FlaviusHambonius
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Posts posted by FlaviusHambonius
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Well, speaking from personal experience I can tell you that the pain in getting a tatoo and getting one removed is like night and day--physically and financially speaking.
Years ago I got a couple of tatoos with one of them having to be re-done about three times with more ink and different colors.
My arm felt like tenderized meat on that particulair one. Most of them are not bad as far as pain.
But here comes the kicker--years later I decided to get rid of the one that had been re-shaded a few times--I just didn't like it anymore and then decided since I was getting rid of the one, I might as well get rid of the other (which I rather liked)
Long story short when I had them laser removed--the pain was incredible while they were doing they're treatment. It took about 22 treatments -- one every month-- on the one it took forever to get out because colors take much longer to get out, whereas just black ink is quite easy to remove.
Finally to get the last bit out they had to cut about a 3" by 1/2 strip and then another section of 2" by 1/2 strip off of my arm and then suture the skin back together.
What resulted when it all healed up was a scar that looks like a cross with the surounding areas of the pigment being removed from the laser.
The original intension of the tatoos were of religious meaning--but the star being removed wound up a cross after the skin removal.
I just told everybody I was starting a new fad -- scar and skin pigmintation tatoos.
What cost me about $100 to get the tatoos put on--cost me about $2500 to get removed in the final analysis.
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If that is the case, than we can leave out ministering spirits who do this type of tasking....:)
Very true, but I wouldn't rule it out (translated beings participating) under certain conditions. Probably rarely but nonetheless possible--just speculation on my part.
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I have often wondered if they could be involved in the hierarchy of governments or some affluent position--such as a Joseph--Pharoh type connection or would they be connected to something more like suffering third world countries that are suffering and starving--kind of a compassionate service like a Mother Teresa capacity.
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Maybe they would do that if you are needed somewhere or something like that.
Could very well be--maybe the desperation of the prayer and what dire circumstances were involved--that's what I was thinking.
Good point Marty.
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Hemi, I wasn't talking about people being translated off the earth, I'm talking about people who simply stayed here (and stayed, and stayed.....)
Yes, I have only heard about John and the three Nephites that were allowed to 'Tarry' the earth.
I think most of us have also heard some of the stories where someone's car is broken down out in the middle of nowhere and suddenly a man appears and helpd the man with the broken down.
As soon as the man fires the automobile up and looks around to thank the person--they're gone.
I'm sure most of this could be folklore and such, as I'm sure they would have much more important things going on......but if you are stranded out in the middle of nowhere and desperate--how great would that be!
It does make you wonder what they are doing, where they mostly dwell?-- do the three Nephites ever re-unite at times or does John ever hook up with them and compare notes or do they usually dwell by themselves?
I'm sure they are about the Lord's buisness whatever it is--who knows if there could be more out there 'Tarrying' about the earth--Interesting.
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I don't know if it would help, Flavius, but Richard Bushman addresses Joseph's polygamy in a way I had never thought of before. This is in his book, Rough Stone Rolling.
I'm not saying it will completely ease your mind, but it does give a certain perspective that may help.
Elphaba
Yes, I have read RRR and thought it was great and listened to some audio awhile back of Bushman and his thoughts on the book. It was a great read and a great listen.
I even bought the book for two of my sisters.
Maybe I need to go back and read some of the chapters that deal with polygamy.
Maybe if you don't mind sometime, you could give me a couple of your observations, I value your opinion greatly--if not, no worries--maybe I can pick up on what you did.
Thanks
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Not at all. Let me share my sometimes "extreme" examples, like my wife says.
Imagine I feel I do not like my wife. I do not find her attractive, I do not want to be with her and I feel I do not love her any more. Delhi's advise equate to: "Well, stay with her just for the kids...go ahead and have a fling here and there so you can take care of your sexual needs...don't bother her or tell her how ugly she is...just be nice to her...have a date with a pretty girl now and again but be discrete...don't make waves at home just hang in there..."
Instead of listening to these self appointed sages, we should head to the counsel of the brethren. If sin has entered into your live in thought or in deed, repent. Seek the counsel of your priesthood leaders, avail yourself of help within the fellowship, do ALL things necessary to strengthen your faith and your marriage. Cast out of your heart and your mind the thoughts the enemy has planted therein. Remember your covenants with the Lord and the calling to which you have been called. Remember how kind, merciful and forgiving the Lord has been with you all the days of your live. Remember that you once loved this woman, and promised before Him and witnesses to care, provide, protect and honor her. Do whatever it takes, no mater how much and how long to preserve what the Lord has consecrated.
That would be the right kind of advise, don't you think?
