Decisions...Decisions

[YellowLight]

I was reading through the thread started by Godless, "Coming Clean" and realized that sooner or later both DW's as well as my parents will find out about us leaving the church. The reason, we will not have membership numbers next to our names at tithing settlement. DW's parents already know that we DO NOT attend church. They asked me one time, and I told them and that was the end of the conversation. I think they will be the least affected of the bunch.

My parents on the other hand are "TBM" if you will, even though I would consider my mom to be a social mormon. However, I think my father will try to argue doctrine with me and show that he is right, that is just an assumption, but it is just his personality...can't ever be wrong kind of guy.

So, the dilemma. DW's parents are many miles away so it will be the letter approach or through a phone call. My parent's are close so it would be the letter or face to face. I guess the big question is this...if you were to find this out about one of your children, what would you prefer the delivery method to be and why?

We both know that our parents will be upset regardless, but we are adults and the decision is ultimately ours to make. Still, for this reason, we have held off from telling them and know that it WILL cause contention. Also, if anyone thinks it appropriate, I could post the letter that would go to my parents here so you may have a better understanding of what they would receive.

Thanks!!!

[Honor]

Hmm, maybe I'm just clueless, but your names still show up on your parent's tithing settlement records even after you're out on your own/married?

I've honestly never thought about how something like this would be communicated to parents. I know lots of people who just leave it as the elephant in the living room for years and years and everyone just kinda knows it without there being any formal announcement. I almost think that it would hurt more to receive a formal letter than personally sitting down with them or talking to them on the phone. Is the purpose of letting them know so they don't find another way and feel hurt? Are you wanting to go into the exact reasons that you left the church with them? I don't know the dynamic of the relationships you have with them, but hearing hard news would always be better in the most personal form possible... imo. Good luck though.

[YellowLight]

Hmm, maybe I'm just clueless, but your names still show up on your parent's tithing settlement records even after you're out on your own/married?

I believe the names would remain on the record that our parents receive as we are their children. But, the way I understand it, we will not have the membership number by our names.

I've honestly never thought about how something like this would be communicated to parents. I know lots of people who just leave it as the elephant in the living room for years and years and everyone just kinda knows it without there being any formal announcement. I almost think that it would hurt more to receive a formal letter than personally sitting down with them or talking to them on the phone. Is the purpose of letting them know so they don't find another way and feel hurt? Are you wanting to go into the exact reasons that you left the church with them? I don't know the dynamic of the relationships you have with them, but hearing hard news would always be better in the most personal form possible... imo. Good luck though.

I know what you mean. It really is the elephant in the room. DW still dresses modestly so my parent's never notice the missing garments or anything, and if you saw us, you might even say "that family is mormon." :) And yes, we do not want them finding out at their tithing settlement, I could not imagine the shock if I were in their shoes. In the letter that we typed up, we discussed that we did not leave for the typical reasons that people leave and we have given this much thought. We also mention that we would or would not discuss any doctrine with them as long as their were no hidden motives, I would want to know. We also mention that we have no problem dearing of discussing church callings, activities or attending church functions such as baptisms. I know our siblings will have children and we are still family. Thank you for your advice as it will not be thrown to the wind.

[Gwen]

i think if it were my kid telling me (my oldest is about to be baptized so... all conjecture on my part lol) i'd want a letter. it gives me time to process it, think about it, deal with my first reaction in private. then when i am with my kid talking about it there won't be the shock factor, just addressing it as/if needed. if it was done face to face and i was shocked (i tend to figure things out ahead of time) i'm pretty cool about things, i wouldn't really show it much at that moment.

[Honor]

We also mention that we would or would not discuss any doctrine with them as long as their were no hidden motives, I would want to know. We also mention that we have no problem dearing of discussing church callings, activities or attending church functions such as baptisms. I know our siblings will have children and we are still family. Thank you for your advice as it will not be thrown to the wind.

I hardly feel like I have any experience that would make it ok to give advice, but know that I do hope that things go well for you. I can imagine that your whole family will have an adjustment period, figuring out how to act (which is silly really since the most likely/ideal conclusion will be that nothing needs to change), but I think it's great that you guys are being open and thorough in your thoughts about possible situations. If there's a right way to handle a situation like this, it sounds like you're doing it.

