JohnBirchSociety

"Ignorance is not, not knowing something. It is knowing what isn't so." -Mark Twain

"A nickel ain't worth a dime anymore!" -Yogi Berra "No, I do not believe my opponents youth and inexperience should have anything to do with this race." -Ronald Reagan "Do, or do not, there is no try!" -Yoda "Do it. Do it right. Do it right now." -Spencer W. Kimball "No success can compensate for failure in the home." -David O. McKay "He is not here. The Tomb is empty." -Angel of the Lord "There are three boxes of the citizen. The ballot box. The soap box. The ammo box." -Rep. Lawrance P. McDonald "It's not about who's right or wrong. It's about who's left." -American Kenpo founder Ed Parker, Sr. "Be like water, my friend. Be like water" -Bruce Lee

Welcome. You should start a thread on immunizations, in the Health Section. I'd join in on that conversation.

That's a currency inflation of over $500,000,000,000 dollars (half a trillion) in a week folks! You simply CANNOT do that with Constitutionally sound money, namely Gold or Silver Coin... Do you not all see the utter danger such nonsense puts us under?

Nonsense. I personally know people who work in Antartica. People in my family work there. The side that is more valid is the one with the more valid argument. If one side demands global governance of man because we are causing global climate damage, then that side must prove beyond reasonable doubt that man contributes to global climate activity in anything other than a minute manner. Surface temperatures globally are not increasing. Air temperatures are not increasing, globally, either. The two go hand in hand. The overwhelming, massive, totally enveloping force that changes our climate on a global scale is the SUN and our changing orbit around it. It is cyclical. When man wasn't on the scene there were periods of temperature greater, by far, than today. Man had nothing to do with it then, and we have nothing, in other than a very, very (I can't say very enough here) minute way. We minutely contribute to total CO2 / C2O in the atmosphere. We minutely contribute to the total Sulfur Dioxide in the air. It's like dropping a 100Billion pound weight from 1,000 feet up, and as it is falling, adding 1OUNCE (I'm not exaggerating the scale on this), and then saying "Watch out, look what you've done!".... The SUN warms the atmosphere of the Earth at the rate of 1366Watts per Square meter of exposure, per second, everyday, since long before we were on the scene. That equates to about 1000Watts of energy per square meter of exposed land, per second, everyday, since long before we were here. The SUN puts out 386 Billion, Billion, Megawatts of power PER SECOND. Thank the Lord that only a tiny fraction of that reaches us each second. The point of this that no man-made force in history even equates to that energy, even the detonation of over 700 nuclear bombs hasn't done it. In fact, not even NATURAL Earth disasters of historical magnitude have been able to do it. We just are not a factor, globally, in cooling (as we are now), or warming (as was the case from 1979-1999).

There are regional changes. These are cyclical in nature. For example, the Saraha wasn't always a desert. What we are talking about are global changes upwards in temperature, caused by the pollution of man. There is no such thing occurring.

I'd like to start a posting of great historical quotes, without comment. Below are a few of my favorites. Add your own! "Our lives, our liberty, and our property are never in greater danger than when Congress is in session." -Mark Twain "The only place success come before work is in the dictionary." -Colin Powell "Democracy is like having two wolves and a lamb decide what is for dinner." -Benjamin Franklin "What luck, for governments, that the people are stupid!" -Adolf Hitler "Am I not destroying my enemies, by making them my friends?" -Abraham Lincoln "I'd give my right arm to be ambidextrous." -Yogi Berra "If you come to a fork in the road, take it." -Yogi Berra "Son, it never rains under water." -My Dad "Is life so sweet, or peace, so dear, as to be purchased at the price of chains and slavery? Forbid it Almighty GOD! I know not what course others may take, but as for me, give me liberty, or give me death." -Patrick Henry "Government is not reason, it is force. Like fire, it can either be a dangerous servant, or a fearful master." -George Washington "NUTS!" -Gen. McCallister (Ask me)

Ya, well, it's not getting any better. Santa Maria is the most populous city in Santa Barbara County. Lots of Gang activity. Pretty sad, actually. Fortunately, I just work here, and don't live here.