Or maybe we can use your infidelity scenerio a little differently:
Maybe you thought that your wife was as true blue as they get, as far as being a faithful partner to you. One day you started to see some differences in her behaviour and little nuances that you had never noticed before. You had even heard from a couple of freinds that they suspected she was not being faithfull to you. But she never approached you about the truth of the matter and you never confronted her about this so called infidelity and so you kept it to yourself---you were in denial that your precious wife could ever do such a thing--it was just not possible.
So one day it just came to a hilt and it was eating you up. So you decided to go out sniffing around and do a little investigating on your own. You were devastated to find out that in fact your wife had been living a life of infidelity.
But your wife never did approach you with the fact that she was unfaithful to you.
Your wife = church history
Most of us growing up never knew much about controversial history within the church, it was always the candy-coated version in Sunday school up through seminary classes, in fact we didn't know it was the candy-coated version--we just thought that was the only version albeit it was only minimal information regarding church history.
Don't get me wrong I wouldn't expect a Sunday school teacher to bring up the Adam-God Theory or the exploits of Joseph Smiths Polygamy etc.
Those were the years to be taught about The Father--The Saviour--The Plan of Salvation.
But the long and short of it is that most people in the church as they mature they will know nothing of this so called church history and many still don't unless they start sniffing around and studying it out for themselves.
The church is certainly not going to go out of it's way to lay it all out on a silver platter for members, they never have--It is upon the member to find out on his or her own.
I will say the church has come along way in getting out controversial information about it's history.
We have FAIR Apologetics--FARM--Shields--Mormon Fortress and other web-sites.
We have books like Rough Stone Rolling and many others. We have reputable scholars and historians who paint a different picture other than black and white.
Years ago I used to be black and white for the most part, but for the last several years I have opened up my mind and love reading about issues in the church that are not set in stone.
And yes people who do this reading and researching sometimes have questions. But in many instances it has only made my faith stronger in many areas.
Anyway I didn't mean to use infidelity as my example to get my message across, I just took the cue from you and ran with it--maybe it didn't make any sense--I tried.
My point is that we all have different journeys to reach our conclusions about truth and our faith.
If you think that Dehlin's comments are nothing but 'garbage' as you say--you have the right to believe as you will and so do I.
I'm not saying I agree with everything he said--but I do think he made some good observations.
It's all in the eyes of the beholder.
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Thanks for the heads up Pam.
I have heard about this movie and would love to see it. It really boggles my mind that people actually believe that this horrific occurence never happened.
When I was in the third grade I used to go through these books in the school library about the war, but most of it was about the Holacaust. It was like a encyclopedia series with literally hundreds and hundreds of pictures of the victims, alive and dead, the massive burial holes with all of those poor souls heaped into them. Pictures that remain ingrained in ones mind.
I'm sure they would never have books such as these in grade school nowadays.
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Especially me Pam.
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What happened to the good old days when if you were going to catch a buzz you were very discreet about it?
Instead of a baseball bat, perhaps the Mother should have pulled out the 'ol fire-exstinguisher' (I know everyone has one of those, don't they?) and emptied it all over the guy and his pipe.
I mean what if that Mother had busted that dude up the side of his head and killed him?
Oh well, I guess desperate things require desperate means if your in the moment.
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Perhaps your hard work has something to do with it. Most people who prosper work very hard for it, and there's nothing wrong with that.
Elphaba
I agree.
And on the flipside, there are many hardworking, humble, God-fearing people who always remain poor.
There are huge amounts of people in third-world nations who are starving every day.
Is God punishing them? I don't think so.
Astral,
As far as your spiritual life, those are your choices.
You have some rotten people who are millionaires, and you have some wonderful people with wonderful hearts that will always be poor and hurting in temporal needs.
I suppose it will all come out in the wash someday in a thing called life-review.
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Maybe the ward could put on a function at the wardhouse once a month like a movie or some kind of activity where they could have refreshments like soda, popcorn, cookies and ice cream. That way they could have their sweets and treats and chips and dips once in awhile.
That would have of course have to follow a pot luck of good old Hungarian Goolash as the main course if possible.
That way you would get a staple of nourishment and some treats.
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Darkness on The Edge of Town---Bruce Springsteen
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Shaun,
It seems as though your pounding down a ton of simple carbs ie. candy bars, chocolote bread rolls, chocolote twists, chips, crumpets etc.
The thing about this junk is that you can eat a simple carb such as a big fat doughnut and in less than a couple of hours if that dozen box of doughnuts is still there--those poor things don't stand a chance, they will be gone.
Simple carbs usually always make you crave more in a short amount of time--especially pastries it seems.
