justamere10

Fair enough. Except for your choice of screen names. :)

I understand you better now, thanks for revealing your apostate status. Your screen name in my opinion is deceiving, sort of the proverbial 'wolf in sheep's clothing' is it not? Why do you use such a screen name when you are not an LDS missionary and are in fact critical of the Church and gospel you once believed to be true?

"And now, verily I say unto you, and this is wisdom, make unto yourselves friends with the mammon of unrighteousness, and they will not destroy you." D&C 82: 22 Doctrine and Covenants 82 I think the Prophet knows where the Lord is leading His Church. If the parable of the ten virgins is meant to be the members of the LDS Church, then even though we may lose half of our membership during the times of sifting because they didn't make enough right choices to be prepared, we will have gained the other 50%. Being in the limelight as we are now adds to our overall membership numbers. These are great times to live, the fields are absolutely white ready to harvest. Why wait another hour to thrust in your sickle and reap? You can serve an unofficial mission right now from your own home, as an LDS Cyber Missionary.

Good counsel, thank-you.

That's why we have a Profit at the head of our church.

It's mere speculation on my part but it is possible that we will take the gospel to every nation, kindred, tongue and people by doing cyber missionary work. The Church does have branches in mainland China right now but we are not allowed to proselyte there. We could register but that would give the Chinese government the right to appoint our bishops and branch presidents. The Church has a very good relationship with the government in Beijing and carefully abides by their laws. Having recently served as a senior missionary in Macau, China I am aware of the eagerness for the gospel of some of the mainland Chinese. We are allowed to proselyte in Hong Kong and Macau.

Perhaps more correctly, "all things are .... into one great whole." That takes away many of the fears and tears.

Many members of the LDS Church continue to seek learning and understanding from books that are not in our canon. That may or may not be a good thing to do, depending possibly on the degree to which we give heed to the disclaimer that such books are not official LDS doctrine and that the author/s speaks for him/herself, and to the degree that doing so takes away from time we could have spent studying our canonized revelations directly.A case in point is the well-known book (several versions) "Mormon Doctrine" by Elder Bruce R. McConkie formerly of the Twelve (now deceased) which I think is the book you are referring to. According to the authors of a new book titled "David O. McKay and the Rise and Fall of Modern Mormonism" brother McConkie's book was never authorized by the First Presidency because they knew such a book written by a General Authority would indeed be considered authorititive even though it would contain on many topics only the opinions and understandings of the author, rather than revelation on the matter from the Lord. Apparently two members of the First Presidency reviewed the book "Mormon Doctrine" and found more than a thousand incidences of exactly the above where an opinion was rendered but there was nothing revealed by the Lord on the matter. (E.g. evolution.) Elder McConkie was a spiritual giant, there is no doubt about that, and I will always remember his final testimony in General Conference. But his book "Mormon Doctrine" is NOT in our canon and as such we will not be held accountable by God for what is written in it.

There is of course a huge amount of scripture demonstrating that the glorious "Second Coming" of Jesus Christ will be "a massive, global event" and not just an individual revelation, though many people do get a personal witness of the Savior as another matter. "Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they also which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen." Revelation 1: 7 Word Search: second coming

Perhaps it was just a typing error on your part. God does not lie, Jesus Christ WILL return in glory as He said He would. We just don't know the exact time that will occur. Signs of the times including fulfilled prophesies are indicating that we are not too far away from that event happening.

How about something like "Ye shall have no other natural Father before me." Meaning I and only I am your natural Parent, so don't forget it and don't be thinking you can adopt yourself to another man and he will take my place, he never can, I am your one and only natural Heavenly Parent.

By "accountable" I meant responsible for in the judgment of others. With respect, I think that we are more likely to be judged by the laws we are aware of on earth than by any other deeper doctrine or understanding taught to us directly by God. But of course I may be wrong, that's up to Him. It just seems more just that we would be judged by our obedience or lack of obedience to those things we bring into our limited mortal awareness. Even great revelations from God must then be filtered through our physical faculties prior to it becoming part of our mortal awareness and understanding.

Everyone is unique of course but for me understanding the concepts recently discussed in this thread is really quite simple. God is God only to His own spirit children! A God is a Heavenly Parent. Heavenly Father is not a dictator or whatever anymore than earthly parents are (or should be) to their own children. He is our FATHER and always will be the one and only natural Father of our spirit bodies. Why shouldn't at least some of His children 'grow up' and become like Him? He would then become those children's Grandfather and be edified and glorified through their works and their children in turn, similar to grandparents being proud of their grandchildren. It's not hard to get a grasp of the matter if we come to a complete awareness that God, the universe and everything is just a family affair. Everything tangible is designed to help teach God's children to make right choices, grow up, and become like Him. We've forgotten for our turn on earth, but things like creating planets perhaps used to be like building houses on earth, not so difficult if you study up on how to do it and have the tools, materials and permissions needed. In our mortal role as fathers, mothers, sons, daughters, we are approximating as closely as possible the true order of Heaven, practicing for the real thing. That is why sexual sin outside of the bounds God has instructed is so abominable to Him. Not all of God's children are going to 'grow up' and become like Him anymore than all of the children of the president of a corporation are going to grow up and be qualified to take over the corporation, even though he might wish they would. It's a matter of personal choices... That's how I see it, that's what I am comfortable with, that understanding may not be for everyone.

I'm sure you are assuming that we have a correct version of what Joseph Smith taught as doctrine and principles. My understanding is that scribes in those days often wrote as if they were the person they were writing for and sometimes wrote sometime later from memory (and memory possibly corrupted by their own interpretations/understandings and maybe even that of others they discussed it with.) There is also the matter of prophets being human and fallible, and not always speaking for God. As members of the LDS Church I think we should only be held accountable for that which is in our canon and official statements from the First Presidency.

