One Global Faith -- Is It Possible?

[candyprpl]

I'm not shocked by that poll -- Atheists are a minority and when has there not been prejudice and bigotry when it comes to a minority?

BTW -- I hate it all!

[DigitalShadow]

I'm not shocked by that poll -- Atheists are a minority and when has there not been prejudice and bigotry when it comes to a minority?

BTW -- I hate it all!

Some minorities are hated more than others, but in general, sadly you are right.

[Guest ceeboo]

Some minorities are hated more than others, but in general, sadly you are right.

Hello DigitalShadow,

Yes indeed, I ( Catholic / minority ) on this LDS forum is evidence of that :lol:

[Starfish]

Do the non-Mormons feel unwelcome here? I hope not. I haven't seen that, but I could be wrong. Again, I certainly hope not; that would be terrible. Generally LDS are usually the friendliest and most welcoming people I've known.

I have a question about the accusation of "hate". We, of the conservative leaning, are accused of hating all the time. We hate homosexuals. We hate liberals. We hate blacks. We hate abortionists. We hate sinners. On and on.

I can't speak for anyone but myself, but I DON'T HATE ANYONE. There are a few individuals I know personally that I don't care for, but hate? No.

Just because someone doesn't agree with you, it doesn't mean they HATE you.

[abqfriend]

I am a Catholic on this forum.

I have found that---- if I give respect, I get respect in return.

I have found most members of this forum to be very nice people.

I have come to learn about the LDS faith tradition as well as share some of my faith tradition with others.

I have met some very nice people on this forum.

-Carol

Do the non-Mormons feel unwelcome here? I hope not. I haven't seen that, but I could be wrong. Again, I certainly hope not; that would be terrible. Generally LDS are usually the friendliest and most welcoming people I've known.

[Guest ceeboo]

Hello starfish,

To be clear, I was kidding ( probably a bad attempt at humor ) I am sorry for that.:)

I have been MORE than welcome here and have enjoyed being here a great deal.:):)

God bless,

Carl

[Starfish]

I'm not shocked by that poll -- Atheists are a minority and when has there not been prejudice and bigotry when it comes to a minority?

BTW -- I hate it all!

I'm one who is less likely (I didn't say never) to vote for an atheist. I've voted for people of many religions. I've voted for candidates of many different minorities.

The simple reason is that I prefer my civic leaders praying to God. I prefer that they have at least a semblance of Heavenly guidance as they lead my community, state or country. However, to be honest, I've only know the religious preferences of a very few. Since to us God-believers, God is VERY real, so this natually factors into the criteria we use. Is this bigotry? I'm not even picky as to how one views God, or what name they give Him. If they believe in a higher power, I can hope they are praying, and I can then hope their decisions are influenced in a Godly way. I honestly believe that God was instrumental in setting up this country (USA) and I believe, as our Founding Fathers did, that God's influence is vital to it's success and survival.

It's not the ONLY criteria, but one of many.

Am I bigoted if I prefer to vote for Republicans, or rather conservatives?

Edited October 22, 2008 by Starfish

[candyprpl]

Hello DigitalShadow,

Yes indeed, I ( Catholic / minority ) on this LDS forum is evidence of that :lol:

:lol:

Ceeboo, who hates you? I'll have a talk with them:p:lol:

[DigitalShadow]

Do the non-Mormons feel unwelcome here? I hope not. I haven't seen that, but I could be wrong. Again, I certainly hope not; that would be terrible. Generally LDS are usually the friendliest and most welcoming people I've known.

I have a question about the accusation of "hate". We, of the conservative leaning, are accused of hating all the time. We hate homosexuals. We hate liberals. We hate blacks. We hate abortionists. We hate sinners. On and on.

I can't speak for anyone but myself, but I DON'T HATE ANYONE. There are a few individuals I know personally that I don't care for, but hate? No.

Just because someone doesn't agree with you, it doesn't mean they HATE you.

I have never felt unwelcome here and in general I agree that most LDS memers are generally very friendly and welcoming.

The only time that I mentioned "hate" was agreeing with the general tendency of societies to "hate" groups of minorities. This has been seen throughout history and I doubt it will be changing anytime soon. People in general are quick to find a scapegoat to blame all their problems on and that can quickly turn to blind hate which is passed on to children.

