Marriage Complex

[Plastic_Starlight]

This has been bothering me for a while now, I'm kind of hoping that if I bring it outside of my brain that it will ease a little.

The Set up.

As a YSA, you can be pretty sure that in any given fireside, or church meeting that the topic of dating and marriage WILL come up.

There is no doubt that marriage is important. Infact it is one of THE most important blessings/ordinances we can get. It's why they invented the YSA, so we can get together, date and get married.

So...

If Marriage is SO important... why are there so many who will go through out their mortal existance it out it?

From what I've seen marriage is DEFINATLY not a blessing based on merit,( if it were, I'm fairly certain Sheri Dew or Barbra Thompson would have been married decades ago) or maturity, or any tracable sort of grading system. There are so many people out there who are worthy of marriage, and yet will die, and wait for their chance in the millenium.

I know things are all based on the Lord's time. I just don't get why,if it is so important, not everyone who is worthy of it is guaranteed that blessing in this life.

anyway just wondering what other people think about this, or if I'm the only one...

[ztodd]

Think about this- why were there so many good people who lived at a time when the gospel was not on the earth?

Why have there been so many good souls born into slavery who lived as slaves their whole lives?

There is so much that we just cannot understand with our current limited view of eternity.

Have faith. The Lord knows and loves all His children individually. He does for them that which is for their best good. Be patient and humble. Prove your faith.

[MarginOfError]

This has been bothering me for a while now, I'm kind of hoping that if I bring it outside of my brain that it will ease a little.

The Set up.

As a YSA, you can be pretty sure that in any given fireside, or church meeting that the topic of dating and marriage WILL come up.

Not so. As a stake YSA rep a few years ago, I instituted it rule that marriage not be discussed in YSA meetings without my approval. I redirected the focus on the gospel and being happy individuals under the assumption that if we taught people pure doctrine and inspired them to make good choices, the marriage thing would come on its own.

There is no doubt that marriage is important. Infact it is one of THE most important blessings/ordinances we can get. It's why they invented the YSA, so we can get together, date and get married.

This is also categorically false. The YSA program was established to focus on the needs of young single adults because their needs are very different than the needs any other group of church membership. The purpose of the YSA program is the purpose of the Church--namely, to bring souls unto Christ. Anyone who believes or teaches that the purpose of the YSA program is to get people married has made a grave misunderstanding. Marriage creates more problems than it solves, and they are problems best faced by individuals with a solid testimony of the gospel.

So...

If Marriage is SO important... why are there so many who will go through out their mortal existance it out it?

Let's be clear on what's important. It isn't marriage that is important. It is entering into covenants with God in the right place and by the right authority that is important. If an individual never finds a person that he or she feels good about going to the temple and entering those covenants with, then they are in fact honoring the sacred nature of those covenants.

From what I've seen marriage is DEFINATLY not a blessing based on merit,( if it were, I'm fairly certain Sheri Dew or Barbra Thompson would have been married decades ago) or maturity, or any tracable sort of grading system.

This is because marriage is not a blessing, nor is it a privilege. It is a choice.

There are so many people out there who are worthy of marriage, and yet will die, and wait for their chance in the millenium.

I don't know what this means. I don't know where this idea comes from, and I don't know what scriptural or doctrinal evidence exists to support it.

I know things are all based on the Lord's time. I just don't get why,if it is so important, not everyone who is worthy of it is guaranteed that blessing in this life.

anyway just wondering what other people think about this, or if I'm the only one...

So, in short, my answer is that you've romanticized marriage beyond what it is in reality. Marriage is not a blessing. It is not divinely bestowed upon somebody for making righteous choices. It is chosen by people. The fact that it is so important a choice is precisely why extreme care should be made in choosing a spouse. I say kudos to any person who never marries because they never meet the person that would help them rise up to be the best person possible and fulfill all of their potential.

[Dravin]

This is because marriage is not a blessing, nor is it a privilege. It is a choice.

This. I was gonna respond to that same point with a similar comment. Curse your speed MOE! :)

Edited March 17, 2010 by Dravin

[confuzzled]

Is it hard to be single when so much of the gospel is centered around marriage/family? It is!!!!!

