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Traveler last won the day on August 18 2018

Traveler had the most liked content!

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About Traveler

  • Rank
    Senior Member
  • Birthday 08/22/1946

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  • Gender
  • Location
    Sandy Utah
  • Interests
    Science, Cycling, Skiing, (outdoors in general), Liberty and Gospel Doctrine.
  • Religion
    Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints

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  1. Traveler

    Is it really coming to this?

    First I will apologize for fox news and it heave bias. But here is a link to an article to the writer of a TV show for his treatments of FICTIONAL characters. My question is - who is teaching this as a resolution of problems or disagreements? Where is this coming from? Sadly it seems to come from all sides in political disagreements as well as religious problems. I know it is politically incorrect to call someone dumb and stupid - but that is exactly what seems to be the popular notion - respond with as much violence as you can whenever you are opposed. And I do not mind saying we have a lot of dumb politicians - including our president. Let me be very clear - it is very stupid and dumb to think you will lesson the damage (effect) of fire by powering gasoline on it. How bad does something have to get before we will admit that it is dumb and stupid? The Traveler
  2. Traveler

    Impeach This...

    You know, when I read your post it dawned on me that even thought we have a well defined scientific definition of "Intelligence" - We don't have any scientific method of classifying or defining stupidly. In general I do not think it takes much to identify stupidly in others - it is ourselves that we all seem to be blind. That is ourselves and those we love and care about. I have noticed that with many of my children that are now raising their children that it is common to hear their attempts at parenting with the often spoken phrase - "We do not use the word stupid or dumb in our home - we do not call anyone dumb or stupid." I upset my daughter a while back when I asked, "Why? Don't you want them to have a clear idea what dumb and stupid are and how it is translated into action or words?" It would seem that we are bringing up a generation that expect to be patted on the back and complemented on their achievements - or if their achievements fall short to be complemented on their effort. It is interesting to me because I was raised in a home of overachievers. I never heard the words spoken except that we (most certainly me) could have and should have done better. My father was a artiest (among other things) and hated to sell his own work - he always wanted to make it better. I have noticed that many get peeved if someone disagrees with them - or worse - points out an obvious flaw. Sometimes the greatest achievements come from the depths of harsh criticism of our mistakes. I do not know enough about those that specialize in the law - but I suspect that those that deserve the brunt of lawyer jokes have little clue if they are doing a poor job of their specialization. And if experience serves me right - those lawyers that get as upset (or more so) than does Trump, when someone disagrees with them or draws attentions to their mistakes - are among the dumbest and most stupid of their profession. The Traveler
  3. Traveler

    Essential Oils, Do they work?

    John the Baptist ate insects that cost him noting and he was a most effective and strong missionary. Of the many stories I hear about missionaries - I will put the story of your son living within his Mission Allowance near the top of being the kind of strong missionary that G-d needs. The Traveler
  4. Traveler

    Impeach This...

    It is not a matter of love - it is a matter of trust. I do not trust Trump! I did not support or vote for Romney - I do not like his politics or agree with him about much concerning Utah and politics. But I trust Romney much more than I trust Trump. Sometimes I think I trust the Democrats more than Republicans - because I think they will accomplish what they say they will - even if they have to lie and cheat to do it. They will stand together and accomplish their priorities. But Republicans cannot be trusted for anything - especially when it comes to a political agenda. But Trump is an unknown - his most visible acts (his tweets and treatment of anyone that disagree with him) is completely off the scale on the un-trust-able side. I am most conflicted - as evil and corrupt as are the Democrats - I am not sure but that removing Trump from the presidency may bring about the best results for our country and our political divisions and corruptions. Trump has exposed that Washington is corrupt and hypocritical - not just our elected officials but our bureaucracies as well. We cannot trust our politicians, we cannot trust the FBI, the CIA, the IRS, the CDC, the Federal Reserve, the Supreme Court, the Military, the FDA, our public education system, or even the good guys because we do not know who they are or how to tell them from the bad guys. We are building great distrust - not just at the federal level but at every level. Maybe we would all be better off with a Democrat president, congress, supreme court and everything else (or the equivalent with Republicans) - because then at least we would all know (as in Hong Cong) how important liberties and freedoms are - and that our politicians and nation's leaders are our greatest threat - not just those that we know we disagree with. The Traveler
  5. Traveler

    Worst Case Scenario: NATO?

