GaleG
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Posts posted by GaleG
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2 Nephi 1:8 says "And behold, it is wisdom that this land should be kept as yet
from the knowledge of other nations; for behold, many nations would overrun the
land, that there would be no place for an inheritance".
Was the actual size of the land a contributing factor to a lack of knowledge of where
this land was that required God's (?) wisdom to keep it secret to prevent it from being
overrun to the point where there wouldn't be enough space for an inheritance?
Thank you,Gale
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On 9/22/2019 at 7:06 AM, priesthoodpower said:
God gives us free agency knowing very well that we will ALL fail to some degree or another, all of our failures and sins are lessons for ALL to learn.
Is this how Heavenly Father (when he was a man) became the God of Earth?
Gale
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On 12/14/2019 at 10:55 PM, askandanswer said:
31 He had on a loose robe of most exquisite whiteness. It was a whiteness beyond anything earthly I had ever seen; nor do I believe that any earthly thing could be made to appear so exceedingly white and brilliant. His hands were naked, and his arms also, a little above the wrist; so, also, were his feet naked, as were his legs, a little above the ankles. His head and neck were also bare. I could discover that he had no other clothing on but this robe, as it was open, so that I could see into his bosom.
(Pearl of Great Price | JS-History 1:31)
Does this verse give support to any conclusions that might be made about the use of temple garments by resurrected beings in the post mortal life? I’m not suggesting that this verse on its own is enough to draw any reliable conclusions, I’m just wondering if it might be enough to support any conclusions, and if so, what those conclusions might be.
How do make a connection with the robe (the only thing he was wearing) with a temple
garment?Gale
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Will the church use these records of same-sex families and same-sex adoptions in future
proxy baptisms?Thank you,
Gale
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5 hours ago, Traveler said:
I understand this as two different issues. The mark is a warning to the covenant "children" of G-d to not participate in Secret Covenants (or Combinations) with Satan.
What do you believe is the mark Cain received from God? Would you show me one scripture
where a person other than Cain received a mark for committing a secret murder or
combination?Thank you,
Gale
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20 hours ago, Traveler said:
It is my understanding that the use of a "mark" on Cain or upon Laman and Lemuel is a symbolic reference to a "warning" rather than a blessing or curse. Thus it deals with being loyal to one's covenant with G-d and not necessarily a reference to blessings or curses to Cain (or others).
Did Cain's wife and their children get a mark placed on them for protection?
The curse upon Cain is pronounced in Genesis 4:12. "When thou tillest the ground,
it shall not henceforth yield unto thee her strength; a fugitive and a vagabond shalt
thou be in the earth".If this curse passed unto other peoples, what people groups inherited this curse?
Thank you,
Gale
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On 11/13/2019 at 4:27 PM, Vort said:
The history of Cain and Abel is much older than our Old Testament. I suspect much has been lost in the transmission of the story through the millennia. Not sure what, if anything, we can rightfully infer from this story.
Moses 5:40 says "And I the Lord said unto him: Whosoever slayeth thee, vengeance
shall be taken on him sevenfold. And I the Lord set a mark upon Cain, lest any
finding him should kill him".A blessing of protection is inferred in that verse.
But the word mark is linked back to Alma 3:7 - "And their brethren sought to
destroy them, therefore they were cursed; and the Lord God set a mark upon them,
yea, upon Laman and Lemuel, and also the sons of Ishmael, and Ishmaelitish women"What do you infer by the story in Alma? Is the mark on Cain a curse or a blessing
of protection?Thank you,
Gale
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On 10/27/2019 at 2:46 PM, Jonah said:
Does "would not" equal "could not"? What about "did not"?
Maybe as Jane_Doe already replied.
Gale
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On 10/20/2019 at 9:24 PM, Anddenex said:
Their ability to procreate before the fall is an "unknown." I, personally, am one that believes their bodies were capable, but that is personal opinion as nothing from scripture specifies for or against before the fall.
Thank you Anddenex.
I found something similar echoed at
and
Gale
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On 10/15/2019 at 8:45 PM, Anddenex said:
Correct and yes and no. We do not have any scripture specifying "a lack of ability" but we do have scripture pertaining to their innocence before the fall and how their knowledge was like unto a child. We also have scripture specifying Eve's words that they would not have had children. So, was it knowledge or something else that prevented children before the fall?