I know because I used to sleep walk downstairs in the wee hours of the night grab whatever kind of sweets that were there and leave a trail all the way back to my bed.
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Sorry,
The book is called 'Body for Life' 12 Weeks to Mental and Physical Strength by Bill Phillips and Michael D' Orso.
It was a #1 New York Times Bestseller for many moons, and if you really stick with the program I can attest and a few freinds at my work can attest that it works.
It is designed to change your way of thinking--mentally and physically for the rest of your life not for just a few weeks.
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A few years back I tried a diet called 'Fit for Life' by Bill Phillips and lost about 35 lbs in a 3 month period. I got off of this diet/workout program and went back to eating what I wanted basically (usually on the go junk) and got away from excercising and wala, I gained that 35 lbs back quicker than you can say 'Jimmy Crack Corn and I dont Care'
The program in essence educates you in eating 6 small meals a day with 2 cups of water per meal, and also gets your metabolism adjusted to that amount.
One portion complex cabohydrate--one portion protein. Each portion being the size of your fist.
What you are trying to do is to eat like a grazing deer would, several times a day--small amounts. As opposed to a Bear, who eats massive amounts in a day and then is lethargic and lays down to sleep (not to be confused with hibernation)
Cut out all the simple carbs such as pasteries, candies etc and replace them with complex carbs such as brown rice, baked potato, low-fat yogurt, whole wheat bread (not to exceed 2 slices a day) and any kind of fruit--apple, orange, cantaloupe etc.
Proteins such as Salmon, can of tuna fish (I prefer albacore, but more expensive) cottage cheese, serving of chicken or turkey or lean meat.
2 servings of vegtables a day.
Workout with weights--upper body one day--then cardiovascular excercise the next day--then weights lower body the next day--then a cardio the next day--weights upper body the next day--then cardio the next day.
Then on the 7th day is your free day--no weights, no excercise and guess what? You can eat anything you want and as much as you want. ( I used to really love that day)
Then it's back to the grindstone the next day.
Workouts are designed to last from 20-30 minutes. Crunches are also included on the lower body workout if I remember correctly.
This past weekend I had chest pains and spent 5 hours in the emergency ward, so I will be getting back on this diet/excercise program pronto.
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I hope that she will come around and join me at some point. It may also help that she has a few friends that are members as well, but they don't go to our ward. I really think she would like it if she would try. Most of the things she says makes her feel uncomfortable in church do not happen in the LDS church. As I, she really doesn't like the "show" that alot of churches put on at their services.
Yes, your absoulutly right that she wouldn't observe a 'show' in an LDS ward. Quite tame and low-key. No bands, no robes, no burning incense. She might find fast and testimony meetings a little dramatic of course and lets not leave out those church Basketball games, that could be a real eye opener for her--she might learn a few new cuss words.
I used to be amazed--opening prayer before the game, and then it was on.
I find it interesting that your wife doesn't like institutionalized religion--that she say's worship is between the person and God, but yet gets a little bummed out when you talk about the Holy Ghost or scripture from the Bible in your house. It sounds like she wants the person to worship in private.
I think it is sad that she doesn't want to attend your Baptism--even though she has no interest, it is something that is important to you. We all have the right to choose, but I will adventure to say she might regret this decision some day perhaps.
Who knows, she may even change her mind and go.
Whatever the case, just try to be the best example of your new found belief, and the rest will take care of itself.
You have my admiration for standing for what you beleive to be true.
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I thought the article was fairly well written with a certain common sense approach to it for people who have had their testimonies of the church and Joseph Smith negatively affected.
For many growing up in the church and learning the standard version of the history of the church only later in life to find out through study that it was in some cases a whole different story can really affect that certain individual. So it's easy to see how it could affect a new convert finding out more historical information regarding LDS history.
I know in my own case, I have had some problems dealing with some of the issues. But through study and searching out I have come to conclusions which I have come to peace with.
On other issues I have not come to a peaceful place as of yet. But it is a journey and I will keep searching.
For example when I read Mormon Enigma: Emma Hale Smith--The Polygamy issue bothered me much more than it had previously and still remains a thorn in my side that I would love to pluck out someday.
When I read stories about such people as Zina Diantha Huntington Jacobs Smith Young it certainly doesn't help.
Perhaps the article that was provided by the OP will seem to stalwart LDS as just some wishy washy Mormons who can't grasp the truth, but perhaps may indeed be just the vehicle needed to grasp onto in they're journey.
