is an explanation... read it all... search google... Or I guess I can.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted October 4, 2005 Report Share Posted October 4, 2005 Originally posted by Please+Oct 4 2005, 02:31 PM-->Originally posted by Jason@Oct 4 2005, 02:29 PMOriginally posted by Please@Oct 4 2005, 02:15 PMOriginally posted by Jason@Oct 4 2005, 01:56 PM<!--QuoteBegin-Please@Oct 4 2005, 10:45 AMDid you know that MOUNTAIN of the Lord is only referring to the PRIESTHOOD POWER AND AUTHORITY? ..←So you're changing your story now? Do you ever admit that you're wrong? Based on what evidence do you state that the Mountain of Yahweh is Priesthood power/authority? ←I am not changing... but adding to. You must know the difference... LOL As for the evidence... what kind would you accept? How about quoting a source for once?←You haven't accepted anything that JS did... so what would be the use? But for those others following this thread... I will give my reference...Joseph Smith and our Destiny←Joseph Smith and our Destiny? Is that a book, and article, who published it, and when. What page number are you giving us to refer too? That's not much of a source yet.←It is sufficient... the whole book is an explanation... read it all... search google... Or I guess I can..←Yes, please try and be a bit more scholarly. Your source quote may have sufficed in High School, but let's try and move beyond that, ok? I want more than the title. How would you like it if I quoted you something and then told you to go read some book? Not very nice. But if I told you all the details of the book, including the page or pages that described what Im saying, you'd be more likely to check out the source. That's what Im asking for. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted October 4, 2005 Report Share Posted October 4, 2005 Is this it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Member_Deleted Posted October 4, 2005 Report Share Posted October 4, 2005 Where do you live Jason? The book is out of print... and I believe it is only accessable through two sources.. First BYU library... I have gotten it there once.. and the Church Historical Department... If you are in Utah... you can get access through your own library... to borrow from the BYU.... it costs 2 bucks... and takes a couple of weeks... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted October 4, 2005 Report Share Posted October 4, 2005 Originally posted by Please@Oct 4 2005, 02:47 PMWhere do you live Jason? The book is out of print... and I believe it is only accessable through two sources..First BYU library... I have gotten it there once.. and the Church Historical Department...If you are in Utah... you can get access through your own library... to borrow from the BYU.... it costs 2 bucks... and takes a couple of weeks...←Did you check my link? If it's Earl Harmer's book, I can get it for $15.61 and get Free Super Saver Shipping! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Member_Deleted Posted October 4, 2005 Report Share Posted October 4, 2005 Originally posted by Jason+Oct 4 2005, 02:55 PM--><!--QuoteBegin-Please@Oct 4 2005, 02:47 PMWhere do you live Jason? The book is out of print... and I believe it is only accessable through two sources..First BYU library... I have gotten it there once.. and the Church Historical Department...If you are in Utah... you can get access through your own library... to borrow from the BYU.... it costs 2 bucks... and takes a couple of weeks...←Did you check my link? If it's Earl Harmer's book, I can get it for $15.61 and get Free Super Saver Shipping!←What link? the one that says you are from Wyoming? give me the link to the book... let me see if it is the right one.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted October 4, 2005 Report Share Posted October 4, 2005 Originally posted by Please+Oct 4 2005, 02:59 PM-->Originally posted by Jason@Oct 4 2005, 02:55 PM<!--QuoteBegin-Please@Oct 4 2005, 02:47 PMWhere do you live Jason? The book is out of print... and I believe it is only accessable through two sources..First BYU library... I have gotten it there once.. and the Church Historical Department...If you are in Utah... you can get access through your own library... to borrow from the BYU.... it costs 2 bucks... and takes a couple of weeks...←Did you check my link? If it's Earl Harmer's book, I can get it for $15.61 and get Free Super Saver Shipping!←What link? the one that says you are from Wyoming? give me the link to the book... let me see if it is the right one..←Post #41. Click on "Is this it?". It's a hyperlink to Amazon.com. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Member_Deleted Posted October 4, 2005 Report Share Posted October 4, 2005 Originally posted by Jason+Oct 4 2005, 03:05 PM-->Originally posted by Please@Oct 4 2005, 02:59 PMOriginally posted by Jason@Oct 4 2005, 02:55 PM<!