I would say they had ability to procreate before the Fall but then their sense of
mortality caused an immediate need to have children since they did not know when
they would physically die (as God told them they would die but did not indicate
a time frame).Here is a hypothetical - assuming the Book of Mormon and Pearl is not correct on
this aspect of procreation, would you speculate on why they did not have children
before the Fall?I agree they were in a state of innocence but I believe that God created them
in adult form and he did not teach them how to speak, walk, eat, or do anything
else they did in the Garden. I believe all this knowledge and ability was in
them already as part of their creation.QuoteWe also have scripture that "clearly" teaches they "knew" each other after the fall and children were brought into the world. If they had perfect bodies, and if they were intimate sexually, how did they not have children? Why is it clear in scripture that after the "fall" they "knew" each other and brought forth children into the world. Before that -- no children?
We are not provided any scripture that says they had or did not have sexual activity
before the Fall. Were they holding hands? Maybe/maybe not. Were they kissing? Maybe/
maybe not. Does sexual intercourse always produce a child? Don't think so.QuoteWould you be able to provide any scripture backing your thought, your belief here? If such knowledge was "instilled" in them, then how did they not know they were naked? And why does partaking of the fruit "open their eyes"? If such knowledge was instilled, obviously they would have known they were naked, but they didn't even know what it meant to be naked.
That's a tough one to answer. I have always wondered if having the knowledge of good and evil
means having a knowledge of being naked or having knowledge of how to have a baby.But like God gave the animals instinct, I believe he created them with some inbuilt knowledge
- otherwise they would not understand anything he was asking/telling them to do. Adam was
placed in the garden to tend it (Genesis 2:15. Apparently he already had this knowledge.QuoteWhat scripture can you provide then that they knew "good from evil"? What scriptures confirms your belief?
They did not know evil before Fall. What is your definition of good when there is no evil? If
know that part, I may be able to elaborate with a better opinion.Thank you,
Gale
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On 10/14/2019 at 12:05 PM, mordorbund said:
You've been investigating the Church of Jesus Christ for a loooong time if you're working off a 1997 Gospel Principles manual. Even @theplains has a 2009 copy.
Both versions are available.
Gale
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On 10/14/2019 at 6:04 PM, Anddenex said:
1) Can you provide any scripture which specifies that Adam "knew" Eve before the Fall?
2) How many children do you think "know" about how to have a baby if they have never been taught, in understanding we know Adam and Eve were "innocent" like children pertaining to children as they did not know good from evil?
1] There is none recorded. I also couldn't find any scripture indicating that they lacked ability or
knowledge to procreate before the Fall.2] I would say that when God commanded them to be fruitful and multiply, he instilled in them the
ability and knowledge. Same for the animals. I don't believe eating from the forbidden tree gave
them the knowledge of good and evil and sexuality.Thank you,
Gale
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On 10/7/2019 at 7:29 PM, Grunt said:
What does "keeping the Sabbath Day holy" mean to you? What are things you absolutely must do to accomplish this, according to you? What are things you absolutely won't do?
What does the Sabbath look like, to you?
If I adhered to the 1997 Gospel Principles, it would look like this to me:
1] no shopping
2] no hunting or fishing
3] no attending sport events
4] no participating in similar activities on that dayGale
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On 10/12/2019 at 2:38 PM, helamanc10 said:
At this point, many people would think that Satan’s was successful in his plan to make Adam and Eve fall and disobey God, the truth is that there was no other way for them to have children, they were immortal. It is true that humanity found themselves in a fallen state from which only Christ could get us out of.
What characteristic allows an immortal Heavenly Father and Mother to have children
but prevents an immortal Adam and Eve (in the Garden before the Fall) to do so?What is the curse of Adam mentioned in Moroni 8:8?
Thank you,
Gale
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Are those outside The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints still
viewed as belonging to the church of the devil (1 Nephi 14:10)? If no, is
there a video for that apology?Thank you,
Gale
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On 9/20/2019 at 12:34 PM, Anddenex said:
This is the type of post that causes me to ponder the sincerity of your questioning.
In what world is a people impacted by another until the invasion? There were still rich people in Jerusalem (who were enjoying their riches) before they were once again destroyed. So, yes, it is quite obvious they would have been enjoying what wealth they obtained before they left, and they would have enjoyed it up until the invasion. Moot point.
Hi Anddenex,
I hope you don't view my line of questioning as me being insincere. The references to the Book
of Mormon in my previous post indicated some events which are said to have happened to Lehi
and his family. I saw the Book of Mormon video where Lehi is commanded to leave Jerusalem.
It seems to me to depict a people living at ease given the events recorded before Zedekiah
assumes the throne (2 Kings 24:8-18).I'm trying to view this from a historical perspective of the time before Zedekiah becomes king.
