Pluto

[rosie321]

Amazing. While it really doesn't make too much difference what its called to me personally in and of itself.

It's just that Pluto has been known and taught to be a planet for so many years. Today it was voted on not to be a planet by a few people (who I'd hazard a quess most don't even know who they are). Most people probably did not know the vote was going on. Nor have any say. Yet now because of their vote, it will now be "airbrushed"out of all textbooks. I'm not saying the scientists who determined this were right or wrong yet it defineatly raises a lot of interesting thoughts.

Like how different truths have evolved over time or maybe even hijacked by the "chosen" ones.

That truth seems to be no more than the culturally accepted thing of the time, able to be voted on.

If it is not accepted by the top it is just voted out and "airbrushed" out of our minds.

How a few people can determine truth for everyone.....Amazing.

What really is truth?

[Maureen]

....Today it was voted on not to be a planet by a few people (who I'd hazard a quess most don't even know who they are). Most people probably did not know the vote was going on. Nor have any say. Yet now because of their vote, it will now be "airbrushed"out of all textbooks. I'm not saying the scientists who determined this were right or wrong yet it defineatly raises a lot of interesting thoughts.

Little Pluto, formerly the solar system's smallest planet, has been stripped of its status by the International Astronomical Union, reducing the number of planets to eight.

The new guidelines — introduced in Prague on Thursday after a week of debate by the 2,500 astronomers at the organization's conference — define what is a planet and what is not. Pluto didn't make the cut....

from: Pluto demoted under new definition of planet

http://www.cbc.ca/technology/story/2006/08...to-planets.html

What is the galaxy coming to!?

M.

[Dr T]

Hi Rosie,

What really is truth?

That is a good question. It sounds like you think that because things have changed "true becomes relative or socially sectioned." I would agree with you that culture and the zeitgeist do play a role in knowledge but as far as absolute truth such as logic, I view those differently.

Dr. T

[rosie321]

[

i]Little Pluto, formerly the solar system's smallest planet, has been stripped of its status by the International Astronomical Union, reducing the number of planets to eight.

The new guidelines — introduced in Prague on Thursday after a week of debate by the 2,500 astronomers at the organization's conference — define what is a planet and what is not. Pluto didn't make the cut....

Ok my choice was words was bad and exaggerated. Was an attempt at starting some somewhat thoughtful discussion on a different topic.

But you have to admit on our planet of so many people 2,500 is miniscule :)

Most people probably never even heard of this union before or knew of their not so little convention ..

The fact that remains to me is that these people are determining truth for everyone with whatever guidelines they make up. Truth that alters the way people think about things and what people are taught. It may be scientifically based and true but its a power that I am concerned about people having.

While outter space really doesn't make much difference in every day life to the average person. Thus the reason that most people never heard of it. What difference might it make in more important or relevant areas? Just something that made me go mmmm..

What is the galaxy coming to!?

I don't know

We're losing whole planets right before our eyes. :)

[Maureen]

The fact that remains to me is that these people are determining truth for everyone with whatever guidelines they make up. Truth that alters the way people think about things and what people are taught. It may be scientifically based and true but its a power that I am concerned about people having.

IMO, of all these people to make such decisions, I think astronomers are the best qualified.

While outter space really doesn't make much difference in every day life to the average person. Thus the reason that most people never heard of it. What difference might it make in more important or relevant areas? Just something that made me go mmmm..

I'm going to speculate that if you were around in the 16th century you would have been anti-Copernicanism:

Copernicus and Copernicanism

Nicolaus Copernicus.Copernicus' theory is of extraordinary importance in the history of human knowledge. Many authors suggest that only a few other persons have exerted a comparable influence on human culture in general and on science in particular.[citation needed]

Many meanings have been ascribed to Copernicus' theory, apart from its strictly scientific import. His work affected religion as well as science, dogma as well as freedom of scientific inquiry. Copernicus' rank as a scientist is often compared with that of Galileo.

Copernicus' work contradicted then-accepted religious dogma: it could be inferred that there was no need of an entity (God) that granted a soul, power and life to the World and to human beings — science could explain everything that was attributed to Him.

Copernicanism, however, also opened a way to immanence, the view that a divine force, or a divine being, pervades all things that exist — a view that has since been developed further in modern philosophy. Immanentism also leads to subjectivism: to the theory that it is perception that creates reality, that there is no underlying reality that exists independent of perception. Thus some argue that Copernicanism demolished the foundations of medieval science and metaphysics.

A corollary of Copernicanism is that scientific law need not be congruent with appearance. This contrasts with Aristotle's system, which placed much more importance on the derivation of knowledge through the senses....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nicolaus_Cope...d_Copernicanism

M.

[Dr T]

Hi Rosie,

It is not a "popular vote" thing. Here is a clip from LA Times 8/24/06 talking a little about it.

"Pluto's out," said Michael Brown, the Caltech astronomer whose discovery of UB313 last year provoked the debate over whether Pluto should be considered a planet. "People are going to be unhappy, but it's the right thing to do."