I am well aware that simply because someone doesn't agree doesn't mean they HATE, but I am also aware that there are some people who truly do HATE. I don't think anyone on this thread or even this forum in my recent memory has really expressed hate and I am not quick to accuse people of it, but it is certainly out there.

[DigitalShadow]

I'm one who is less likely (I didn't say never) to vote for an atheist. I've voted for people of many religions. I've voted for candidates of many different minorities.

The simple reason is that I prefer my civic leaders praying to God. I prefer that they have at least a semblance of Heavenly guidance as they lead my community, state or country. However, to be honest, I've only know the religious preferences of a very few. Since to us God-believers, God is VERY real, so this natually factors into the criteria we use. Is this bigotry? I'm not even picky as to how one views God, or what name they give Him. If they believe in a higher power, I can hope they are praying, and I can then hope their decisions are influenced in a Godly way. I honestly believe that God was instrumental in setting up this country (USA) and I believe, as our Founding Fathers did, that God's influence is vital to it's success and survival.

It's not the ONLY criteria, but one of many.

Am I bigoted if I prefer to vote for Republicans, or rather conservatives?

I have never had the choice in an election (presidential or otherwise) to vote for someone who shares my religious view and frankly think it is far less relevant (not completely irrelevant) than other qualities a candidate could have.

I don't think that people who said they would not vote for an otherwise well qualified atheist were being bigoted. The reason I brought it up was to demonstrate the dislike and to a large extent distrust of atheists in this country. There are other polls in the article I link that demonstrate this as well.

[Misshalfway]

Half the world thinks our country in general is the devil. If the ultimate test in this life is learning to coexist, the vast majority of people are failing miserably.

I know that Mormons face discrimination and prejudice and I am not trying to belittle your trials, but I really think you underestimate the dislike in this country for atheists.

Perhaps you are right about that. I don't know many atheists or spend a lot of time studying a day in the life.....

I guess I always knew about this poll and that when it came to a trusted position such as the presidency that there was some prejudice. But in other arenas, atheism sometimes seems fashionable if not popular. So, maybe what I am saying is thank you for opening my eyes a bit. I mean that for Godless too. I always enjoy posts that help me stretch my field of vision.

Edited October 22, 2008 by Misshalfway
punctuation

[DigitalShadow]

Perhaps you are right about that. I don't know many atheists or spend a lot of time studying a day in the life.....

I guess I always knew about this poll and that when it came to a trusted position such as the presidency that there was some prejudice. But in other arenas, atheism sometimes seems fashionable if not popular. So, maybe what I am saying is thank you for opening my eyes a bit. I mean that for Godless too. I always enjoy posts that help me stretch my field of vision.

Here is my opinion of what is going on based on personal experience:

Before the internet became such a large part of people's lives, atheists were often more isolated, sometimes the only members of their family that feel that way and it was not easy to find other people who they can relate to because when you tell someone you are an atheist you will sometimes meet immediate hostility and usually at least subtle disdain.

Now that technology allows us to communicate with all kinds of people all over the world easier than you can communicate with your next door neighbor, atheists can connect and form communities like never before. There is definitely a growing atheist subculture in this country, but to call it popular or fashionable is a bit much in my opinion. It's not as if the atheist population is growing incredibly quickly, but atheists are now more comfortable with being who they are rather than hiding their lack of belief for fear of mobs lynching them.

[Guest ceeboo]

:lol:

Ceeboo, who hates you? I'll have a talk with them:p:lol:

Hey candy,:)

I will not rat these two people out, that would be very un-Christian.

I will tell you that the two names kinda sound like ( Mytor and FemiLakota ):lol::lol

To be crystal clear, I am kidding

Peace,

Carl

[ztodd]

If I refuse to vote for an atheists, does that automatically mean I dislike atheists?

I don't think it does.

I don't like atheism and what it does to people. But I can still like the people.

[DigitalShadow]

If I refuse to vote for an atheists, does that automatically mean I dislike atheists?

I don't think it does.

I don't like atheism and what it does to people. But I can still like the people.

If I refuse to vote for a Mormon based solely on the fact that they are a Mormon it does that mean I dislike Mormons? No, but I would say it gives a strong indication.

