Funding abortions

[boyando]

One thing that needs to be understood is that not at all abortions are elective. Not all women choose to abort a pregnancy. Right now, independent of whether health care reform passes or not your tax dollars already in a very tiny small amount (I mean lets face it, a few thousand a year MAYBE going to the government and divided between ALL the different needs...very little goes to health care anyway) go to funding abortions. There are many cases where a pregnant woman presents to the ER or other health care facilities and an abortion is performed because the woman will not live without it. People need to understand that at times ending a pregnancy is medically necessary.

Does any one know anyone who really wants to stop that kind of abortion?

[Guest]

Legislation wont work always. Here when abortions where banned, gynecologist would put then through as 'cysts removal' or something similar, and no one could stop them.

Just wanna get a clarification of this statement... Are you saying since legislation won't work always that we shouldn't bother having it? I'm not sure what side of the fence you're on.

If you're not okay with having healthcare money fund abortions, then it doesn't matter if the legislation won't cover all cases, the legislation is necessary.

If you're okay with having healthcare money fund abortions, then this is a bad reason for it. It's just like saying, well, Mexicans will just jump the border anyways, so there's no need for border laws. You have to come up with another reason.

[Charlyc]

Just wanna get a clarification of this statement... It's just like saying, well, Mexicans will just jump the border anyways, so there's no need for border laws

Yes. Doctors have ways of getting around these laws, as do mexicans getting around fences apparently , so those laws rarely work. But nothing wrong with adding it to this current bit of legislation -well 'bit' is probably the wrong word due to its size, but the doc will just write it up as something else, which is insurance fraud by the way so they do need to trust the women involved and know her well. (Oh just to clarify abortion is a big sin in my book and those cases of rape, life or health of the mother are extremely rare)

Some Doctors also ignore euthanasia laws, eg they'll pump cancer patients up with morphine knowing that its killing them. Must be why they talk about a God complex amongst doctors ??

[Charlyc]

Then why does the LDS church say that abortion is sometimes okay? Earlier in the thread it was said that if the mother's life is in danger then abortion is okay. Which brings us back to square one. Why is that mother's life more valuable than the unborn baby? The position of the Catholic Church says that you do everything in your power to save both, or that if the demise of the child is an unintended consequence of treatment, it is not the same as going in to kill the baby.

If the unborn baby is a baby, why is it ever, ever, ever okay to kill a baby?

I think its incorrect to say the LDS church says abortion is sometimes OK in some cases. Its more about the lesser of two evils. If the mother lives she could have more children but if she dies or in any way is in danger then both, the mother and that fetus, dies. You're saving one instead of none by allowing that very rare abortion.

Rape cases I'm personally not entirely convinced about what my church says. I'd rather the option of adoption be considered too but I'm not a woman and don't know what it could be like to carry my rapists child so I can't argue against it. However that Jayce Dugard (?) woman in California seems to be OK with her kids so I don't know...maybe its for the children sake but there is a popular actor here who's mom was raped and she gave birth to him and he's OK so I just don't know what to decide on this rape part of abortion.

Edited November 12, 2009 by Charlyc

[Wingnut]

Does any one know anyone who really wants to stop that kind of abortion?

Yeah. Sarah Palin.

Oh, you meant rational, thinking people.

...but I'm not a woman and don't know what it could be like to carry my rapists child so I can't argue against it.

You're right. So don't.

[Guest]

Yeah. Sarah Palin.

Oh, you meant rational, thinking people.

Cheap shot on Palin. Especially since her views coincide with the Roman Catholic position on abortion which only has... what, 22% of the entire US population on last count?

If you want to add to the discussion, at least say something with some decorum.

You're right. So don't.

Well, I'm a woman, and I believe a child conceived in rape has no fault in this situation, so why not give him a chance? (Rhetorical question, don't answer. Or you can if you must.)

[Wingnut]

Cheap shot on Palin. Especially since her views coincide with the Roman Catholic position on abortion which only has... what, 22% of the entire US population on last count?

If you want to add to the discussion, at least say something with some decorum.

Well, I'm a woman, and I believe a child conceived in rape has no fault in this situation, so why not give him a chance? (Rhetorical question, don't answer. Or you can if you must.)

Funny you should say that about the Catholic Church, because my initial thought was to say "Yeah, Sarah Palin and the Catholic Church." I decided to leave that off, however, because I know that we have Catholics on this board and I didn't want to come across like I was making a direct frontal assault, which I'm still not trying to do. I was responding to boyando's comment that insinuated that nobody doesn't want to take the mother's life into consideration, or her mental/emotional health in the case of rape. There are people who have an all or nothing policy, and Sarah Palin is one of them. There were many reasons why I voted Democrat a year ago, but the fact that Sarah Palin is 100% against abortions with absolutely no exceptions whatsoever was chief among them.

[pam]

Okay let's get it away from the political side of former candidates. Let's also keep it away from the shots against them.

[Guest]

Funny you should say that about the Catholic Church, because my initial thought was to say "Yeah, Sarah Palin and the Catholic Church." I decided to leave that off, however, because I know that we have Catholics on this board and I didn't want to come across like I was making a direct frontal assault, which I'm still not trying to do. I was responding to boyando's comment that insinuated that nobody doesn't want to take the mother's life into consideration, or her mental/emotional health in the case of rape. There are people who have an all or nothing policy, and Sarah Palin is one of them. There were many reasons why I voted Democrat a year ago, but the fact that Sarah Palin is 100% against abortions with absolutely no exceptions whatsoever was chief among them.

Then you have been brainwashed successfully by the kool-aid. Because, Sarah Palin is against abortions in the same manner as Catholics are. Read back to the discussion with Fatima and you can see how media can interpret that to mean 100% against. It is very easy to understand why Palin would have that position as well - she is the mother of a down-syndrome baby, is she not? If you would try to understand that position, maybe you will realize that it is not too much different from the LDS position (you're LDS, right?).

Somebody a while back accused Fatima of being close-minded... I hope it doesn't apply to both sides.

I'm an ex-Catholic, now LDS. Although I understand and appreciate the LDS view on abortion, I am still of the Catholic persuasion for reasons I have stated previously.

[Wingnut]

Then you have been brainwashed successfully by the kool-aid. Because, Sarah Palin is against abortions in the same manner as Catholics are. Read back to the discussion with Fatima and you can see how media can interpret that to mean 100% against. It is very easy to understand why Palin would have that position as well - she is the mother of a down-syndrome baby, is she not? If you would try to understand that position, maybe you will realize that it is not too much different from the LDS position (you're LDS, right?).

Somebody a while back accused Fatima of being close-minded... I hope it doesn't apply to both sides.

I'm an ex-Catholic, now LDS. Although I understand and appreciate the LDS view on abortion, I am still of the Catholic persuasion for reasons I have stated previously.

Well, according to fatima, the Catholic Church is 100% against abortion.

http://www.lds.net/forums/current-events/26258-funding-abortions-2.html#post427785

[Just_A_Guy]

There are people who have an all or nothing policy, and Sarah Palin is one of them. There were many reasons why I voted Democrat a year ago, but the fact that Sarah Palin is 100% against abortions with absolutely no exceptions whatsoever was chief among them.

With all due respect, Wingnut, that just isn't correct. She does make an exception--a smaller one than I would make, but an exception nonetheless.