Sealed Twice?

[Franken]

I'm just really struggling about this aspect of the church and don't feel like I really understand it at all.

How is it that a man can get re-sealed to another woman should his first wife die? What would happen in the afterlife? It just seems like polygamy in heaven to me. And personally if I was the first wife and had passed away I wouldn't want to meet my husband in the afterlife and find out that oh hey he brought someone else with him by the way. How does that work out? Last thing, is the second wife sealed to the first children as well?

--Franken--

[Jason]

Originally posted by Franken@Jan 3 2006, 04:16 PM

How is it that a man can get re-sealed to another woman should his first wife die?

They go to the temple, and have it done.

What would happen in the afterlife?  It just seems like polygamy in heaven to me.

You got it.

  And personally if I was the first wife and had passed away I wouldn't want to meet my husband in the afterlife and find out that oh hey he brought someone else with him by the way. 

Guess you'd better hope you're not the first wife.

How does that work out? 

Read your D&C.

Last thing, is the second wife sealed to the first children as well?

Yep. One big happy family!

[Justlooking]

I have no idea and have asked serveral LDSers about this, but wasn't given an answer.

Jesus says in heaven we will be single again like the angels:

Mat 22:28 Therefore in the resurrection whose wife shall she be of the seven? for they all had her. 29 Jesus answered and said unto them, Ye do err, not knowing the scriptures, nor the power of God. 30 For in the resurrection they neither marry, nor are given in marriage, but are as the angels of God in heaven.

The only sealing I have seen in the bible between a man and woman is in Song of Solomon which means there is a committed relationship.

Sgs 8:6 Set me as a seal upon thine heart, as a seal upon thine arm: for love [is] strong as death; jealousy [is] cruel as the grave: the coals thereof [are] coals of fire, [which hath a] most vehement flame.

[Snow]

Originally posted by Franken@Jan 3 2006, 02:16 PM

I'm just really struggling about this aspect of the church and don't feel like I really understand it at all.

How is it that a man can get re-sealed to another woman should his first wife die?  What would happen in the afterlife?  It just seems like polygamy in heaven to me.  And personally if I was the first wife and had passed away I wouldn't want to meet my husband in the afterlife and find out that oh hey he brought someone else with him by the way.  How does that work out?  Last thing, is the second wife sealed to the first children as well? 

--Franken--

←

That's right. The believers believe that there is or could be plural marriage in heaven.

[GRR8]

Your not accountable for things that are not true, or cannot be known for certain. Just hope that whoever is ultimately 'running the show' is kind enough to reveal what his/her intentions are, and that they are benevolent. Plural marriage is assumed to be something actually taught as an 'Eternal principal of God' but I find that there is to date, nothing definitive concerning so called rituals, and ceremonies in regards to Jesus and what he really taught to his diciples in the Middle East. I cannot trust anyones word including that of Joseph Smith Jr in his claims of revelations concerning his first visions and those accounts being changed later in years by he himself. I distrust all organized religious ordinances and rituals simply for the fact that there is no personal knowledge given to me by God himself that this is true.

[Setheus]

Originally posted by Justlooking@Jan 3 2006, 06:59 PM

I have no idea and have asked serveral LDSers about this, but wasn't given an answer.

Jesus says in heaven we will be single again like the angels:

Mat 22:28 Therefore in the resurrection whose wife shall she be of the seven? for they all had her.  29 Jesus answered and said unto them, Ye do err, not knowing the scriptures, nor the power of God.  30 For in the resurrection they neither marry, nor are given in marriage, but are as the angels of God in heaven. 

←

the "lack of knowledge of scripture and power of God" Christ was refering to is the power of sealing ordinances. This is also known as the new and everlasting covenant. What Christ was saying is that if you're married *no matter how many times*, unless you are sealed in the new and ever lasting covenant your marriage is voided at death. That is the reason that when we are sealed our vow is "For all time and Eternity" instead of "Until death do you part, or As long as you both shall live".

[Justlooking]

Originally posted by Setheus+Jan 4 2006, 09:03 AM-->

<!--QuoteBegin-Justlooking@Jan 3 2006, 06:59 PM

I have no idea and have asked serveral LDSers about this, but wasn't given an answer.