(while Lehi is still in Jerusalem living with all his wealth).8 Jehoiachin was eighteen years old when he began to reign, and he
reigned in Jerusalem three months. And his mother's name was Nehushta, the daughter
of Elnathan of Jerusalem.
9 And he did that which was evil in the sight of the Lord, according
to all that his father had done.
10 At that time the servants of Nebuchadnezzar king of Babylon came up
against Jerusalem, and the city was besieged.
11 And Nebuchadnezzar king of Babylon came against the city, and his
servants did besiege it.
12 And Jehoiachin the king of Judah went out to the king of Babylon,
he, and his mother, and his servants, and his princes, and his officers: and the
king of Babylon took him in the eighth year of his reign.
13 And he carried out thence all the treasures of the house of the Lord,
and the treasures of the king's house, and cut in pieces all the vessels of gold
which Solomon king of Israel had made in the temple of the Lord, as the Lord had
said.
14 And he carried away all Jerusalem, and all the princes, and all the
mighty men of valour, even ten thousand captives, and all the craftsmen and smiths:
none remained, save the poorest sort of the people of the land.
15 And he carried away Jehoiachin to Babylon, and the king's mother,
and the king's wives, and his officers, and the mighty of the land, those carried
he into captivity from Jerusalem to Babylon.
16 And all the men of might, even seven thousand, and craftsmen and
smiths a thousand, all that were strong and apt for war, even them the king of
Babylon brought captive to Babylon.
17 And the king of Babylon made Mattaniah his father's brother king
in his stead, and changed his name to Zedekiah.
18 Zedekiah was twenty and one years old when he began to reign, and
he reigned eleven years in Jerusalem. And his mother's name was Hamutal, the
daughter of Jeremiah of LibnahThank you
Gale
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On 9/18/2019 at 1:26 AM, Jersey Boy said:
As to your second point, the Book of Mormon says that Lehi was well aware of the imprisonment of Jeremiah, an event that took place toward the end of Zedekiah’s reign. So that means Jerusalem was destroyed less than a year after Lehi’s departure. In historical terms,, a span of less than a year of time seems to fit well with the the expression immediately.
Thank you. Based on how it's worded, I would agree.
When I read that part of the Book of Mormon, I see some highlights about how life
was like for Lehi/Ishmael and his family just before they departed.- The introduction notes of 1 Nephi 1 says "The Lord warns Lehi to depart out of
the land of Jerusalem, because he prophesieth unto the people concerning their
iniquity and they seek to destroy his life". 1 Nephi 1:20 and 1 Nephi 2:1
mention this.
- 1 Nephi 2 – Lehi leaves Jerusalem in the first year of Zedekiah’s reign
(introductory notes to 3 Nephi 1).
- 1 Nephi 3 – Nephi and his brothers return to Jerusalem to get their gold, silver,
and other precious items in order to barter for brass plates from Laban. They are
denied the plates, their treasures are confiscated and they flee out of Jerusalem
and back into the wilderness.
- 1 Nephi 4 – They return again to Jerusalem and are successful in retrieving the
plates after Laban is killed. They leave Jerusalem in haste for fear of being
captured by Laban's servants.
- 1 Nephi 7 – They return to Jerusalem again and get Ishmael and his household. In
1 Nephi 7:6, some of Ishmael's household, together with some of Nephi's brothers,
rebel and wish to return to the land of Jerusalem. 1 Nephi 16:36 mentions that the
daughters of Ishmael wanted to return to Jerusalem.
- 1 Nephi 17:21 – One of Lehi’s sons says they would have been happier and enjoyed
their possessions if they had only remained in Jerusalem.From the looks of it, their life and activity didn't seem to be impacted by the Babylonian
invasion and military presence in and around Jerusalem.Gale
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On 9/17/2019 at 9:53 PM, Just_A_Guy said:
I don’t see a reference to Jerusalem’s “immediate” destruction either at late 92 of the manual you cite, or the chapter heading to 3 Nephi 1. But we know it wasn’t “immediate”, because the boys went back to Jerusalem twice after Lehi left and apparently found business was going on as usual.
By the way, Gale, I notice you tend to pick up on threads started by @theplains a lot, and either repeat or expand on his arguments/implications. Are you two acquainted
The manual on page 92 (see attached) seems to supplement the teaching
that the destruction of Jerusalem occured immediately after Lehi left; as it
references 2 Nephi 25:10 - Wherefore, it hath been told them concerning the
destruction which should come upon them, immediately after my father left
Jerusalem; nevertheless, they hardened their hearts; and according to my
prophecy they have been destroyed, save it be those which are carried away
captive into Babylon.