The reason I say global warming cause by man is a hoax is because global temperatures over the last eight years have declined to 1979 levels, according to NASA. Local weather oddities have nothing to do with my statement that global warming being caused by man is a hoax. Man has nothing to do with global weather / environmental patterns.

The data collected from all of our global weather satellites, which are controlled by NASA, show a global decrease in temperature in the last eight years. Obviously, some places have experienced warming, others cooling, but the average temperature globally has decreased in the last eight years to levels last seen in 1979. Since we are talking about a global issue, local temperature observations are not really applicable. I live on the Central Coast of the Peoples Republic of California, and indeed we have had some warm days this month. Of course the warmest days in recorded history were this year, in the summer, when it got to 117Degrees F in Santa Maria, CA, where I work.

According to NASA the global average temperature has cooled in the last eight years. How can there be "global warming"? Simply, there is not. Furthermore, as I've described in my thread on "ENVIRONMENT", the position of the SUN in respect to the Earth is so overwhelmingly influential to our climate that not even the largest recorded natural disasters in human history (Mt. Saint Helens / Mt. Pinatubo / Krakatowa) could change our environment for more than a brief period. For example, Mt. Pinatubo ejected 120 MILLION tons of Sulfur Dioxide into the atmosphere, resulting in almost NO change at all, for just a few months. Humans take decades to spew that much. I'm with A-Train on this. It is a front to usher in a global government. It is a scam.

Yes the supply is 4 to 1. That is interesting. You know that Gas costs about $.7 less than it did in 1950? Hard to believe, eh? Here's the deal. Take sound money, in this instance, a one dollar, pure silver, American Eagle. In FRN's it costs about $20. So you could buy about 7.7 gallons with it with gas at $2.60 in FRN's. That comes to about $2.25 FRN per gallon, which is a little over 10% of the value of the American Eagle. If we divide that into the sound money value of the American Eagle (one dollar, silver) we come up with about 23cents. Gas cost about 30cents per gallon in 1950! By the way, I didn't even bother to take into account the increase in percentage of taxation per gallon we face today versus 1950! So, the real value, in sound money of a gallon of gas today is about 23 CENTS. In 1950 it was about 30 CENTS. That's 7 CENTS more than today, 58 years later. Even with a higher tax we are paying less than we did in 1950 for a gallon of gas... WOW!!!

Hmmmm, I agree with everything. I'd like to add that though real money as defined by the US Constitution is not inflation proof, it is remarkably stable. The value of Gold and Silver has been remarkably stable throughout history, with one ounce of Gold buying a good suit of clothes. The ratio of Gold value to Silver has stood at about 16 to 1. It has been skewed of late because of its' fixation on the FRN... 16 to 1, very stable.

The Founders would roll over in their graves. We are nationalizing our banks! Straight out of the Communist Manifesto...absolutely amazing that these idiots are not thrown out by the people...

Tithing is most certainly NOT progressive in nature. Everybody pays 10%. You REALLY need to learn the meaning of this economic terminology. A progressive income tax is one in which a person that makes more pays a bigger percentage in tax. A person who makes less pays a lower percentage in tax. A regressive tax is just the opposite. The more you make the less percentage you pay. The less you make the more you pay in percentage. A flat tax (similar to tithing) is where everyone, regardless of income, pays the same percentage. In tithing, this is 10%. With a national flat tax (as proposed by Neal Bortz) it would be about 18%, on consumption. I agree with Jesus Christ who said charitable contributions should be voluntary. Absolutely, wealthy people should voluntarily give more of what they have to give. Where you are wrong is in the connection of such giving to the force of government. The hard core communist would not agree with Jesus Christ. If you think so, you don't know either, to be blunt. Communism is anti-Christ. It is anti-liberty. As a great man once said, "Free agency is so central to the plan of salvation that the Lord would protect it, even at the price of war" (David O. McKay). The taking by force (government) from one, and giving it directly to another is theft. It is satanic, and when in the extreme, it is communism. You need to revise your position. The Communist believe in a repressive military. Under our inspired Constitution, no such military is possible or appropriate.

I absolutely agree with you.