Even though I am not in your situation I have an extreme difficult time because dh and I can't have children. I find myself asking the very same questions and I don't have the answers. Why are some blessed when others are not? Only our Heavenly Father and His Son know the exact reason. It is in times like these when we have to put our faith and trust in Him. Is it easy? NO!!! But I do know that it is right.

(((hugs)))

P.S. dh=dear husband

[JudoMinja]

I think the Mormon community as a whole definitely suffers from a "marriage complex" in that many find themselves being pushed and prodded into marriage and enter it too quickly, without giving it the serious thought necessary. But then, the world has gone the opposite direction, avoiding marriage like the plague and treating it as nothing more than a piece of paper. Both attitudes are dangerous.

Marriage is very sacred and so are the acts commited within a marriage. Because it is so sacred, it should be entered with care. Yes, some people are just plain too picky, but many aren't picky enough.

I am a firm believer that people will live up to the expectations we place over them, as long as those expectations are attainable. Expecting someone to be Christ-like is not asking too much. Expecting someone to have focus and direction is not asking too much. Expecting someone to be strong and gentle is not asking too much.

My father made the comment concerning a man I turned down that "all guys are like that" referring to the reasons I had for turning him down. Well, "all guys" are like that, because the standards of the world have dropped and I certainly don't want to marry someone who is like "all guys". Been there, done that, went through the abuse to prove it. I have raised the bar on my expectations in the same way the church has raised the bar on who they will send on a mission.

The focus of many of the lessons and teachings of the church are centered on marriage, because family is central to the gospel. Family is the unit from which we learn most about Christ and his nature. Our parents are our example, flawed as they are, of the perfection of our Lord and Savior. When seeking a spouse, we need to find someone who will be the best example they can be to their own children.

We should never enter a marriage because we feel pushed or rushed into it. We should enter it with care, caution, study, prayer, and love. Once a commitment is made, it should be honored and not broken for anything petty. Treat marriage with the serious gravity and respect something so sacred deserves, and you will find that you may be married quickly and you may not. Either way, draw closer to Christ, work on your own perfection and salvation, and strive to be a light and beacon to others struggling along their way.

I remember going through an institute class where the instructors always brought everything around to marriage and played match-maker with the class. I couldn't stand it. Such behavior is irrespective of the sanctity of such a commitment. Now, my institute class does as it should- focuses on the gospel. Marriage will fall into place where it should so long as you continue to earnestly seek it, sincerely striving to honor its sacredness. You will not marry just "any worthy person" if you are doing this. You will take your time. You will be "picky"- to a point. You will seek someone that you truly feel you can build a Christ-centered relationship with.

If everyone raises their standards, then everyone will find themselves living a more righteous and fulfilling life, married or not.

[Plastic_Starlight]

Right

Well where to start, eh? First of all let us just clarify, when I say marriage I mean not only the temporal union of two people but also, temple marriage, the covenant that is made when you are married and sealed in the temple. This in basically a response to an argument based on semantics, and the definitions of terms.

Anyway good for your stake I guess. I know it is important for YSA to have a focus on spiritually building their members. There is no argument there. However that is not the only focus. Special as our needs are they could be met in a family ward. One of the purposes of gathering all the young adults together is to they can meet, associate, date, and enter into that covenant with God, casually referred to as “marriage”. I’ve been in YSA for 9 years. I’ve attended a few different wards in 5 different stakes in 5 different cities in that time. That does not include the YSA wards I served in my mission. Let me assure you, marriage comes up, A LOT. Whether it is the main topic or a digression that the speaker has managed to slip in, it is there. In fact, Elder Bednar came to visit us this weekend. He had quite a lot to say about marriage and the attitudes towards it in the YSA, and what an important divinely sanctioned ordinance it is. In fact check your D&C 132 you don’t achieve the highest glory without it. To me, that puts marriage in the important column, but once again it’s all semantics.

Speaking of semantics

“This is because marriage is not a blessing, nor is it a privilege. It is a choice.”

what is a blessing? Could the things that come out of marriage be considered a blessing? You know, companionship, love, children etc. no maybe not. Maybe those are all just choices too. Just like marriage is nothing but a choice.