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1. Yes - when Phil Spector went to prison, they made him take off his wig for a reason. The reason is that wigs are not allowed in prison.
http://i.cdn.turner.com/trutv/thesmokinggun.com/graphics/art4/0609091philspector1.jpg
2. No - God does not care if people wear wigs in prison or not.
3. ???? What is the way that, as you say, things should be? Wigless?
Handsome little devil isn't he?
The height board behind him is considered his new 'Wall of Sound'
So, yes everything is as it should be.
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I have been reading the book 'Shaken Faith Syndrome: Strengthening One's Testimony In The Face of Criticism and Doubt' by Michael R. Ash.
I believe that this book can be of tremendous help for those in the church struggling with issues of the church and I also believe that it could be of great help to non-LDS investigating the church. I also wish that every LDS critic would read this book.
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Wow there are some excellent responses here. I really have got a lot to think about.
Islander-I think u are right I am a bit of a rebel!
However, when I said someone commented on my dress I was genuinely shocked. To me, It was suitable for church. Now, I wont spend my life trying to please others so I will take the advice here and ignore these people.Palerider-What I like about the church. Its familiar, its a comfort in some ways, it gives a focus to peoples lives. Its a community. However, those things can sometimes be negatives too. Although that applies to much of life.
What I meant by 'non-church' thoughts are that if I think something against what the church teaches-such as, I want another piercing-that must be 'Satan'. Why cant it just be me?? I feel it kind of takes away who I am as a person blaming stuff like that on Satan when really its me. It might be different to the churches view, but that doesn't mean it is bad. Does that make sense?
Faded, u are spot on. I really should write these down. I do believe in God and Jesus, but I'm not sure, like most people in the world. I hope its true and they are more likely to exist than not in my opinion. (I love the world and nature and don't see how it was an accident). I BELIEVE. I don't know if I feel that God loves me or not. I never think about it. The honest truth is that I don't really care whether he does or not-That sounds a bit harsher than I meant it to. What I mean is, I don't feel I need to feel that way. I do pray, but I'm kind of doing it as an experiment at the moment so I don't feel much from it.
However, great responses guys. I'm really going to ponder all this during the weekend and church tomorrow. Thanks so much!!!!
SoulSearcher,
I would like to ask a favor of you when you go to church this weekend, but more specifically when you are in Sacrament meeting.
I would ask that you ponder deeply and sincerly the 'Passion'. I would ask that you visualize the Saviour in the 'Garden of Gethsemene' pleading to his Father and your Father as he was taking all sin, all hurts, all injustices, all sorrows, all heartbrokeness,
all pain total and complete--drinking from the bitter cups and enduring to the end.
Why? Because of his love for his Father and to fulfill his will.
Picture in your mind the incomprehensible suffering that caused the Lord to bleed great droplets of blood even to make his garments appear as crimson.
Then comes the arrest--the beating along the way-- the imprisonment in a dungeon hanging from his wrists all night. Then the appearence before Herod and Pilate.
Then comes the flogging with metalic and bone bits emmbedded into leather tassles ripping
and tearing into the skin and muscle of the Saviour.
Then having a briar thornbush embedded into his skull and having to endure carrying the crossbeam through the streets while being mocked and spat upon.
Then upon entering the place of Golgotha--the Saviour partook of the second bitter cup,
having spikes driven through his wrists, hands and feet and having the beam slammed into the ground causing more rips and tears into the Lords sinews.
Then the Lord had to often push up from his feet for relief from suffocation.
Why did the Saviour have to endure all of the mental, spiritual and physical anguish?
Because of the Fathers love for all of his children. The Father provided the perfect sacrafice--his precious son.
His love for us is as incomprehensible as his only begotten in the flesh pains and suffering were during the atonement.
I hope you will always know for a surety, that the Father and the Saviour love you dearly.
I am a weak man, but I always have hope in him that was sent.
God Bless
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Awesome post Traveler.
I was able to attend the dedication of the Ogden Temple as a young lad and didn't quite grasp all that was going on. When everyone waved the handkerchiefs and voiced Hossana
I was probably the only one that didn't have a handerchief, because I was not told about it.
I always felt kind of bad about that, as it has been the only dedication I have ever been to.
Anyway, thanks for your informative and inspiring message.
FlaviusHambonius.
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Country Roads-----John Denver
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Sounds good ---throw one out there Wing--That is if it's O.K. with Pam.
I'll check in later after work--Choose one from the greatest band of all time--you know who I'm talking about. LOL
However, when I said someone commented on my dress I was genuinely shocked. To me, It was suitable for church. Now, I wont spend my life trying to please others so I will take the advice here and ignore these people.
the song game
in General Discussion
Posted
Love The One Your With --- Stephen Stills