USNationalist Posted November 17, 2005 Report Share Posted November 17, 2005 The church should lose its tax free exemption. What the pastor did was illeagle. He has all the free speach he wants- but as a tax emept institution it is illeagle to "campain" for politics- one side or the other. There are there for church- not political brain washings from a pastor. He can say whatever he wants when he isn't on the pulpit. Pushka- I dont know abut international crime rates. But (and i lost the exact numbers) Florida recently passed right to carry laws and has been encourageing gun ownership. Their violent crime rate went down 20% while the national average went up 12%. (again i lost where i read it from, so i cant remember the span of years). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest LDSister Posted November 17, 2005 Report Share Posted November 17, 2005 Originally posted by USNationalist@Nov 17 2005, 01:05 PMThe church should lose its tax free exemption. What the pastor did was illeagle. He has all the free speach he wants- but as a tax emept institution it is illeagle to "campain" for politics- one side or the other. There are there for church- not political brain washings from a pastor. He can say whatever he wants when he isn't on the pulpit.←______________________________By the same token, the government shouldn't impose itself on the church. When I go to church, I don't want to hear someone using the pulpit to campaign for their own political agenda...or any other agenda. But as Pres. Benson stated, the war in heaven was a political battle...and to speak of it, one might be accused of engaging in politics. To God, all things are spiritual, not temporal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fiannan Posted November 17, 2005 Author Report Share Posted November 17, 2005 I don't care if a pastor talks for or against Bush. If he can connect it to scripture then he should be able to say anything he pleases without the government trying to punish him. You know there are gay activists who would say that the LDS Church should lose tax exemption due to its political activities surrounding propositions against gay marriage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Member_Deleted Posted November 17, 2005 Report Share Posted November 17, 2005 Originally posted by Fiannan@Nov 17 2005, 03:59 PMI don't care if a pastor talks for or against Bush. If he can connect it to scripture then he should be able to say anything he pleases without the government trying to punish him. You know there are gay activists who would say that the LDS Church should lose tax exemption due to its political activities surrounding propositions against gay marriage.←Only because it has taken a moral issue and twisted into a political one... twist twist... until sense is non-sense and non-sense is sense.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest LDSister Posted November 17, 2005 Report Share Posted November 17, 2005 Originally posted by Fiannan@Nov 17 2005, 03:59 PMI don't care if a pastor talks for or against Bush. If he can connect it to scripture then he should be able to say anything he pleases without the government trying to punish him. You know there are gay activists who would say that the LDS Church should lose tax exemption due to its political activities surrounding propositions against gay marriage.←________________________Again, the government has no right to intrude into the Church. In regard to homosexuality, the Church serves God, not the government. The Church will never recognize gay marriage any more than it would recognize the government limiting the size and sex of one's family (as per China). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pushka Posted November 18, 2005 Report Share Posted November 18, 2005 Originally posted by USNationalist@Nov 17 2005, 07:05 PMPushka-I dont know abut international crime rates. But (and i lost the exact numbers) Florida recently passed right to carry laws and has been encourageing gun ownership. Their violent crime rate went down 20% while the national average went up 12%. (again i lost where i read it from, so i cant remember the span of years).←Thanks USNationalist! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
USNationalist Posted November 18, 2005 Report Share Posted November 18, 2005 <<The Church will never recognize gay marriage>> -it's a shame to. Seeing as how its a violation of Pauls teachings in Corinthians 5:9-13 -Holding unbelievers accountable to our standards is unchristian. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prisonchaplain Posted November 18, 2005 Report Share Posted November 18, 2005 Thought it was very interesting in last night's world news, that IRS has threatened to remove a churches tax exempt status because the minister spoke out from the pulpit against President Bush in the last election. We talk about free speech. That was here in America and I am sorry, I cannot remember where or which church. It was just that local church.Sadly, this is old news. Churches used to pass out voters' guide, express spiritual guidance on social issues (not only abortion, but also racism, etc.), and there were no issues. Lately churches have had to tread lightly. Ministries like Focus on the Family ended up created separate non-tax-exempt organizations for political action. It is still possible for people of faith to speak to power, but it is becoming an increasing challenge. The opposite extreme is hearing IRS employees warn ppl from the pulpit to pay their taxes!Jesus made it very clear that we are to "rendor unto Caesar"--and Caesar was an foreign occupation colonial empire! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest LDSister Posted November 18, 2005 Report Share Posted November 18, 2005 Originally posted by USNationalist@Nov 17 2005, 10:46 PM<<The Church will never recognize gay marriage>>-it's a shame to. Seeing as how its a violation of Pauls teachings in Corinthians 5:9-13 -Holding unbelievers accountable to our standards is unchristian.←__________________________Unbelievers have rejected the truth...does that mean we should alter the truth to suit the unbelievers? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
USNationalist Posted November 18, 2005 Report Share Posted November 18, 2005 <<Unbelievers have rejected the truth...does that mean we should alter the truth to suit the unbelievers?>> -i dont know how you even came up with that. The truth stays the same. They don't know it- so they don't know what they are doing is wrong. It is not our place to judge them. Christians are free to judge one another- because none of them have an excuse for sin. But as far as the unsaved go- its Gods place and his alone to pass judgement on their actions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest LDSister Posted November 18, 2005 Report Share Posted November 18, 2005 Originally posted by USNationalist@Nov 18 2005, 12:24 PM<<Unbelievers have rejected the truth...does that mean we should alter the truth to suit the unbelievers?>>-i dont know how you even came up with that. The truth stays the same. They don't know it- so they don't know what they are doing is wrong. It is not our place to judge them. Christians are free to judge one another- because none of them have an excuse for sin. But as far as the unsaved go- its Gods place and his alone to pass judgement on their actions.←__________________Oh what a total copout!!!Of course, some don't know any better...but then you have the militants who know exactly what they're doing and are waging war against God and the saints (I have seen some of that mentality in this very forum). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
USNationalist Posted November 18, 2005 Report Share Posted November 18, 2005 a total copout ripped from the scriptures of the bible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest LDSister Posted November 18, 2005 Report Share Posted November 18, 2005 Originally posted by USNationalist@Nov 18 2005, 01:07 PMa total copout ripped from the scriptures of the bible.←________________________Please quote the "copout" scripture in the Bible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
USNationalist Posted November 18, 2005 Report Share Posted November 18, 2005 9 I wrote to you in my letter not to associate with sexually immoral persons— 10not at all meaning the immoral of this world, or the greedy and robbers, or idolaters, since you would then need to go out of the world. 11But now I am writing to you not to associate with anyone who bears the name of brother or sister who is sexually immoral or greedy, or is an idolater, reviler, drunkard, or robber. Do not even eat with such a one. 12For what have I to do with judging those outside? Is it not those who are inside that you are to judge? 13God will judge those outside. ‘Drive out the wicked person from among you.’ -1 Corinthians 5:9-13 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Member_Deleted Posted November 18, 2005 Report Share Posted November 18, 2005 Originally posted by USNationalist@Nov 18 2005, 03:27 PM9 I wrote to you in my letter not to associate with sexually immoral persons— 10not at all meaning the immoral of this world, or the greedy and robbers, or idolaters, since you would then need to go out of the world. 11But now I am writing to you not to associate with anyone who bears the name of brother or sister who is sexually immoral or greedy, or is an idolater, reviler, drunkard, or robber. Do not even eat with such a one. 12For what have I to do with judging those outside? Is it not those who are inside that you are to judge? 13God will judge those outside. ‘Drive out the wicked person from among you.’-1 Corinthians 5:9-13←It has been very hard to follow your thinking on this one US...What exactly are you trying to say... that militants or anti's shouldn't be judge by us? Or that we shouldn't associate with them? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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