Guest Ari 2 Posted November 14, 2005 Report Share Posted November 14, 2005 Originally posted by Soulsearcher@Nov 14 2005, 04:26 PMMy faith is agnosti for lack of a better definition at this point. That being said there are parts of different faiths that i follow. THe feast of Samhain being one of my most sacred, and when things that have no bearing of the tradition were being said it did offend me. I never said there was no possible satanic tie to Halloween, but to say that it's the focus of halloween it like saying the focus of Christmas is shopping. THey now might go hand in hand, but neither is realy anything close to what the celebration is.I know enough about pagan faiths and times to know what was and wasn't evil about them, just as you know what is true and what is false when it is spoken about your church.Life is a lot easier when you defer to the person who knows from first hand experience and study, than what other people have said based on study that might be tainted. I've been to many anti sites and came here to ask the truth. Doesn't it sound like a smart idea to ask the pagans about what the pagans believe? I'm not out to change or sway you, i'm only searching for truth, and i will only tel lthe truth. I share you mis trust of satanists, but in all honesty i've done enough research to know why i dislike them rather than just stating what people percive them to be ( not that you haven't). All being said they are still a faith and while it may pain people to do so they deserve an amount of respect to be allowed to follow their faith. It's easy to be tollerant and willing to understand that which we agree with, it's hard to d othe same for that which we aren't fully sure of.←______________________There are exceptions to the rule. Satanists sacrifice people, and murder is against the law. Animal cruelty is also against the law, so satanists who perform animal ritual abuse are not free to practice their religion. Ex LDS who practice polygamy are lawbreakers, and polygamists who marry minors are child abusers. Homosexuals who seduce young boys are pedophiles, which is against the law.I, too, have done research. I don't know anything about your religion or the holiday you celebrate on Halloween. The facts speak for themselves, and we know this is what satanists do on that day. Since satanists do not celebrate the holiday that you celebrate, there is no need for you to be offended by anthing I have said or will say about what they do on Halloween, since it has no bearing on you or your holiday. Since I know nothing about your religion or what it is you practice, why would I ask you about how you celebrate a holiday that I know nothing about? I related what I know occurs on Halloween, which is documented.I'm not here to learn about paganism; I'm in an LDS forum to share ideas, thoughts, lessons, life experiences with fellow LDS. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winnie G Posted November 15, 2005 Report Share Posted November 15, 2005 I think the way Halloween is going I have to say it is not looking good. I would not be surprised if the leadership made strong suggestions as to how Halloween is to be practices by members. I think it has taken on a life of its own. I do not know if they do this in the states but here people decorate their homes as if they do at Christmas. They make graveyards of their front yards screaming music and frightening displays. Neighborhoods have contests. They do it on my base, but they do Christmas decorating contest for Christmas and flowerbeds as well. It is just too over the top for my liking and it scares the house hockey out of my grandchildren. I make sure if I am home I have special treats for the small children that make the effort to dress up not the undead. This year we stayed home and I gave away that candy jewelry to the little girls and candy hamburgers and fry’s for the little boys, others received a sucker. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snow Posted November 15, 2005 Report Share Posted November 15, 2005 Hi Soulsearcher, So when you talked about bashing other faiths were you talking about form of paganism - like Wiccan or something? The think maybe the problem is that we have some relatively unsophisticated posters with us and then tend to see things through provincial lenses. Maybe that's to be expected as pagan oriented belief systems are typically thought of as equally valid as more mainstream systems. If that's your gig, why don't you stick around and educate us. There is another poster, Biz , who has some great insight along those lines. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Ari 2 Posted November 15, 2005 Report Share Posted November 15, 2005 Originally posted by Snow@Nov 14 2005, 08:25 PMThe think maybe the problem is that we have some relatively unsophisticated posters with us and then tend to see things through provincial lenses. Maybe that's to be expected as pagan oriented belief systems are typically thought of as equally valid as more mainstream systems. If that's your gig, why don't you stick around and educate us. There is another poster, Biz , who has some great insight along those lines.←___________________________Would you consider Jason to be sophisticated? He has recommended literature by Aleister Crowley, the "father of satanism"...homosexual, pedophile, and admitted murderer, having sacrificed children to satan. Is this the sort of anti-Christian propoganda that you would refer to as "educating us"? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snow Posted November 16, 2005 Report Share Posted November 16, 2005 Originally posted by Ari@Nov 15 2005, 12:51 AM___________________________Would you consider Jason to be sophisticated? He has recommended literature by Aleister Crowley, the "father of satanism"...homosexual, pedophile, and admitted murderer, having sacrificed children to satan. Is this the sort of anti-Christian propoganda that you would refer to as "educating us"?←I disagree with about 2/3rds of everything Jason says (half of which is rhetorical or argumentative - ie playing the devil's advocate). However, I do respect Jason's thinking process... in that he has one, is well-read and open-minded.What I don't respect is lack of critical thinking skills, closed-mindedness, arrogance when one hasn't earned it and, well, the rest is obvious. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Ari 2 Posted November 16, 2005 Report Share Posted November 16, 2005 Originally posted by Snow@Nov 15 2005, 07:27 PMI disagree with about 2/3rds of everything Jason says (half of which is rhetorical or argumentative - ie playing the devil's advocate). However, I do respect Jason's thinking process... in that he has one, is well-read and open-minded.What I don't respect is lack of critical thinking skills, closed-mindedness, arrogance when one hasn't earned it and, well, the rest is obvious.←___________________Yes it is obvious...why don't you apply it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snow Posted November 16, 2005 Report Share Posted November 16, 2005 Soulsearcher, Have you run across any interesting parallels with ancient paganism or druidism to either Mormonism or orthodox Christianity? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snow Posted November 16, 2005 Report Share Posted November 16, 2005 Hmmm, Thanks - why are you attracted to paganism (forgive me as I don't know specifically what to call it) as opposed to something more mainstream? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Ari 2 Posted November 16, 2005 Report Share Posted November 16, 2005 Originally posted by Soulsearcher@Nov 15 2005, 09:39 PMAs for mainstream faiths, i find to much rhetoric and only so much truth in each. I was raised catholic with a heavy mormon influence. I searched out many faiths, such as a bit of satanism, pagan faiths (celtic and other) and eastern faiths. While not an expert in any i have seen enough to know that there is a reason there are so many. Each holds a specific truth and only once we as a whole humanity honor one another we will never hold the truth before us.←____________________________________What specific truth does satanism hold? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Member_Deleted Posted November 16, 2005 Report Share Posted November 16, 2005 Originally posted by Soulsearcher@Nov 16 2005, 03:02 PMThe specific truth i learned from satanism is that you must hold on to a certain amout of desire for yourself. While charity and always giving of yourself is awonderful thing, you must always keep a bit of selfishness to hold you down to earth. If you do not truly understand what it is you want from others or life can you really help others gain the same goals for them selves.I'm not saying you can't learn this any place else, but it is very clear from their teachings and struck me as sound advice.←Only on an earthy level... think of what Christ said... Matt. 16: 25 25 For whosoever will save his life shall lose it: and whosoever will lose his life for my sake shall find it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Member_Deleted Posted November 16, 2005 Report Share Posted November 16, 2005 Originally posted by Soulsearcher@Nov 16 2005, 03:08 PMTrue, but i never took it past an earthly level. I have seen more than one person loose touch because they no longer are able to relate to themselves because they are to busy helping others. You must alsways have some amount of desire or focus on you and just you, though this being said it can be taken to far.←I believe this: Seek ye first the kingdom of God and His righteousness...all else will be add unto you...The opposing phylosopy of men states: Serve yourself first so that you will have the strength... big difference... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Ari 2 Posted November 16, 2005 Report Share Posted November 16, 2005 Originally posted by Soulsearcher@Nov 16 2005, 02:02 PMThe specific truth i learned from satanism is that you must hold on to a certain amout of desire for yourself. While charity and always giving of yourself is awonderful thing, you must always keep a bit of selfishness to hold you down to earth. If you do not truly understand what it is you want from others or life can you really help others gain the same goals for them selves.I'm not saying you can't learn this any place else, but it is very clear from their teachings and struck me as sound advice.←_________________________Satan is known as the "father of lies"...how much truth can be taught in his church?Selfishness and selflessness are opposite extremes. There is a distinction between self-esteem and selfishnessness. We can "lose ourselves in the care of others," or give "selfless service," to the point that we have lost who we are, and in the process we lose our self-esteem. Caring for ourselves isn't selfishness; it is self-worth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Ari 2 Posted November 16, 2005 Report Share Posted November 16, 2005 Originally posted by Soulsearcher@Nov 16 2005, 02:44 PMYou asked the truth i took from it, i answered. Just because you disagree makes it no less relevant to me. How hard is it to say, "okay, than's an interesting take. I personally disagree but to each their own."?←_______________________There's no need to go on the defensive. I didn't say I disagreed with you...I asked you specific questions. Then I presented another view, from a Christian perspective, which actually validated your view (regardless of what it's based on); that one needs to care for oneself, as opposed to over extending oneself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Ari 2 Posted November 16, 2005 Report Share Posted November 16, 2005 Originally posted by Soulsearcher@Nov 16 2005, 02:59 PMi appologize if it seemed i was defensive, gets to be a habit after a while.←________________Thank you. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snow Posted November 17, 2005 Report Share Posted November 17, 2005 Satan is known as the "father of lies"...Actually Satan is know as the step-father of lies. Marion Barry is the actual father of lies while Hillary Clinton is generally thought of as the great god-mother of lies once removed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Ari 2 Posted November 17, 2005 Report Share Posted November 17, 2005 Actually Satan is know as the step-father of lies. Marion Barry is the actual father of lies while Hillary Clinton is generally thought of as the great god-mother of lies once removed._____________________________ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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