The introductory notes for 3 Nephi 1 says "And Helaman was the son of
Helaman, who was the son of Alma, who was the son of Alma, being a
descendant of Nephi who was the son of Lehi, who came out of Jerusalem
in the first year of the reign of Zedekiah, the king of Judah."
If you don't believe this, it would help if you could explain your toughts on what
year in Zedekiah's reign was Jerusalem destroyed and when he was carried away
captive to Babylon.I don't know Jim but on the surface he appears to be ex-LDS.
Thank you,
Gale
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On 9/8/2019 at 7:14 PM, Jersey Boy said:
If you had bothered to read Lehi’s prophetic warning in the first chapter of the Book of Mormon, you may have realized he didn’t prophesy that Jerusalem was going to, once again, be attacked and pillaged, but his warning was that the next time the Babylonians attacked the city of Jerusalem and the holy temple were going to be “DESTROYED.”
Sorry to intrude.
I read the first chapter of 1 Nephi but don't see your reference to a 'next time'. Can you be
more specific?I see that the church mentions in the notes section of 3 Nephi 1 that Jerusalem was
destroyed immediately after Lehi left Jerusalem; possibly using 2 Nephi 25:10 as a
supporting scripture. Also taught in the church manual in chapter 12, page 92.Do you believe instead that this destruction was not immediately after Lehi departed but
rather some time after Jeremiah was imprisoned (after the tenth year of Zedekiah's reign;
Jeremiah 32)?Thank you,
Gale
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On 9/14/2019 at 10:31 AM, CV75 said:
Jacob 5 is about the Lord transplanting nations to spots of ground all across His vineyard.
What is the meaning of Jacob 5:77?
Thank you.
Gale
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Hello,
Would you help me understand this verse.2 Nephi 1:5 says "But, said he, notwithstanding our afflictions, we have obtained a
land of promise, a land which is choice above all other lands; a land which the Lord
God hath covenanted with me should be a land for the inheritance of my seed. Yea,
the Lord hath covenanted this land unto me, and to my children forever, and also
all those who should be led out of other countries by the hand of the Lord".Is there a scripture which hints, for example, that the Lord would lead people out
of other countries to a place like Australia so it too would be considered a covenant
land in addition to the land Nephi was referring to? Or is Nephi's land the only
covenant land which the Lord would lead people out of other countries to?Thank you,
Gale
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On 8/31/2019 at 2:41 PM, Just_A_Guy said:
But what really matters, and what we focus on, is what God is telling us on the here-and-now
This reminds me of what I read in Teachings of Presidents of the Church - Joseph Smith.
‘Brother Brigham took the stand, and he took the Bible, and laid it down; he took
the Book of Mormon, and laid it down; and he took the Book of Doctrine and
Covenants, and laid it down before him, and he said: ‘There is the written word of
God to us, concerning the work of God from the beginning of the world, almost, to
our day.And now,’ said he, ‘when compared with the living oracles those books are nothing to
me; those books do not convey the word of God direct to us now, as do the words of
a Prophet or a man bearing the Holy Priesthood in our day and generation. I would
rather have the living oracles than all the writing in the books.’That was the course he pursued. When he was through, Brother Joseph said to the
congregation: ‘Brother Brigham has told you the word of the Lord, and he has told
you the truth.’Gale
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On 8/26/2019 at 3:38 PM, Anddenex said:
2. "For behold, the Spirit of the Lord ceaseth soon to strive with them; for behold, they have rejected the prophets, and Jeremiah have they cast into prison. And they have sought to take away the life of my father, insomuch that they have driven him out of the land." (1 Nephi 7:14)
Thank you Anddenex.
Was Lehi driven out of the land by his enemies or commanded by God to leave (1 Nephi 2:2-3)?
Gale
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Hello,
Would you help me understand this verse.2 Nephi 1:4 says "For, behold, said he, I have seen a vision, in which I know that
Jerusalem is destroyed; and had we remained in Jerusalem we should also have
perished".Do you think Lehi was aware of the Lord's revelation to Jeremiah that the good figs
(chapter 24, verses 5-8) represented the people who remained in Jerusalem and were
taken and preserved by the Lord in Babylon?Thank you,
Gale
Running out of space on the covenant land
in LDS Gospel Discussion
Posted
I suppose you are speaking about the people who would collectively come under the
designation of Nephites (the believers) instead of the Lamanites (the unbelievers).
How small of a land area were the covenant people given that there was a concern of
there not being enough space for their inheritance when the many nations learned of
its location?
Thank you,
Gale