[talisyn]

Is this for your benefit or for your parents benefit? I mean, how hard is it to just live your life and allow your parents the same without the whole 'I don't want to live a lie' drama

[lilered]

My thoughts on this are this. Why do you feel the need to say anything? If you are married and have your own family, then it truly is your decision. If it is out of respect for the parents, then I would not write them a letter. I would instead would sit down with them at the appropriate time and simply let them know of your decision and lovingly indicate to them that it is not open for discussion. They in turn should respect that decision all though clearly they will be upset.

When I joined the church, a third party told my mother before I got the chance. She is Lutheran and I was raised Lutheran. She was hurt and upset that she had to hear it from someone else and that I didn't think enough of her to tell her. The truth was I wasn't sure how she would take it, so I kept putting it off. In hindsight, I wish I had just been forthright and told her before I was baptized.

[YellowLight]

Is this for your benefit or for your parents benefit? I mean, how hard is it to just live your life and allow your parents the same without the whole 'I don't want to live a lie' drama

This is for the benefit of everyone involved. And you ask how hard is it to just live and let live, unfortunately it is quite difficult when the church teaches that we are breaking up our eternal family unit, the MOST important thing above all. After all, that is what the temples are for. So, either you are extremely unfamilar with the amount of difficulty in leaving, or you are just naive. Either way, we don't want to live a lie, but I guarantee there will be "drama."

[john doe]

I would guess that if they have been paying any kind of attention they already know you have left the fold, whether officially or not. To reopen the wound is unnecessary if you ask me. Some things are better left unsaid unless a showdown is forced upon you.

BTW, I believe you are wrong about how they would find out through tithing settlement. My understanding is that when a child turns 18 they in effect become their own separate entity in the eyes of the church, and your records are no longer bound to theirs.

[Guest Godless]

Is this for your benefit or for your parents benefit? I mean, how hard is it to just live your life and allow your parents the same without the whole 'I don't want to live a lie' drama

It's harder than you think. Like YellowLight said, the LDS doctrine of eternal family cohesion makes it very difficult for parents to see their children "stray from the path". I've been keeping my parents in the dark about certain things pertaining to my lifestyle because I don't want to hurt them any more than I already have. The truth always comes out eventually though, and I think it's safe to say that the live-and-let-live mentality is rarely going to prevail in such cases. There will be hurt feelings and a lot of healing that will have to take place. Such is the nature of the LDS faith. I've said it before and I'll say it again: Mormon culture can be a VERY difficult thing to break away from.

[john doe]

I've said it before and I'll say it again: Mormon culture can be a VERY difficult thing to break away from.

In some areas, I'll concede that breaking from the culture is difficult. Breaking away from the church though? Easy. I see it all the time. I've had family do it, I've had friends do it. Unless people are blind, they know or have seen the signs of it for a long time. They know, they have known for a long time, whether they want to admit it out loud or not.

[YellowLight]

In some areas, I'll concede that breaking from the culture is difficult. Breaking away from the church though? Easy. I see it all the time. I've had family do it, I've had friends do it. Unless people are blind, they know or have seen the signs of it for a long time. They know, they have known for a long time, whether they want to admit it out loud or not.

Agreed. I think in heavy populated places, it would be extremely difficult to create your own culture and identity after leaving. I also think it is relatively easy to leave the church, whether just being less-active or actually leaving. However, as I stated before, the difficult part of leaving is the torrment that happens to the active extended family. The mother is left to feel that she didn't do enough as she is told repeatedly that it is her responsibility to raise the children in "these latter days" and the eternal family is seperated forever. Not believing in it anymore, the only anguish that I feel is knowing the grief period, if you will, of what will be said by other members to them along with the feelings in their head. That is the difficult part.

[Elphaba]

A word of advice: If you are planning on telling them why you left the Church, be prepared for them not to care. It's my observation they will only want to know so they can convince you you're wrong.

I've seen people write extensive letters to family and friends, detailing every point on why the Church is not true, and it only causes more hurt and anger for all parties involved.

I just left on my own, and never bothered to explain it to anyone; however, they've never asked either. Only one of them has tried to convince me I am wrong, but it was a mild attempt. They've never badgered me about it, and most of them are staunch LDS. I have always appreciated that, though I admit, I still would like them to hear me out without judgement.

On the other hand, realistically, how can any TBM do that given their strong beliefs about the Church's doctrine? I think that is understandable.

I suspect my family members take comfort in the fact that I can still return to the Church down the road, though they may think they'll be visiting me in one of the lower kingdoms (if I even make it there).

