brotherofJared
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Posts posted by brotherofJared
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On 2/14/2020 at 6:37 PM, e v e said:
I don't you don't like those themes I posted...
I do have a question. What does the third hour represent to LDS ? Being the title of the forums ?
It's sponsored by some members of our church but has no more affiliation with the church than that. It is the opinions of a few members.and anyone else.who wants to offer one.
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On 2/14/2020 at 6:13 PM, e v e said:
In all the versions, the watchers (fallen angels) invade eden to steal attributes from Him
None of the versions u offered even remotely make this suggestion. Watchers are not even defined as fallen Angel's (they were, but not in the way that the world imagines that they were. They were humans, not much different than u or me. Are we not all fallen?
They did not invade Eden. Watchers didnt appear until AFTER the fall. Nothing was stolen. Instead, attributes of Eden were given, gifts that every person has some attribute of, some of faith (Eve's nature), some knowledge, some of healing, some.of tongues, some of the interpretations of tongues, all gifts of the spirit, all attributes of Eden.
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On 2/14/2020 at 5:38 PM, e v e said:
I can tell greek and egyptian versions, and also rg-veda etc.. In every version, the originals of eden are captured in some way, to produce a different reality, using eden as its source to vampire from. I typed a bit so I will stop there for now. All of this is in cliff note, so there is much left out.
I dont see any of that. But my question was, how is what Adam did bad? What evil.has come from it? What demise that is irreversible come from it? What do u suppose would happen if Adam didn't fall?
Remember, U said that what Adam did was bad. Please remember that when he fell the damage was already done.
On 2/14/2020 at 5:44 PM, e v e said:Some take these things to say well "the traditions all share the same events", and interpret them differently as I do of course. But I have valid reason to interpret these negatively, given that the event is accomplished as a conquest, by force and deception, in those texts. It just depends on which side of the conquest the text is telling, for God, such as scripture, or against God, such as these texts where other gods vie for power and to steal from God.
That is not the question. There was no force, deception, yes but no force - same as it is today, no force but plenty of deception.
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On 2/14/2020 at 5:38 PM, e v e said:
I can tell greek and egyptian versions, and also rg-veda etc.. In every version, the originals of eden are captured in some way, to produce a different reality, using eden as its source to vampire from. I typed a bit so I will stop there for now. All of this is in cliff note, so there is much left out.
I dont see any of that. But my question was, how is what Adam did bad? What evil.has come from it? What demise that is irreversible come from it? What do u suppose would happen if Adam didn't fall?
Remember, U said that what Adam did was bad. Please remember that when he fell the damage was already done.
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Sorry. Duplicate.
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On 2/14/2020 at 5:33 PM, e v e said:
sumerian version
Note that there are many other topics where parallels exist, but I am only focusing on the stories related to the fall, and the loss of the body. In this version, the sumerian god marduk attacks eden and steals the eden nature. Eden in those texts is referred to as tiamat. The texts tell that another God (of scripture) appeared in their midst, being viewed as a threat. marduk had been creating beings, but they were not that smart and not very pretty, more apelike. Those of marduk's realm were very afraid of eden, because, eden having a very high refresh rate not the slow gravity of matter (resulting in virtually no sense of time as we know it in terms of deterioration and death), was utterly lethal to them, just as would be lethal to use to have a monoxide atmosphere. However, afraid, they wanted those same powers, and asked marduk, "please give us bodies as those two", referring to the bodies of adam and eve, that were so powerful. Marduk using a type of spear (a dimensional change of axis), pierced tiamat, tand hus separating the atmosphere (male attribute) from the land (female).
Actually correction, the other God in their midst was related to marduk some how, who marduk (satan, lucifer) had a different idea of how to proceed, and rebelled. It's been a while since I read that and I forgot.The only thing that makes sense about this rendition of the Marduk story is the separation of water from water which, if we're going to find parallels puts Marduk well before Adam and Eve.
There are parallels but I dont see the ones u do.
These are all, so far, rip-offs of a previous epic. I believe they were made by men who didn't understand the original epic and formed the stories around their own political agendas, much like the early Christian, post-apostolic, church did with the original epic they received. Therefore these stories only make sense as shadows of the reality IF we know the reality of what actually took place.
