Amillia

You have to be a tithe paying, active member.

Oh that's dandy Amelia. If an organization sets criteria for benefits, then it is guilty of coersion and what? Oh yeah, EVIL. So if your employer actually requires you to work in order to pay you, it is guilty of coersion and what? Oh yeah, EVIL. And if I disagree with you I am what? Oh yeah, EVIL. Pleasure doing business with you Amelia. Oh thats dandy and well gosh~ ROT! Your example of work for pay isn't valid. Christ only asks for righteousness and worthiness through obedience. So did the church up until President Hinckley.

I can't see where I stated that it was MY way. For as far back as the church history goes, receiving the temple ordinances was only premised upon righteousness and personal worthiness. Now, they use it as coersion to encourage young men to go on missions? co·erce ( P ) Pronunciation Key (k-ûrs) tr.v. co·erced, co·erc·ing, co·erc·es To force to act or think in a certain way by use of pressure, threats, or intimidation; compel. To dominate, restrain, or control forcibly: coerced the strikers into compliance. See Synonyms at force. To bring about by force or threat: efforts to coerce agreement. What happened to Joseph Smith's "Teach the people correct principles and allow them to govern themselves."?

I recently found out : Unless a young man or woman are going on a mission or are getting married, they are not allowed to take their endowments until they are in their late twenties. In a speach given by Von J. Featherstone, it was stated that those who would weather the spiritual storm of the last days would be those who were temple attending Latter-day saints. He stated that many parents would wish their children could enter the temples and be granted the blessings that are offered there. Where is the youth to get their strength in those very vulnerable years if they are not able to get their endowments unless they go on a mission or are getting married. Not every young man and woman will be given the chance to get married and if one has ill health, a mission isn't an option either. Isn't this cutting off of the nose to spite the face? What valid reason could the church have for weakening the youth, the future generation of the faith? Who on this board would deny their children the available spiritual strength to endure these last?

Back off *period*

At the risk of getting involved in the conversation that was my first thought also. I thought about that too. But I believe that our church teaches that Jesus was the firstborn in spirit as well as the only one in the flesh. Ishmael was born several years before Isaac. Ishmael is also never conveyed as being evil. Anyway, if the Abraham/Isaac story foreshadows the Heavenly Father/Christ story (which it definitely seems to), I wonder why Isaac wasn't the firstborn. When looking at symbolic messages, can you really be so demanding of exactness in all details? When Moses held up the rod with the serpent, representing Christ, how would you reconcile the Lord being represented by a serpent? Wasn't Satan the serpent in Genesis? Do we believe that a child of the unchosen would be given the first born title? Hardly. If Mary, being chosen as the mother of Christ, was important, so was Sariah being chosen to be the mother of Abrams promised first born.

Let thy speach be: Yeah and nay! Nasty sarcasm seems to be what you call educated.

WRONG! Well gosh Amillia, it had to argue with that kind of definative logic. Spot on!

Huh? I disagree completely - and by the way, I'm right. Show me a doctor, licensed and practicing, mentally healthy and sober, that does not know the first thing about taking care of the body, and I join a convent. Show me a random group of doctors and compare their knowledge of keeping the body healthy to a random group on non-doctors and see what you get. Let's not hyperbolize to make a dubious point. Have you any idea how many law suites for mal-practice there are? No, and unless you go google it now, you don't either but what on earth does that have to do with you point that some doctors don't know the first thing about taking care of the body? Nothing. After 12 years of school, 4 years of college, 4 years of medical school, 3 years of residency, and then practicing medicine, no other group of people know more about taking care of the body. They should. But don't! Well, guess we all know Amillia's personal bias. But that's OK. When Amillia's dying and is taken to the hospital I am sure that the doctors will overlook her distrust of them and save her life anyway. That's the way they are. (Well, most of them, anyway.) Their dedication to their calling usually takes higher priority than their personal feelings. We love you anyway, Amillia! B) Is sarcasm really all you have?

Huh? I disagree completely - and by the way, I'm right. Show me a doctor, licensed and practicing, mentally healthy and sober, that does not know the first thing about taking care of the body, and I join a convent. Show me a random group of doctors and compare their knowledge of keeping the body healthy to a random group on non-doctors and see what you get. Let's not hyperbolize to make a dubious point. Have you any idea how many law suites for mal-practice there are? No, and unless you go google it now, you don't either but what on earth does that have to do with you point that some doctors don't know the first thing about taking care of the body? Nothing. After 12 years of school, 4 years of college, 4 years of medical school, 3 years of residency, and then practicing medicine, no other group of people know more about taking care of the body. They should. But don't!

WRONG!

Huh? I disagree completely - and by the way, I'm right. Show me a doctor, licensed and practicing, mentally healthy and sober, that does not know the first thing about taking care of the body, and I join a convent. Show me a random group of doctors and compare their knowledge of keeping the body healthy to a random group on non-doctors and see what you get. Let's not hyperbolize to make a dubious point. Have you any idea how many law suites for mal-practice there are?

Education doesn't necessarily mean book learning and class rooms. There are teachers who can't teach, engineers who can figure out how to build a road correctly and doctors who don't know the first thing about taking care of the body. I wonder if it could be just one of those many agenda's had by big business. Universities are always saying how short of funds they are and then they add a huge baseball diamond to their lot. I don't trust propaganda on this level anymore. I don't believe we realy need college educations even for teaching. Most the good teachers are naturally born good teachers and bad teachers are people who were good in school and had no trouble getting a certification for teaching, but are very destructive to the education of our youth. IOW paper work/education doesn't make for good teachers. I also know of an educated idiot that had the paper work stating he was an engineer. But he didn't know the first thing about engineering, ruined the road where I live, leaving a huge pool in the intersection when it rains. Wouldn't it be wonderful if we lived in an enlightened society where people were given the right to work according to their talents and gifts and make a living doing so, without paper work stating they were what they weren't, or were at great expense.

I don't see it as figuretive but playing along, I would say that Ishmael is opposition. Something like Satan?

He stated that he combined two stories when in the throws of giving a talk and after it was done, it was Dunn history. He regretted it, but because of being a very public personality, it was a done deal, so he decided it couldn't hurt anything and let it go.

Again please.

Everyone has their agency. What they do with it is on their own head, unless they are foolish enough to start bagging these faults of others and carrying them upon their own backs as you are doing here. When ever you set out to judge another, you can expect to be judged yourself by the same blindness you used to judge them. Only God knows the hearts and minds and weaknesses of each of us. It is your choice, as it was Paul Dunn's choice. What you both have and are choosing to do with your influence is all up to yourselves. Tell you what Hyde, you are more condemned for not forgiving than Paul is for lying, because Paul has repented.

This is true. I have had some take 20 years.

So long, farewell, la la la la la la la.

Why wasn't this thread deleted.

How can anyone who claims to be serving the best interest of the people they are paid to protect think that professionalism is all that is required. Humanity sir, without it, we can just go live in a Jungle and be treated as well by the wild animals as the police.

I don't post but for Ray; Mark is not going to listen to anyone but himself. Don't waste your time.