The "welfare" (now there's a misnomer if I've ever seen one) system is theft and therefore is abuse. The alternative of not taxing people into poverty is having them be able to more efficiently care for their fellow man. Your argument that we are incapable of doing so, absent government intervention is absurd. The history of America is the history of the most giving people in human history. Even with our absurd tax burden of today, we are still the most giving people in all of human history. There IS a better way, it's called freedom. It's called liberty. And it is enshrined in the principles of our Declaration of Independence and the United States Constitution. Government is horribly inefficient in almost all respects.

You should be appalled to be called a communist. Communism is satanic, as all of our Prophets have taught. Capitalism in the extreme, absent the checks of a free market, does indeed equate to "glorified slavery". When government intervenes, and prohibits the natural checks of a free market upon capitalism, is when the "glorified slavery" happens, as with the current banking crisis. Strict regulation of private business (someones property) is communism and will never work, and has resulted in the deaths of hundreds of millions of people globally. Non-free market capitalism (fabian socialism) is not much better. Free-market capitalism where the government only enforces contracts and provides sound money for trade (the proper function of government), has proven itself to be the best remedy to the problems we now face. Ironic it is that that is exactly what the American founders created with their Constitutional Republic. If only we'd follow it! Communism is not the answer. And thanks for reading the books we've mentioned. I do appreciate it.

The central reason for denouncing the PROGRESSIVE income tax (not just income tax in general) is that it is a central tenet of Marxist Communism. There is a reason Marxist Communism has it as a central tenet. Does that not concern you? I am against the evil that is communism. I want no part of it. On to tax. I support government taxing the citizen to pay for the proper functioning of government. I've no problem with a level income tax. Everyone pays the same. I'm perfectly aware of the pass-along corporate taxes we endure. We pay too much in tax because our government does too much. It does that for which it has no Constitutional mandates. In reality, the government ran quite well without the use of income tax.

Yep. Who decides? The Government? The government is the most non-efficient means of doing almost anything. Why would you want the government in charge? It is theft, whether the government does it, or I do it.

That ideal is bluntly stated as theft, government sponsored theft. If the individual has no right to take of a persons labor and give to another, then no amount of individuals combined have the right. Government has no "rights" whatsoever. To take from one, by force, and give to another, what is not theirs, is theft.

Then you are socialist.

1) The Kingdom of God as a government on Earth will come at the second coming of Christ. 2) Joseph Smith said we were to save the Constitution, not get a new one, until Christ returned. 3) The following is communism and Marxist: "I'm also a fan of another system. It's a type of fiat system where the Government prints money as legal tender then sets it's value. With government enforcement it would always retain that set value. This would only work in a planned economy where products were of set value as well. So regardless of how much money was made it would have the same value. No inflation or deflation. Instead of the value being determined by international trading it is set. Obvoiusly this would take a lot of work to actually work." Karl Marx said the following in his treatise, "The Communist Manifesto", wherein he gives ten steps to achieve communism: Centralization of credit in the hands of the state, by means of a national bank with State capital and an exclusive monopoly.

And you would be wrong. I to do not believe companies are inherently infallible or that government are inherently infallible or that people are inherently infallible. I to believe that companies should have a check on them by government. Government must insure that contracts are upheld. That is the proper function of government. In the United States the Federal Government is to provide sound money (constitutional) for proper commerce. All of this insures property rights. Your not socialist unless you believe the labor of one should be taken by force and given to another.

I never said that Congress is constrained to Gold or Silver only. However, because the States can use only Gold or Silver, and given what the Founders said about it, that was to be the primary metal(s) used. The Coinage Act of 1792 allows for copper pennies. The fairest system is the Free Market. Allow men to freely trade with one another, using honest money (as established by law, the ONLY proper function of Government in the economy) and you shall have the most propsperous people in history. It is only when government intervenes where it ought not, where inequities arise. As A-Train said, "Economics in One Lesson" is a GREAT work on the Free-Market. It is a quick read. For a very intensive treatise of paper currency read, "The Paper Aristocracy". For the greatest treatise on sound money ever written, read, "MONEY: Ye shall have honest weights and measures" If you can read those three things and still espouse Marxist-Communism (knowingly or not) then so be it.