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On 2/14/2020 at 5:25 PM, e v e said:
This is a vedic version, as such, I've added my own comments, which may not make sense until I talk about the egyptian and Greek version and also the sumerian version.
The story has a meaning in scriptural context and also in other contexts but here I am not yet going into that. I will start with it here. Keeping in mind that this story predates Hinduism and would have happened in the other world, not this material earth.
There is a story in mahabharata, a vedic text. about how a deity, tricked eve (called pritha) to succumb to him. She of course remained a maiden. For some reason, she was left alone, far from her own family, to tend to this lord, and the lord had company. This company was a sun god, and he brought pritha a gift, a magic spell. If she used the spell she could summon some power (paraphrasing.) She was curious and but a girl and looked at the spell.... then, the same god returned, and told her now if she did not give a gift, that would be rude... and that, what he wanted was a son. she complained that her family would be upset, that was not done...and that, she needed to stay a maiden so she could marry...but the god assured her that not to worry, he would not blemish her and that she could still have a son. pritha was very confused, from being spelled by the gift previous, and so she agreed, and the god pierced her tummy with a ray. and then she hid from the family the son. the god, wanted a son from her, to steal from her the nature of her realm, eden, how I understood it, based on what happens next. she has the son and to hide him , sends him down the river in a basket of reeds, just as moses, and a family finds him. the boy grows to be a god, stronger than ALL the other gods, having the nature of the realm of the girl, not the foreign realm that tries to get a child from her. He grows and he is a brave youth, able to accomplish anything at all... a messenger of the gods come to him, because the gods, want his 'body', being his chestplate and his being, which they are most covetous of. The youth wanted to please the gods, having been separated all his life from his mother, and knowing only that realm and peoples who were foreign to his mother. He had no idea of his lineage being of Eden. He is concerned because if he gives his body to the messenger to give to agni (Lucifer) he will die, and have no covering and be left a helpless wretch... but, he decides to give up his body on the promise he will receive a replacement body. This happens, and the gods obtain the powers they wanted all along, by making the girl have the child such to later turn him to their purpose. This also reminds of the story of joseph working in Egypt... thus the youth is given a different body than his original one. So he betrays his own nature, but in the vedic version they downplay anything negative, because it serves the gods to obtain what they obtained by the youth, regardless of how this was done. The story of course is untrustworthy to the extent that the is meaning is twisted to the vedic point of view , of that pantheon who benefitted from the theft of the original body of that youth, who while after was still godlike, was not of the powers of before, or had even realized who he was or what his situation was.
I'm not sure what this story is supposed represent. There is no creation or fall that affects all mankind in it. Some woman u claim represents Eve has a child and that child is the point of the story. So, in relation to anything we're discussing, it is nonsense. Can u help me see the point of the story in relation the trinity? Or how Eve relates to that family, the trinity? Or how any of this makes what Adam did, bad.
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10 hours ago, e v e said:
This is my fault... when I talked to you on a thread the other day , i thought your beliefs to be messianic or lds mixed with messianic? So through my own fault I wasn’t clear about my reaction to those videos... that there are two realms and much of the near death stuff is not related to God’s realm.
I would agree that NDE's cannot reveal much, if anything, about heaven. We can learn one thing that I believe is certain. The death of the body is not death or sleep of the person. There are other things such as the spirit world is all around us. Otherwise, it seems that many of the reports from people who have an NDE are not much different than things experienced while on an acid trip.
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10 hours ago, e v e said:
I understand adam betrayed God and the fall was very bad.
I dont see where anyone betrayed God. I don't believe that is even possible. My understanding of that word is synonymous with backstab. Adam certainly didnt do that but one could make the argument that Eve betrayed Adam. She forced him into a situation where he had to disobey God regardless of the decision he made.
Now, this is off topic for this thread, but how is what Adam did bad?
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1 minute ago, e v e said:
Okay. What kind of help did he need? I don't mind by the way the scrying stuff JS did. The reason may sound weird, but I will tell it if you want. It's something He showed me (not about JS but about certain things in general).
God's help. He asked and got answers and recorded those answers. They have helped a lot when it comes to understanding revelations.