It seems that you have had some different experiences with missionary work. I very much disagree with your idea that missionaries are salesmen out to make a "sale". I think it much more accurate to consider faithful missionaries as teachers of righteousness. They present to investigators a summary of God's Plan of Happiness and bear their own living testimonies of its truthfulness and eternal benefits. The Holy Spirit speaks to the investigators in His own way and that Spirit is what converts, not the missionaries. Missionaries are expected to be obedient to their mission president and on down through zone and district leaders. As they keep the rules and live temple worthy and anxiously engage in the good cause set before them each morning, the Holy Spirit guides them and "coincidence" miracles occur almost daily. Door knocking may not be the most effective way to get teaching opportunties, but door knocking is a frequent experience most likely for most young missionaries in most missions. I fail to understand why you are arguing with me if you are in fact an experienced LDS Missionary and a faithful member of the LDS Church, as your screen name implies.

I don't think I said anything about God "punishing" missionaries. Don't they teach the young missionaries at MTC's to be obedient to their mission president? When mission presidents arrive at their new mission home they deliberately have very little if any time with the outgoing president. That is so each mission president relies on the Spirit. The Spirit may emphasize door knocking in some missions at some times. Young men and women learn a great deal while serving missions that can transfer to useful knowledge for the rest of their lifetimes. That could include foreign language and culture, discipline, obedience, hard work, leadership, cooperation, personal revelation, charity...

And because you will at that time have reached perfection, what mortals call "worship" may be understood as love, your own children calling home.

Yes, perhaps even more so than in the real world everyone needs to keep a careful watch for unsavory things in cyberspace, there are certainly a lot of those around. One of the best tools we have in addition to our delete key is summed up in the word: IGNORE!

Meridian Magazine published an article today about Cyber Missionary work. I think they have about 500,000 online subscribers, so maybe more cyber missionaries will come on board over the next few weeks. These are exciting times in response to Elder Ballard's recent talks and the front page article in July's Ensign. Here's a link to the article: http://www.ldsmag.com/articles/080829cyber.html

The Brethren are aware of what's happening on the Internet and things are moving along well, especially at Newsroom - The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints At present though as far as I know "cyber missionary" calls are being unofficially extended by the Spirit. I personally think if anyone has the desire to do the work they are called. I wouldn't turn down a call for another real world mission of course, but I feel that I am already serving full-time from my home. I take my badge off when I leave the house though. :)

That's wonderful, thank-you for sharing your experience. I think there is going to be an abundant harvest in the real world from the efforts of hopefully thousands of LDS Cyber Missionaries to respond to basic questions and encourage nonmembers to visit official LDS websites where they can be taught the truth about our beliefs.

You have done your best when you have forsaken the sin or weakness you are struggling with for just one more hour - then another - then another. :) We need to never confuse temptation with sin. Temptation may always be with us, but sin need not be because we can never be tempted beyond our power to resist. The most powerful tool we have to resist temptation is summed up in one single word: IGNORE! Never let temptation get you down, it's a human experience and necessary for our learning, it's not a weakness. When that familiar acquaintance, temptation, settles upon you just smile, ignore it, and keep on DOING the things you know God would have you do... Works for me.

Right, it's a difference of opinion/understanding about the nature of God.Latter-day Saints of course do not believe that all of God's children will 'grow up' to become as He is anymore than the owner of a corporation would find that each of his ten children would qualify to be chairperson of the board or CEO. There's that little matter of mortal freedom to choose among opposites such as good and evil, light and darkness, virtue and vice etc. each accummulating choice adding to the probability of eternal consequences. There is a great deal of controversy over when life (soul/spirit/ghost in the machine) enters an unborn human body. In your view, at what point in lineal time (as we commonly discuss it) does God create those spirits? And, because such a discussion would be controversial, how could we know for sure?

Meridian Magazine published an article today about Cyber Missionary work. I think they have about 500,000 online subscribers, so maybe more cyber missionaries will come on board over the next few weeks. These are exciting times in response to Elder Ballard's recent talks and the front page article in July's Ensign. Here's a link to the article: http://www.ldsmag.com/articles/080829cyber.html

With respect, I think that your use of the word "subjects" points perhaps to a difference of understanding about the nature of God the Father. Yes, if we think of God as being similar to a temporal king or ruler or dictator, even though we may consider Him to be benevolent, we would, perhaps because of our revulsion towards pride and arrogance, think it repulsive that we would ever want to be a God. Yet we strive to become like Him. But if we can grasp an understanding that God the Father is literally the Parent of our spirit bodies, and we are literally His sons and daughters, then we can perhaps understand that we are not "subjects" of God anymore than our earthly children are subjects to us as the parents of their physical bodies. It helps me understand God, the universe, and everything much better when I consider all that to be just a family affair. In our earthly roles as father, mother, sons, daughters, we are approximating as closely as we possibly can on earth the order of heaven - we are practicing for the time when we too will be grownups. God's commandments are not the dictates of a king, they are the instructions of a loving Parent who wants us to come Home to Him and knows that if we will only obey those instructions we will find our way back. In obedience to His counsel we walk the strait and narrow path that leads most securely back to where we came from. God is not God to anyone except His own children! That's why there is only one God for us, only one natural Parent. Why shouldn't we strive to grow up and become like our Father in every way, including after an enormous amount of instruction and learning, being authorized to have our own "eternal increase", our own CHILDREN? Below is a link to more information on this subject: Ask a Mormon - LDS Cyber Missionaries Forum lds1.org • View topic - Gods - Plural .