Jason

Let's get a good idea of who is here. Unfortunately, I was not able to add a forth poll question, so for you out there who don't belong in the other categories, let's here it! -Judaism -Sikh -Islam (Sunni) -Islam (Shite) -Zorastrian -Santana Dharma (Hindu) -Buddhism (Mahyana) -Buddhism (Therveda) -Shinto -Shamanism -Native American (various) -Polynesian (various) -Weak Atheist -Strong Atheist -Agnostic -Deist -Spiritual -Wicca -Neo-Pagan -Satanism -Luciferian -Eccletic-paganism -Others I've omitted. (Very sorry I forgot the Jehovah's Witnesses. My apologies.)

While the system is not perfect, it helps millions of people everyday. The "system" is a creation of society to help other members of society. Generally those who complain believe that either the system doesn't help enough, or they didn't like what the system thought was best for them. (ie don't do drugs, don't beat your kids, etc.) Im still pretty new to the system myself (Im working on a Masters of Social Work as we speak) but these seem to be some of my observations. Best wishes.

Michelle, is it really 4am in England right now? Don't you ever sleep?

Yes. They are actually radio jamming devices set up by the MIB's to protect us from alien mind-control signals from deep space. Seriously bro, you've got to take a reality check. If we can't find Osama bin Laden, do you really think our government can monitor people's thoughts?

I'll bet he's also the Finance Minister of South Africa and was in jail with Mandela.

Howdy guys, I assume some of you got this message in your PM box: So I replied in kind: Please let me know how you responded.

Here's what I have to say regarding Reid ... AND polygamy: "No man can serve two masters; for either he will hate the one and love the other, or else he will hold to the one and despise the other." Politics is a religion ... based upon Political Action Committees ($) and Special Interests ($). All I know for sure is that the John Birch Society is a Satanic Conspiracy designed to eliminate the joy of Christmas. That's just sick and wrong people.

I thought it was only 1 year? Dang, wrong again....

I like to duct-tape my wife to the bed sometimes. Maybe that's what Dr. T had in mind? B)

He's definitely crazy. That technology is much more recent. Hitler couldn't get a V2 rocket to hit it's target, let alone put microchips into brains to control them.

Does that apply universally? Does it apply to your sig line?

If you're in the US, perhaps you could contact the Division of Family Services. They could assign you a Social Worker who could maybe help you out. Good luck.

I love those African scams where some government official has just contacted "you" to help them get several million dollars of some unmarked fund, or some dead guy's bank account, or whatever and all you have to do is pay the taxes to get it transfered to your own bank account. Of course, with so many millions, you'll have to pony-up a few measly grand, payable to Mr. John Smith of the Treasury department of Nigeria. And the bad thing about this is that there are literally dozens of suckers every day who take the bait. Hey Sanger, if you're legit, why don't you try and build Zion at home, eh? B)

Based on what evidence do you think Joseph Smith had a snowballs chance in you know where of being elected President of the US?

Amen! There were way too many Christians and Mormons at Lagoon last sunday. And there are always too many out in the malls, driving on the roads, or up in the mountains. GO TO CHURCH PEOPLE. If you don't you will go to Heck.

Then you still haven't bothered to study your history. There are journals of women, notably Joseph Smith's wife Emma, who were forced to live in polygamous relationships against their will. The biggest difference is time. Then and now. The second biggest difference is the age. Yet even now, the FLDS marrying at 13-14 is not as common as older teens like the early Mormons did. All your opinions don't mean anything without the historical record chiKin. Yeah ok. I'll just pretend your facts are true too.

So do you see your heavenly mother as a father?

Well gee whiz chikin....you must know everything then. Just the true parts. Then you don't know the facts dear. Section 132 of the Doctrine and Covenants is the reason. Now the FLDS have gone so far as to arrange the marriages, which is neither forbidden nor approved of by the D&C, but that's all that's happened. These arranged marriages are bad as far as our culture is concerned, but cultures all around the world for millenia approved of arranged marriages and nobody's pointing fingers at them.

Ok, I see what you're saying. But that still does not deny the fact that technically speaking, even if only on paper, the LDS church still practices polygamy.