--QuoteBegin-Please@Oct 4 2005, 02:47 PMWhere do you live Jason? The book is out of print... and I believe it is only accessable through two sources..First BYU library... I have gotten it there once.. and the Church Historical Department...If you are in Utah... you can get access through your own library... to borrow from the BYU.... it costs 2 bucks... and takes a couple of weeks...←Did you check my link? If it's Earl Harmer's book, I can get it for $15.61 and get Free Super Saver Shipping!←What link? the one that says you are from Wyoming? give me the link to the book... let me see if it is the right one..←Post #41. Click on "Is this it?". It's a hyperlink to Amazon.com.←Sorry... it just doesn't show up... as a link to me... I found it.. It might be it... but they didn't have any sample pages or title page or anything... so I can't be sure...It is such a tiny book... I can't imagine it costing so much,,,, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted October 4, 2005 Report Share Posted October 4, 2005 Originally posted by Please+Oct 4 2005, 03:06 PM-->Originally posted by Jason@Oct 4 2005, 03:05 PMOriginally posted by Please@Oct 4 2005, 02:59 PMOriginally posted by Jason@Oct 4 2005, 02:55 PM<!--QuoteBegin-Please@Oct 4 2005, 02:47 PMWhere do you live Jason? The book is out of print... and I believe it is only accessable through two sources..First BYU library... I have gotten it there once.. and the Church Historical Department...If you are in Utah... you can get access through your own library... to borrow from the BYU.... it costs 2 bucks... and takes a couple of weeks...←Did you check my link? If it's Earl Harmer's book, I can get it for $15.61 and get Free Super Saver Shipping!←What link? the one that says you are from Wyoming? give me the link to the book... let me see if it is the right one..←Post #41. Click on "Is this it?". It's a hyperlink to Amazon.com.←Sorry... it just doesn't show up... as a link to me... I found it.. It might be it... but they didn't have any sample pages or title page or anything... so I can't be sure...It is such a tiny book... I can't imagine it costing so much,,,,←Well, then perhaps you should go to BYU or whereever and check it out and return and report. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Member_Deleted Posted October 4, 2005 Report Share Posted October 4, 2005 Originally posted by Jason+Oct 4 2005, 03:26 PM-->Originally posted by Please@Oct 4 2005, 03:06 PMOriginally posted by Jason@Oct 4 2005, 03:05 PMOriginally posted by Please@Oct 4 2005, 02:59 PMOriginally posted by Jason@Oct 4 2005, 02:55 PM<!--QuoteBegin-Please@Oct 4 2005, 02:47 PMWhere do you live Jason? The book is out of print... and I believe it is only accessable through two sources..First BYU library... I have gotten it there once.. and the Church Historical Department...If you are in Utah... you can get access through your own library... to borrow from the BYU.... it costs 2 bucks... and takes a couple of weeks...←Did you check my link? If it's Earl Harmer's book, I can get it for $15.61 and get Free Super Saver Shipping!←What link? the one that says you are from Wyoming? give me the link to the book... let me see if it is the right one..←Post #41. Click on "Is this it?". It's a hyperlink to Amazon.com.←Sorry... it just doesn't show up... as a link to me... I found it.. It might be it... but they didn't have any sample pages or title page or anything... so I can't be sure...It is such a tiny book... I can't imagine it costing so much,,,,←Well, then perhaps you should go to BYU or whereever and check it out and return and report.←I was thinking of doing that very thing... It will be a while... a couple of weeks.. but I will see what I can do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted October 4, 2005 Report Share Posted October 4, 2005 Originally posted by Please@Oct 4 2005, 03:06 PMThe book is out of print... and I believe it is only accessable through two sources..First BYU library... I have gotten it there once.. and the Church Historical Department................It is such a tiny book... I can't imagine it costing so much,,,,Looks like Bret Eborn has it used for $14.00. Click here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray Posted October 4, 2005 Report Share Posted October 4, 2005 Originally posted by Jason+Oct 4 2005, 02:40 PM--><!--QuoteBegin-Please@Oct 4 2005, 03:06 PMThe book is out of print... and I believe it is only accessable through two sources..First BYU library... I have gotten it there once.. and the Church Historical Department................It is such a tiny book... I can't imagine it costing so much,,,,Looks like Bret Eborn has it used for $14.00. Click here.←Great, Jason, it seems you found it! Now do us a favor and give us a review of what you have learned after reading it. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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