    Where to start? I joined the military thinking that I would learn something about fighting in and winning a war. Winston Churchill once said something like, "There are worse thing than war and they all come from loosing one." In a discussion with my brother that was also in the military during Vietnam he wisely said, "No one wins a war, but one side will loose a lot more than the other." I never saw combat in Vietnam but I did receive orders that would take me into combat and I spent a long night in prayer. I made a choice and determined to take lives if circumstance became such. I am grateful the circumstance never came. My military experience changed me more than any other single experience. I use to love hunting. It was my single most favorite activity. There is an excitement and rush in hunting and even in target practice. There is an art to using weapons and I mastered as many as I could. Swords, slings, bow and arrows, and axes are especially fun for me. However, having been in the military - I think I have become more anti-nephi-lehite than Moroni. I would rather be killed by another human than to have to kill someone. From time to time I will think to use a weapon in fun - target practice. But I am so drawn into it - into the excitement that I have learned to just stay away and tell friends a family a lie - that I do not enjoy it when the reality is that I do; way to much. Why do I bring this up? Why am I telling the forum of my experience? The reason is that so often when we talk about things like NATO and worse case (war) we do so with great disconnect thinking that we will avoid the consequences. We think ourselves so smart, so righteous or so something that we think we are safe - that we are innocent and justice will not allow that we, our friends or family to suffer - or if we do that it will not be so much or so difficult to bear. So then, it is fun to speculate. We are so easily taken in for the fun of it. For well over a thousand years Europe has not learned a single lesson about getting along with each other for more than a generation. Though I do have my personal opinions - it is obvious to me that the two extremes (hawk or dove) are 100% ineffective in preventing a war and are in effect the two greatest engines to guarantee war and the more extreme it is for ether the more devastating the war will be for everybody - not just in cost and physical losses but much more to the spiritual well being of humanity. I am convinced that - especially concerning war - that we are at the mercy of G-d and that if we look first to anything else other than G-d to protect us - we will loose more than we thought we had. I do not know what the future will bring - but I am most concerned about Europe. Traditional Christianity have failed Europe - I know @anatess2 @prisonchaplain and many others will likely disagree - but in the last 1,000 years Traditional Christians have chosen badly in questions of liberty, freedoms and peace in Christ throughout Europe and have been engines of war and oppression rather than peace - so much so that for the most part Europe has become secular and rejected G-d. And the last two great wars of Europe have spiritually ruined that continent. But on the other hand - peace and prosperity is turning the USA into a greedy secular society even more full of hate in the slightest disagreement. And I am just trying to avoid getting caught up in any of it. The Traveler
  6. Traveler

    Impeach This...

    My good friend @anatess2 and many others on this forum. Unlike Speaker Pelosi I am not full of hate and claim to love everybody. Never-the-less, like most citizens, I am not ecstatic with the direction of our country and society. I would liken our country and society to someone deeply affected with cancer. Perhaps Trump is the equivalent of aggressive surgery and chemotherapy. For sure the divisions in the country are not pleasant. There is no question in my mind that a healthy person should not submit themselves to such aggressive surgery and chemotherapy. If a person (or country) is not suffering from advanced stages of cancer (or the political equivalent) they should not seek treatment from a doctor that wants to try the treatment (or impeach a likewise aggressive politician). My greatest concern is the hatred that divides our country - it classes, it races and it genders. I do not like the wealthy class very much even though I am kind of one of them. I do not want to drive and maintain an expensive car or live in and take care of a home in a more upscale neighborhood. I do not want to spend my private moments with someone beyond the two biological genders that define our species. But just because I prefer some things does not mean that I hate everything else or that I cannot get along with them and allow them (to some degree) to pursue their dreams - I intend to pursue my own dreams and not so much anybody else's. But I am concerned that my lack of support for certain things is so often interpreted as or accused to be hate. I genuinely try to love everybody because my L-rd and G-d has asked and commanded me to do so. But I find that there are a lot of people I encounter that are hard for me to like, let alone love. Sadly some that I find hard to like are my in-laws that my wife loves dearly. I have worked hard to love everybody - but I am not even close to there yet. The best that I have been able to do in many cases is to not hate them. President Trump (and for now - every other politician I know anything about) are on my "I do not hate them" list. I do not mind if every politician in DC was impeached and this includes Trump. My single concern about impeaching Trump is that the Washington establishment will find some one infinitely worse to replace him. I also have a hard time liking the corporate elites (even though I had a brother - now retired - that was one of them but definitely not of the common mold). For the most part I believe those willing to sit on the corporate boards to be evil (obviously there are some exceptions) but I believe Trump to tend more towards the evil side of corporate elites. So there you have it - my two greatest prejudices - Corporate Elites and Politicians - and President Trump fits the bill of both. I try really hard to love everybody but Trump is one that challenges my resolve. I hope this will not keep me from the Celestial Glory or from your friendship (you are easy to like) - I will work on my love problem - but I fear our country is too close to civil war and violent conflict. The Traveler
  7. Traveler