Also, as I said before, that is not the only poll in the article I linked.

Out of curiousity, what is it that you think atheism does to people?

Edited October 22, 2008 by DigitalShadow
added last question

[ztodd]

If I refuse to vote for a Mormon based solely on the fact that they are a Mormon it does that mean I dislike Mormons? No, but I would say it gives a strong indication.

Also, as I said before, that is not the only poll in the article I linked.

Out of curiousity, what is it that you think atheism does to people?

Hehe, after I posted that, I wondered if you would ask...

Basically it takes away hope. Without belief in a higher saving power, how can anyone have hope for their own or for anyone else's eternal welfare? It also takes away motivation. There's no doubt that the hope of an eternal reward helps provide motivation to live a better life.

[DigitalShadow]

Hehe, after I posted that, I wondered if you would ask...

Basically it takes away hope. Without belief in a higher saving power, how can anyone have hope for their own or for anyone else's eternal welfare? It also takes away motivation. There's no doubt that the hope of an eternal reward helps provide motivation to live a better life.

That all depends on your outlook, my friend. I assume that this mortal life is the only shot at existance we have, our only chance to feel or experience anything and so I savor every minute of it and make the most of my time here. I treat other people nicely because that is how I would want to be treated, no dogma or eternal reward necessary :)

Don't get me wrong, I've seen various religions help many people get their lives together and I am truly happy for them, but it is incorrect to assume that everyone needs religion to lead a good, fullfilling and happy life.

Edited October 23, 2008 by DigitalShadow

[ztodd]

That all depends on your outlook, my friend. I assume that this mortal life is the only shot at existance we have, our only chance to feel or experience anything and so I savor every minute of it and make the most of my time here. I treat other people nicely because that is how I would want to be treated, no dogma or eternal reward necessary :)

Don't get me wrong, I've seen various religions help many people get their lives together and I am truly happy for them, but it is incorrect to assume that everyone needs religion to lead a good, fullfilling and happy life.

Everyone needs God and Jesus Christ to save them. I applaud you for being able to find reasons to live a good life and be kind to others, but you could find an even greater hope and motivation if you would choose to believe in God and learn of His plan. You assume this life is all there is to our existence, but what if you're wrong? Eternity is a long time.

Anyhow, sorry to take this thread off track a bit. :)

[Guest Godless]

Everyone needs God and Jesus Christ to save them. I applaud you for being able to find reasons to live a good life and be kind to others, but you could find an even greater hope and motivation if you would choose to believe in God and learn of His plan. You assume this life is all there is to our existence, but what if you're wrong? Eternity is a long time.

The main beef that I've always had with religion is that puts so much emphasis on an intangible afterlife and expects followers to live a certain way for the sake of that afterlife. I'd much rather live for this life than focus on an uncertain state of existence that might greet me when I die. What if you're wrong? Wouldn't it be depressing to think that you've wasted your entire life living for an eternal reward that doesn't exist rather than spending that time enjoying the life you had?

[Hemidakota]

When we begin to talk about those [afterlife] states and its applicable laws that is required for those who wish to live it, begins with those who already seen it.

[HiJolly]

The main beef that I've always had with religion is that puts so much emphasis on an intangible afterlife and expects followers to live a certain way for the sake of that afterlife. I'd much rather live for this life than focus on an uncertain state of existence that might greet me when I die. What if you're wrong? Wouldn't it be depressing to think that you've wasted your entire life living for an eternal reward that doesn't exist rather than spending that time enjoying the life you had?

I think that's the main reason President Monson in General Conference this month gave a whole talk of experiencing the "Joy of the Journey". :)

HiJolly

[Starfish]

The main beef that I've always had with religion is that puts so much emphasis on an intangible afterlife and expects followers to live a certain way for the sake of that afterlife. I'd much rather live for this life than focus on an uncertain state of existence that might greet me when I die. What if you're wrong? Wouldn't it be depressing to think that you've wasted your entire life living for an eternal reward that doesn't exist rather than spending that time enjoying the life you had?

I agree with you that sometimes our focus is out of whack. It's something that I've realized of late and am trying to change.

I believe our true focus should be on God. What is His will? What will please him? Do I love Him enough for that alone to matter?