Brown said he was mildly disappointed that his own discovery, which he has nicknamed Xena, would not become a planet. But scientifically there was little doubt, he said, that it was a mistake to make Pluto a planet when it was discovered 76 years ago.

The vote today by the 87-year-old international body — which is given the sole authority to name and classify astronomical objects — was a reversal of a recommendation of an elite committee that had come up with a definition several weeks ago that would have preserved Pluto's status.

The definition stated that all an object needed to win planetary classification was to be massive enough to have a round shape and orbit the sun. Under that definition, not only Pluto and Xena but also Ceres and Pluto's moon Charon would be planets. But that wouldn't have been the end of it. Brown estimated that as many as 53 objects met the definition.

That flexible definition caused a revolt among the nearly 3,000 members of the IAU, who decided that scientists were tying themselves into rhetorical knots simply to keep Pluto as a planet. The membership applauded loudly when the vote was taken to declassify Pluto as a planet.

As you can see, those in the scientific discipline, as a large contingent agreed that it makes valid sense to declassify Pluto for such and such a reason. It is based on a definition. I'm not taking away the idea that it is odd. It's not a moral issue.

Just some thoughts,

Dr. T

[Palerider]

we had a vote here and Pluto won.....its still a Planet.........

[Dr T]

Hi Palerider,

That is a load off my mind. Shooooo!! Wait, who voted in your voters?! Uh oh, back to the drawing board... :)

[Palerider]

my family here at home....we voted........we decided to keep pluto.........

[Dr T]

I just need to know, did your family follow the voting rules? Was the vote cast in a private booth? Were they being pressured by the mob? Did you unlawfully sway the voters in any way? Some officials might have to come do an investigation.

[rosie321]

Palerider, all plutonians that ever might have been wish to communicate thanks to you and your family for your overriding vote on their behalf

DrT well I would hazard a guess its all ok with the voting. After all there is the LDS priesthood holder involved :) But then again... :)

You guys are too funny

[Dr T]

I demand a recount! I mean, I'm sure there were "hanging chads!!"

[rosie321]

Sorry Dr. T , but you came to the wrong place to question hanging chads. That might work any place else but hanging chads are irrelevant here .

This is LDS Talk. Proporting LDS values. LDs operate under different rules. Its the church with the truth and restoration. The most correct. Don't join any other...

Don't you know the truth that was lost yesterday was just restored through his family's faithful revelation? :) .

I'm sure they felt a burning something on this one or at least they should of. (or I will soon for these comments. What that burning is is yet to be determined. But hey thats an extra bonus for LDS-no hell! I may just need to steal some kind of beam for that outter darkness though. It may be kinda dark in there. Who knows maybe its on Pluto

Maybe we should double check with Pres. Hinckley :) .

Ok I defineately need some sleep before I totally get myself beyond help.....

[Dr T]

Rosie,

I don't see why you could be "beyond help," as you say. From what you are saying, it sounds like you just need to have a "new rev." and get a burning sensation and all will be well. You're ok with me. :)

Dr. T

[Palerider]

well....we just did the vote quick and easy.....I said all in favor say...aye......all oppose say nay.....there were no nays....it was a landslide......

[Dr T]

Ok. Palerider, it was a unanimous vote. The results show, "Pluto is still a planet in your home." Good enough for me.

[daenvgiell]

Yeah I think it's silly how Pluto is no longer called a planet, it wasn't hurting anyone by being there, but no, now it has to be a dwarf planet sometimes I wonder what people think.

[miztrniceguy]

Yeah I think it's silly how Pluto is no longer called a planet, it wasn't hurting anyone by being there, but no, now it has to be a dwarf planet sometimes I wonder what people think.

so will it be riding a short bus around the solar system?

[john doe]

<div class='quotemain'>

Yeah I think it's silly how Pluto is no longer called a planet, it wasn't hurting anyone by being there, but no, now it has to be a dwarf planet sometimes I wonder what people think.

so will it be riding a short bus around the solar system?

No, the short bus is for the "special" planets.

[daenvgiell]

<div class='quotemain'>

<div class='quotemain'>

Yeah I think it's silly how Pluto is no longer called a planet, it wasn't hurting anyone by being there, but no, now it has to be a dwarf planet sometimes I wonder what people think.

so will it be riding a short bus around the solar system?

No, the short bus is for the "special" planets.

Well Pluto will always be a "special" planet in my eyes

[Dr T]

Those last few posts were great!

[LionHeart]

"Special"? Is that what they call it these days? Do they also get their own class room at school?

[Dr T]

"Special Ed."

[john doe]

When my oldest came home all excited that she was going into the "Access" program at school (for accelerated students), I teased her that when I was young it was called Special Ed and they were held in the trailer on the side of the school. She didn't think it was very funny when she found out what Special Ed really was.

[Dr T]

I could have also used, "Special Olympics" as an example. I have been thinking about my joking about this and started to feel bad that people might interpret my jocularity as making fun of people with learning/developmental disabilities. I just want you all to know, that was not my intention. If it came across that way, I apologize to everyone.

Dr. T