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14 minutes ago, e v e said:
True.. but what am I to do, start another thread? I'm still recovering from this one : )
start one if you want to discuss it, but when it comes to interpreting symbolism it's mostly speculation. Joseph Smith helped a lot but he didn't reveal everything so, for the most part, we still speculate.
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19 minutes ago, e v e said:
Related to seven lamps/lampstand? Just remembered the lamps and the 10 maidens forgetting to light theirs..and also Exodus 25.
Flame or fire represents spirit or some aspect of the spirit in our lifes. Your references to scripture are way too vague. Might as well say that it's in the Bible somewhere.
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2 minutes ago, e v e said:
I read it. Yes.
What I noticed was the term pillars used in a footnote. (I need to recheck.) I know what are the 7 pillars..those are Her 7 torches. These seven torches are from eden, are feminine beings, and are mentioned in Ezekiel. The seven torches are told in Revelation too, as ‘the seven lamp stands upon the sea of glass’ . In Zechariah they are referred to as “the seven eyes of God which cross through His land.
All of which have symbolic meaning. God doesn't really have 7 eyes across His land
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1 minute ago, Vort said:
Oh, my goodness.
This entire thread is an embarrassment to this site and all who participate in it, LDS or not, Christian or not, female or not. All sentient beings feel their cheeks burn when reading this thread.
🤣🤣🤣 🙄
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13 minutes ago, e v e said:
I can learn about Lehi, since I am not familiar... or with Josiah.
Read the Book of Mormon to learn about Lehi, but it does not specify that this disagreement about the wife of God being an issue. The Bible was written to remove all references to her. This redaction was commissioned by King Josiah but we only know about this from the Dead Sea Scrolls and some detailed scholarly work. The wife of God has been a well-kept secret for many thousands of years.
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15 minutes ago, e v e said:
True. I would agree, except that He and She, by Love, created Eden and their sons and daughters. She is the mother of all, and not by procreation upon this earth.
Not by procreation anywhere. Being a resurrected being, she cannot procreate spirits. She may be intimately involved with creating spirits, but she doesn't procreate them anywhere, never has, IMO.
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1 hour ago, SilentOne said:
One reason for believing that our Heavenly Mother is not the Holy Ghost is that logically, I figure she must be a resurrected, embodied person, while we are told that the Holy Ghost currently does not have a physical body.
That makes sense and is the reason I have a problem with the Holy Ghost being our Heavenly Mother. However, Joseph Smith said that the Father is a personage of spirit in one of his famous lectures (Lectures of Faith 5) which has been interpreted to me that He is a resurrected being. It seems likely, that Heavenly Mother is also a resurrected being and therefore also a personage of spirit which is why I leave that door open. I have no concluded one way or the other which is true.
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1 hour ago, anatess2 said:
God - in LDS belief - is a State of Being. That State of Being is expressed fully as a Will - the Will that is God with all truth and knowledge. It is the reason why we are in our mortal probation - that we may gain full knowledge and understand all truth and freely exercise our own will with this truth and knowledge so that our will may become fully aligned with the Will that is God. When we achieve that - then we enter that State of Being that is God. These 3 persons -the Father, Jesus, and the Holy Ghost are ONE with the Will that is God, and therefore, they are God.
Make sense?
God, in LDS belief, is a being, not a state of being. God is defined as the ability to continue the seeds. Though we might have all knowledge and power, it would be relatively useless if we could not continue the seeds.
No. your explanation does not make sense.
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1 hour ago, e v e said:
The holy ghost concept really isn't on my radar, as we agreed to disagree on that point. Maybe Rome did that bait and switch.
It occurred long before Rome. King Josiah seems to be where the change was made. It was bad enough that Lehi and his family left Jerusalem.
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1 hour ago, anatess2 said:
And that's what we've been telling you - 4 places on the table.
And eve is telling you that there would still be 3 places at the table. Quit asserting your understanding into her statements.
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1 hour ago, anatess2 said:
Because, scripture is very clear on the matter - there are 3 Persons in One God. Not 4.
True, but her point is that one of those three might very well be our Heavenly Mother.
e v e has never stated that there were 4 in one God.
The trinity = the family
in Christian Beliefs Board
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Dreams and visions are often for the person who received it and for no one else.