That’s got to be one of the most asinine things I’ve read in a while. Neither Barbara Thompson nor Sheri Dew are married. According to the previously mentioned quote they must have chosen to pass up on that covenant. They must have chosen to walk thought life never having been loved enough by another person. Chosen not to have someone else want to share in the covenant of marriage with them, it's totally over-rated anyway. How can someone make a choice whether to marry or not to marry when for whatever reason someone never finds another with whom they wish to enter into the covenant with? There was a woman that worked with us on my mission. When she was 19, she got engaged. Unfortunately for this sister, the young man turned out to be a dirtbag. This sister called off the wedding, “Making the choice “not to go through with it. Now in her late 60’s she never had another opportunity. Is that a choice? She turned down a bad option and that’s is single for life? Or a friend fo mine who is now in her early 40s’ who has never been proposed to. Is that her choice? Marriage IS a blessing , it is so obviously not a privilege, and it is defiantly NOT just some cut and dry choice, and it is not a choice if you are never in the situation to make it.

There is no “romanticizing” about this. I am as aware as I can be at this stage, what marriage entails. I’m hardly some silly teenager dreaming that If we all got married our mortal lives would be perfect. It is an ordinance, like baptism, sacrament, or taking out one’s endowment, provisions are made for us that if you don’t (for whatever reason) receive those ordinances here that through proxy work you can receive them on the other side. It is different with marriage. You can’t take random names from the temple roster and seal them together.

Give your congratulations to the person who never gets married, because for whatever reason they never find their eternal companions. Just don’t be offended when it means jack all for the 60 or so years of coming home to an empty house, always wondering in the back of their minds why they don’t get to “ make the choice”, and the only answer anyone can give them is “Sometimes we don’t need to know the why, sometimes we just need to endure well, and move forward”.

[JudoMinja]

Right

Well where to start, eh? First of all let us just clarify, when I say marriage I mean not only the temporal union of two people but also, temple marriage, the covenant that is made when you are married and sealed in the temple. This in basically a response to an argument based on semantics, and the definitions of terms.

Anyway good for your stake I guess. I know it is important for YSA to have a focus on spiritually building their members. There is no argument there. However that is not the only focus. Special as our needs are they could be met in a family ward. One of the purposes of gathering all the young adults together is to they can meet, associate, date, and enter into that covenant with God, casually referred to as “marriage”. I’ve been in YSA for 9 years. I’ve attended a few different wards in 5 different stakes in 5 different cities in that time. That does not include the YSA wards I served in my mission. Let me assure you, marriage comes up, A LOT. Whether it is the main topic or a digression that the speaker has managed to slip in, it is there. In fact, Elder Bednar came to visit us this weekend. He had quite a lot to say about marriage and the attitudes towards it in the YSA, and what an important divinely sanctioned ordinance it is. In fact check your D&C 132 you don’t achieve the highest glory without it. To me, that puts marriage in the important column, but once again it’s all semantics.

Speaking of semantics

“This is because marriage is not a blessing, nor is it a privilege. It is a choice.”

what is a blessing? Could the things that come out of marriage be considered a blessing? You know, companionship, love, children etc. no maybe not. Maybe those are all just choices too. Just like marriage is nothing but a choice.

That’s got to be one of the most asinine things I’ve read in a while. Neither Barbara Thompson nor Sheri Dew are married. According to the previously mentioned quote they must have chosen to pass up on that covenant. They must have chosen to walk thought life never having been loved enough by another person. Chosen not to have someone else want to share in the covenant of marriage with them, it's totally over-rated anyway. How can someone make a choice whether to marry or not to marry when for whatever reason someone never finds another with whom they wish to enter into the covenant with? There was a woman that worked with us on my mission. When she was 19, she got engaged. Unfortunately for this sister, the young man turned out to be a dirtbag. This sister called off the wedding, “Making the choice “not to go through with it. Now in her late 60’s she never had another opportunity. Is that a choice? She turned down a bad option and that’s is single for life? Or a friend fo mine who is now in her early 40s’ who has never been proposed to. Is that her choice? Marriage IS a blessing , it is so obviously not a privilege, and it is defiantly NOT just some cut and dry choice, and it is not a choice if you are never in the situation to make it.

There is no “romanticizing” about this. I am as aware as I can be at this stage, what marriage entails. I’m hardly some silly teenager dreaming that If we all got married our mortal lives would be perfect. It is an ordinance, like baptism, sacrament, or taking out one’s endowment, provisions are made for us that if you don’t (for whatever reason) receive those ordinances here that through proxy work you can receive them on the other side. It is different with marriage. You can’t take random names from the temple roster and seal them together.