IOW, if God commanded me to do something and I KNEW there'd be no blessing from it, would I do it? Would I be obedient simply because I love my Father in Heaven so much that pleasing Him is enough, regardless of my "reward"? Regardless of eternal families, Celestial Kingdom, eternal life, etc. Just to please my God because I love Him. I think that's what is meant by charity. It's also interesting, I think, that I figured this out via discussions with non-LDS Christians.

And as said before, we do ask ourselves "What if I'm wrong?" Quite often. However, there's just too darn much evidence to discount the Gospel. Speaking only for myself, I'd be a fool to leave it.

Edited October 23, 2008 by Starfish

[Misshalfway]

The main beef that I've always had with religion is that puts so much emphasis on an intangible afterlife and expects followers to live a certain way for the sake of that afterlife. I'd much rather live for this life than focus on an uncertain state of existence that might greet me when I die. What if you're wrong? Wouldn't it be depressing to think that you've wasted your entire life living for an eternal reward that doesn't exist rather than spending that time enjoying the life you had?

While I understand this observation and even agree with it, this doesn't completely square with my understanding of the purpose of life from the LDS perspective (which is really the only religious perspective I can comfortably speak from). We believe that "men are that they might have joy." I think that most of the gospel of Jesus Christ, from my understanding, is all about this life and how to live it and how to live with others who are trying to live it too.

Understanding where we came from and understanding where we are going after we die are, I think, essential components to understanding the purpose of this life and in keeping perspective with regards to what happens to us here. We all must at one time or another, deal with death. I think that understanding truth above any other thing, helps us deal best with death. It is like the child that doesn't need a white lie to comfort him.....he needs the truth and deals best that way. We are all that way in my opinion. I am guessing that from your perspective, that religion might feel like a fable that comforts us but doesn't exactly square with reality. I can understand that. But from my vantage point, truth is the pursuit on any subject and if there is truth about this world I need and truth about the world to come, I want to know that too. And from that perspective, I do think that learning about the afterlife is beneficial. But I do agree that living only for the afterlife at the expense of today is no real way to live.

Edited October 23, 2008 by Misshalfway

[DigitalShadow]

Everyone needs God and Jesus Christ to save them. I applaud you for being able to find reasons to live a good life and be kind to others, but you could find an even greater hope and motivation if you would choose to believe in God and learn of His plan. You assume this life is all there is to our existence, but what if you're wrong? Eternity is a long time.

Anyhow, sorry to take this thread off track a bit. :)

And what if you're wrong and are going to be sent to some other religion's Hell? As you say, eternity is a long time. No matter what religious beliefs you hold, the majority of the world disagrees with you.

Did you know there is even an area of the world that is mostly atheist? They seem to do quite well too. Not that I'd move there, but it is interesting from a sociological perspective and examining the question of whether religion is needed for a society to function and even thrive.

Check it out.

[candyprpl]

While I understand this observation and even agree with it, this doesn't completely square with my understanding of the purpose of life from the LDS perspective (which is really the only religious perspective I can comfortably speak from). We believe that "men are that they might have joy." I think that most of the gospel of Jesus Christ, from my understanding, is all about this life and how to live it and how to live with others who are trying to live it too.

Understanding where we came from and understanding where we are going after we die are, I think, essential components to understanding the purpose of this life and in keeping perspective with regards to what happens to us here. We all must at one time or another, deal with death. I think that understanding truth above any other thing, helps us deal best with death. It is like the child that doesn't need a white lie to comfort him.....he needs the truth and deals best that way. We are all that way in my opinion. I am guessing that from your perspective, that religion might feel like a fable that comforts us but doesn't exactly square with reality. I can understand that. But from my vantage point, truth is the pursuit on any subject and if there is truth about this world I need and truth about the world to come, I want to know that too. And from that perspective, I do think that learning about the afterlife is beneficial. But I do agree that living only for the afterlife at the expense of today is no real way to live.

Yeah, what she said, :)

I'm enjoying life immensly and I like knowing that this is not the only life there is, however, it's not the only reason I'm enjoying this life. Even if this was it and when we died that was the end, what would I have lost by believing in a next life. If you're dead, you're dead, no regrets to be felt.