Edited May 26, 2009 by Elphaba

[Guest Godless]

Agreed. I think in heavy populated places, it would be extremely difficult to create your own culture and identity after leaving. I also think it is relatively easy to leave the church, whether just being less-active or actually leaving. However, as I stated before, the difficult part of leaving is the torrment that happens to the active extended family. The mother is left to feel that she didn't do enough as she is told repeatedly that it is her responsibility to raise the children in "these latter days" and the eternal family is seperated forever. Not believing in it anymore, the only anguish that I feel is knowing the grief period, if you will, of what will be said by other members to them along with the feelings in their head. That is the difficult part.

Couldn't have said it better myself. Thank you.

[hordak]

Send them this

Joseph Smith

(1805–44)

First President of the Church

“The Prophet Joseph Smith declared—and he never taught a more comforting doctrine—that the eternal sealings of faithful parents and the divine promises made to them for valiant service in the Cause of Truth, would save not only themselves, but likewise their posterity. Though some of the sheep may wander, the eye of the Shepherd is upon them, and sooner or later they will feel the tentacles of Divine Providence reaching out after them and drawing them back to the fold. Either in this life or the life to come, they will return. They will have to pay their debt to justice; they will suffer for their sins; and may tread a thorny path; but if it leads them at last, like the penitent Prodigal, to a loving and forgiving father’s heart and home, the painful experience will not have been in vain. Pray for your careless and disobedient children; hold on to them with your faith. Hope on, trust on, till you see the salvation of God” (Orson F. Whitney, in Conference Report, Apr. 1929, 110).

LDS.org - Ensign Article - Hope for Parents of Wayward Children

More quotes provided at link.

Regardless of your belief this page gives quite a few quotes by the leadership that indicate sealed families will be together even if the children "stray". You might not believe this is true but it may comfort your parents.

[lilered]

May I ask a dumb question? When one talks about leaving the church is it understood:

1 - That the person is simply stopping their activity either temporary or permanent or

2 - Taking the necessary steps to have their name removed from the church roles.

There is certaintly a difference. For those that might answer # 1, then this may be far easier for family to accept that # 2.

Also, # 2 requires more action on the part of the member than # 1 does and indicates the member is much more serious.

We have a great many members who quit attending the LDS Church and may even be attending another faith, but they have never put forth the effort to have their names removed, nor in some cases have they desired to have their name removed.

[Tough Grits]

[...]However, as I stated before, the difficult part of leaving is the torrment that happens to the active extended family. The mother is left to feel that she didn't do enough as she is told repeatedly that it is her responsibility to raise the children in "these latter days" and the eternal family is seperated forever. Not believing in it anymore, the only anguish that I feel is knowing the grief period, if you will, of what will be said by other members to them along with the feelings in their head. That is the difficult part.

Your concern and understanding for how your family or DW's family will react is sincere and shows your level of compassion.

Ignoring the LDS aspect for a moment, I do believe that we all have our own lives to live and our own choices to make...but my love and compassion for my loved ones will hopefully always shape how I inform them or deal with them on certain issues.

I guess the big question is this...if you were to find this out about one of your children, what would you prefer the delivery method to be and why?

I would want my child to tell me in person for one simple reason: I would want to be assured that it was THEIR decision and not somebody else leading them or telling them to make that decision.

There are members who have "left" without having made any formal declarations. Sometimes I wonder if there are members who still attend church, but "left" long ago in their hearts.

I would still love my kids, even if they "left", and I would make every effort to love them and embrace them on their terms, as long as they did not ask me to leave or ask me to give up what I know to be true.

Of course, I would silently hope and pray that they would come back, but I would be very careful not to let my silent desire interfere with my relationship with them or push them away with an arrogant "holier than thou" attitude.

At least, that is how I hope I would act and behave were this situation ever to present itself. It would crush me to know that I was the reason my kids didn't want to be near me. I also want to be a grandmother one day, and I would hate losing out on that because my kids felt I was judging or condemning them. That is not my place.

My obligation is to do the best I can while I have them (in all areas, not just the gospel), and then let them take everything I taught them and make a life of their own.

I know they are going to make bad choices. I have. But I am just going to have to learn to be there for them when they come running, and to learn to be silent and say silent prayers when they don't come running.

That, I feel, is the hardest part of being a good parent.

~TG