Are you comparing a Priesthood ceremony to a "paper work" justice of the peace type of marriage? And are you saying that my dad won't be married to my mom and step-mom in the next life?

Most fundamentalists use the Church Quad for their scriptures (ignoring of course the Manifesto and the directive on Blacks and the priesthood). They do buy their church "stuff" from Deseret Book and the like. And depending on the group you talk with, many rever the first six LDS Church Presidents, not just the first Three. So the AUB generally reveres Smith, Young, Taylor, Woodruff, Snow and J.F. Smith. The TLC, on the other hand, only recognizes Smith, Young and Taylor, considering Woodruff an apostate. All Fundamentalists, however, have a general distain for Heber J. Grant, with many considering him as evil as say some Catholics would consider Pope Alexander VI. I've heard it many times said that he was the "man of sin" spoken of in 2 Thessalonians.

Rather than put up multiple posts, I think I'll do just one. And Fianan, you continuously earn my respect. chiKin, I'd like to reply to your posts: Spiritually speaking, you do. My uncle is still sealed to his first two wives, even though he's divorced to both of them. So he's sealed to three women right now. My dad is sealed to my deceased mother and my step-mother. So he's a spiritual polygamist as well. So to deny you practice polygamy is a farce to say the least. Just because you don't allow the men to have sex with the women they're sealed to (if alive) doesn't deny the practice. Technically you're wrong. Polygamy was officially outlawed in 1865 by the Federal Government in all US Territories, but the church continued to break the laws of the land for another 25 years!!! Then, when the US pardoned the Church in 1891, the Church deceived the US government by allowing polygamy to continue in Mexico and Canada, contrary to the agreement as understood by the Government, until 1904! Half of the Quorum of 12 married polygamously after the 1890 manifesto of Wilford Woodruff. It was a political document, not a "revelation". Everyone expected that when Utah gained statehood, they would be free to reinstate plural marriage. However, it never did happen. Does one member speak for all 10,000? If I meet a guy who's in jail for rape and he's LDS, does that mean that all LDS are rapists? Please don't make sweeping accusations of religions. Warren Jeff's didn't start the FLDS Church. His father officially began it, though he was only a part of the Council of Friends who felt slighted by Joseph White Musser for not being appointed as his "second elder". Rulon Allred and the guys in Short Creek split, and one eventually became the FLDS, the other the AUB. So did Jesus, Joseph Smith and Brigham Young. Yes, and that's why most Mormon Fundamentalists won't have anything to do with the FLDS either. They don't like being associated with them any more than you do. That's actually just a cover-up story told to justify the practice. Nothing there is based on actual fact. Yes. While I was not a member of the FLDS church, I was a member of the AUB, and we had several interactions with them. You obviously are not speaking from first-hand knowledge. Just as the early mormons did so because it was a commandment, so do todays mormons who practice it. Many do it out of devotion to God. Some do it for sex. How do you tell the difference? That's fine. But you're talking to the anti's. Ever talked to those who are still faithful members? This board has been all over JoshuaK's behind for studying anti-mormon sites for his information. Should'nt the same hold true for you? The comparison holds true. Many people viewed Joseph Smith Jun like they do Warren Jeffs. A sick, perverse, sex maniac. No, but he did promise them a better eternal glory. And he did marry other men's wives while they were out on missions to England. Is that somehow more justified?

I don't know about a second chance, but do you think he'd have a beer with me? B)

Im with Dr. T on this. We have two competing forces here: The Reasonable Man, and the Emotional Man. Most Latter-day Saints encourage we pay more attention to the Emotional Man than the other. But to deny one is to ignore who we are and the very basis of what makes us human. Our beliefs must at least be reasonable, or we are lying to ourselves. Intellectual suicide is just as much a cause for depression as emotional repression.

Yes, if Ruth chose to follow another God rather than Elohim the Isrealite God or I AM. She would be forsaking God of the OT. It was just a thought that popped into my head and gave me a what if moment :) Though at this point obviously it would be all theoretical since whats done is done. Was interested in what others might think anyway. Not to nitpick, but El(o)-him is not the god of Israel. Jehovah, the god of the desert, is the god of the Israelites. El(o)-him is/was the god of the Canaanites. El's son, Ba'al, is condemned many times by Jehovah in the Old Testament. :)