    Essential Oils, Do they work?

    @B.cole2There is a preponderance of scientific research that demonstrates that we humans are greatly affected by our sense of smell. Besides science; there is a great deal of personal experience you may want to reference - however @MormonGator made a most obvious observation when he stated that aroma therapy is not a cure for much of anything. That said - few keep skunks for pets, passing gas in elevators is not socially acceptable and no one (that I know) loves using a bathroom dominated by the most naturally odors. The science of our sense of smell is that of all our senses, the sense of smell has the strongest connection to memory. Regardless of how much time has passed we remember unpleasant and pleasant smells. Primarily for this reason the use of aroma therapy is highly effective in affecting a person's mood. For example, regardless of how good looking and charming a partner is - if they smell like a sauna or an outhouse - it will ruin the magic of a romantic moment - unless someone is personally attracted to and excited by the sauna or outhouse smells. This brings me to my next point - scientifically we humans are classed as an intelligent species - this means that our cognitive awareness are learned. This means that different humans will have different reactions to different smells. What you personally find to smell most delightful - somebody somewhere is likely to have a much different response. A note in passing - whenever individuals of the same species respond differently to a common stimulus - it is most likely because it is a learned response. Which means - just because you have learned to like something - does not mean that everybody else will enjoy it also. There is a caveat to smells - the human brain tends to filter out long standing stimulus from our senses. For whatever reason the human awareness is most heightened by change. So if your home always smells the same (regardless of the cause of it) you will tend to not notice it over time. Often people that smoke or have pets (among other things) in their home are unaware of how bad it may smell to others. The Traveler
  8. Traveler

    Miracle Not Understood???

    I have had a few and the only thing that seems to have any relevance to their occurrence is how often and regularly I am visiting the temple. The Traveler
  9. Traveler

    Why Eternal Progression?

    I believe this is a good subject - but there is an profound difference between fulfilling one's mortal purpose (probation) and being about one's eternal destiny. Paul makes a very interesting reference in Romans (chapter 4) where the Sabbath (day of rest) in connected to the eternal rest or Sabbath of G-d. In short the Sabbath (Sunday) is a to pursue our eternal purpose. One could assume that if watching football was their eternal purpose - that would be a most perfect Sabbath activity. What we purpose to do with our Sabbath is the essence of our eternal purpose - and therefore called a day or time of "rest" or should we say "divine rest" - which I believe is nothing like what is often thought of as retirement. The Traveler
  10. Traveler

    Mary’s age

    First - I must apologize. The actual title of the book or document I am addressing is "the Gospel of the Birth of Mary." In review it would seem that Mary (according to the ancient math of Israel was somewhere between 12 and 14 years of age - likely 13. Again I am sorry that there may be some confusion with the "Gospel of Mary Magdalene". @anatess2 has a link to one copy. Like many ancient text there are often multiple copies from different places and time which have variations in the text. However, I believe the above link to be sufficient. The Traveler
  11. Traveler


    you may find the following scriptures interesting: Revelation 13: Revelation 16: Revelation 19: The Traveler
  12. Traveler