Give your congratulations to the person who never gets married, because for whatever reason they never find their eternal companions. Just don’t be offended when it means jack all for the 60 or so years of coming home to an empty house, always wondering in the back of their minds why they don’t get to “ make the choice”, and the only answer anyone can give them is “Sometimes we don’t need to know the why, sometimes we just need to endure well, and move forward”.

The long years certainly make a difference in how you face marriage. The longer you find yourself single, the more you will wonder if there was something you did wrong, some opportunity you'd passed up, some prompting you'd missed. I'm no where near fourty yet, and certainly not sixty, but I can understand how such a long wait would cause doubts, wondering, and uncertainty.

But, just the same, marriage really is a choice. It is indeed a blessing, but it is also a choice. Where it becomes difficult is in the fact that it is a TWO person choice. It takes two people to decide to get married, not just one, and so sometimes, people find themselves looking and waiting a long long time before they find someone to make that decision with them.

Probably the best question a person can ask of themself if they find they have been single well into their older years is- am I living the life Christ would want me to live? This entails every aspect of their life. Perhaps there is some area they are severly lacking in, and if they would work on it doors would be opened to them which had been previously closed, bringing the blessing of marriage into their life.

But then, maybe there is nothing of merit they need to work on- just the usual simple things as nobody is perfect. The person is already living a Christ-like life to the best of their abilities and always striving for improvement. To this person I would say- keep up the good work. This blessing will come in the Lord's time.

I cannot remember which prophet it was, but one of the prophets married in his old age after his first wife had died. His second wife is the one he is sealed to in the temple, and she waited, single well into her old age before she was able to marry him.

Another example of waiting (not exactly a marriage example but it still entails family) is Sarah, wife of Abraham. She was infertile and bore no children until the time had long past that she thought it possible to have a child before she finally bore Issac.

Sometimes, we just need to have patience, and have more patience, and always and forever have patience. Trust in the Lord. Put your faith in the Lord. Live righteously, and you will have the blessing of an eternal family, even if it is not in this life.

[BrioCyrain]

Look at it this way....it's a choice and a blessing....you choose to marry and get sealed with someone wonderful which is the blessing part.

The choice comes first..then the blessing if they are indeed your eternal companion.

Some People think romantics are superficial...but why would those who like romance want it any other way?

and always date the person for a good amount of time....no sense rushing or diving into it head first.

[Dravin]

When she was 19, she got engaged. Unfortunately for this sister, the young man turned out to be a dirtbag. This sister called off the wedding, “Making the choice “not to go through with it.

Why on earth is making the choice in scare quotes? That is exactly what she did, choose to not get married (a choice I don't fault her for making).

Edited March 17, 2010 by Dravin

[Plastic_Starlight]

Far as I know, they are not " scare quotes". They are quotation marks; a form of punctuation which have a few uses. Not the least of which being that they can be used to identify when the author is quoting or even paraphrasing another. Quotation marks can also be helpful sarcasim or irony is employed.

[Dravin]

Far as I know, they are not " scare quotes". They are quotation marks; a form of punctuation which have a few uses. Not the least of which being that they can be used to identify when the author is quoting or even paraphrasing another. Quotation marks can also be helpful sarcasim or irony is employed.

Scare quotes - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

[Plastic_Starlight]

Because Wikipedia is a reliable source for any kind of information and cannot be altered by the casual internet surfer.

[Dravin]

Because Wikipedia is a reliable source for any kind of information and cannot be altered by the casual internet surfer.

I was linking to help you know what I was talking about. Wikipedia isn't a peer reviewed journal of course, but it is a clear enough explanation of the term. Merriam-Webster is a little more highly regarded but a short one sentence explanation of the term is a touch weak when it comes to explaining it to someone apparently unfamiliar with the term.

Considering that scare quotes are an application of quotation marks bloviating about how you were using quotation marks is kinda like insisting your macaroni and cheese doesn't use macaroni, it uses pasta! If your use of quotation marks was simply to quote and not to indicate a non-acceptance or skepticism/derision of the term so encased all you had to do was state such and be aware that your usage may be communicating something unintended.

Edited March 19, 2010 by Dravin