    Guaranteed Income Supplement

    I entirely agree with the concepts of faith in G-d. But I understand that G-d will inspire some to carry a gun and so act to preserve the rights and liberties of themselves and others. But I also understand that G-d will inspire some to put away their weapons (like the Anti Nephi Lehies). And that it is through G-d and following his inspiration to those that love and respect him that our rights and liberties are preserved. I am concerned that some may think that they can preserve their rights and liberties simply by having a gun available. I believe the first step to preserve our right and liberties is to love, respect and obey G-d. This is what is necessary and sufficient. A single desire to have a gun is neither necessary or sufficient. The Traveler
  13. Traveler

    Mary’s age

    That an angel came to Mary's parents (as with John the Baptist) to announce the birth of a "Select" spirit to fulfill an important calling for G-d - I find most reasonable. That the parents of Mary felt inadequate to raise Mary an so took her to the temple to be raised by priests serving at the temple (as was Samuel) - I find most reasonable. That an ancient definition of a virgin to be someone raised by holy priests for sacred purposes to apply to Mary as well as Marry being chaste - I find most reasonable. That Zechariah (a priest serving at the temple) and his wife Elizabeth raised Mary according to covenant - I find most reasonable - especially because in her hour of greatest need Mary sought out Elizabeth. That Zechariah was murdered on the steps of the temple and that Elizabeth fled into the "wilderness" to save her son (John) - I find most reasonable. That in an era of arranged marriages - That Zechariah sought a friend and acquaintance that he knew was of high moral character to marry Mary - I find most reasonable. That Mary was of exceptional beauty and as she approached womanhood, was highly sought after - that Zechariah sought someone that would be more concerned for her spiritually than her beauty (also realizing that Nephi saw in a vision her exceptional beauty). - I find most reasonable - even if Joseph was much older. That Joseph was not excited about the prospect of marrying the very young and beautiful Mary and had to be convinced by Zechariah (and other spiritual clues) - I find most reasonable. I would be interested in points that other found to be entirely unreasonable within that era and historical context. The Traveler
  14. Traveler

    Mary’s age

    We are instructed to seek "learning" from the best books. Historical accuracy is not the reason for including sacred documents in scripture. Even today we are encouraged to write family histories to be preserved for generations that follow us but not specifically to become scripture. If we are doing personal research into history (which is or should be included in the commandments to seek learning from the best books) we ought to be aware of as much as possible - that which has been preserved. Through the gift of the Holy Ghost we ought to be tutored in the truth (or lack of it) in our efforts of study - be it religious, scientific, historic, political or even entertainment. I do not know if Joseph Smith ever read the gospel of Mary - I am inclined to think it was not available to him in his circumstance. I personally find the gospel of Mary enlightening especially in light of questions about feminism in our modern culture. I have speculated that a primary reason, that as the Dark Ages were approaching, that the spiritual role of women in the growing religious culture was being diminished as an element of the Great Apostasy. The Traveler
  15. Traveler

    Guaranteed Income Supplement

    I thought to provide and example that demonstrates that G-d is the means by which freedoms, liberties and rights are preserved. Especially to counter your argument that you can defend your home, your rights, your liberties and so on with your gun. The Book of Mormon testifies that this land is a choice land and that to have freedoms and liberties we must serve G-d. It may appear unjust that the Saints suffered so in Missouri and it may appear that they lost their rights under the Extermination order (executive order 44). What I am trying to make clear is that G-d and G-d only defends our freedoms, liberties and rights. It is interesting that had the Saints remained in Missouri - that they would have suffered worse during the Civil War. That in essence G-d was protecting them in their sorrows, making them stronger and establishing - not just the freedoms of his Saints - but the preservation of the United States and its constitution. We are watching our political parties divide and tear our country apart. Our Constitution will not prevent political insanity from destroying our freedoms - Neither will our guns. The single most critical element is faith in and reliance in G-d and his called and chosen prophets. Those that created our constitution and split their blood to establish this nation did so with faith in G-d and in recolonizing that our rights are inalienable and enabled by G-d our creator. We do not fight just for our rights but for our G-d. And if we undertake to justify our pride or our vain ambition - the heavens will withdraw and we will stand alone and unprotected. I would encourage that you have faith in G-d and in all things - especially in the preservation of your right and liberties, give credit to him. The Traveler