Jesus says in heaven we will be single again like the angels:

Mat 22:28 Therefore in the resurrection whose wife shall she be of the seven? for they all had her.  29 Jesus answered and said unto them, Ye do err, not knowing the scriptures, nor the power of God.  30 For in the resurrection they neither marry, nor are given in marriage, but are as the angels of God in heaven. 

←

the "lack of knowledge of scripture and power of God" Christ was refering to is the power of sealing ordinances. This is also known as the new and everlasting covenant. What Christ was saying is that if you're married *no matter how many times*, unless you are sealed in the new and ever lasting covenant your marriage is voided at death. That is the reason that when we are sealed our vow is "For all time and Eternity" instead of "Until death do you part, or As long as you both shall live".

←

What refrence are you quoting this from?

[Prend1]

He is quoting from modern revelation. It can be found in D&C somewhere but i'll have to find it

[Justlooking]

Originally posted by Prend1@Jan 4 2006, 10:59 AM

He is quoting from modern revelation. It can be found in D&C somewhere but i'll have to find it

←

What is D&C?

[Prend1]

Doctrines and covenants...it's a book of revelations given primarily to js

[Franken]

Originally posted by Setheus+Jan 4 2006, 08:03 AM-->

<!--QuoteBegin-Justlooking@Jan 3 2006, 06:59 PM

I have no idea and have asked serveral LDSers about this, but wasn't given an answer.

Jesus says in heaven we will be single again like the angels:

Mat 22:28 Therefore in the resurrection whose wife shall she be of the seven? for they all had her.  29 Jesus answered and said unto them, Ye do err, not knowing the scriptures, nor the power of God.  30 For in the resurrection they neither marry, nor are given in marriage, but are as the angels of God in heaven. 

←

the "lack of knowledge of scripture and power of God" Christ was refering to is the power of sealing ordinances. This is also known as the new and everlasting covenant. What Christ was saying is that if you're married *no matter how many times*, unless you are sealed in the new and ever lasting covenant your marriage is voided at death. That is the reason that when we are sealed our vow is "For all time and Eternity" instead of "Until death do you part, or As long as you both shall live".

←

Even so with that being that, how can God's law be true that a man can be sealed to two wives. I've asked so many people in the church before, but I haven't ever really gotten a clear explanation from anyone of the purpose behind this, or whatever the whole plan of dual sealing could be.

[Snow]

Originally posted by Franken@Jan 4 2006, 06:44 PM

Even so with that being that, how can God's law be true that a man can be sealed to two wives. 

←

Why does it bother you so? Why does the magic number have to be one?

[Josie]

Plural marriage has been practiced from the beginning of time. It was in the old testament. Many times the Old Testament talks about the prophets having more than one wife, and if they did, surely others did also.

A man may be sealed to more than one woman, a woman may not be sealed to more than one man at a time. A second or third wife is not sealed to the children of the first wife. She and her children are sealed to the husband, not to the other wife or children of that husband.

Also remember that that sealing does no good if both people do not live up to the covenants of that sealing. It will be null and void. Also remember, (atleast to my knowledge), the first wife has to accept any other sealings for them to remain in affect.

If a woman is sealed to someone else and wishes to be sealed to another man, her sealing to the first must be cancelled before the second can take place and that has to be done through the first presidency of the church.

Also, remember that only those that live worthy to enter the highest degree of the Celestial Kingdom will remain sealed to anyone.

One reason that women are not sealed to more than one man, is because the man that lives worthily will follow the lineage of his Priesthood, and if the woman is to be with the man, she cannot go with 2 or 3 different men at the same time, because they will go with their Priesthood authority and so she cannot divide herself into pieces to go with each.

The Priesthood always carries the leadership and the authority to act in the name of God and who else's work will we be about in Celestial kingdom, but God's?

[Setheus]

Excellent Josie. Nice explenation of the Priesthood. Bravo.

[shanstress70]

Originally posted by Josie@Jan 4 2006, 10:44 PM

Plural marriage has been practiced from the beginning of time.  It was in the old testament.  Many times the Old Testament talks about the prophets having more than one wife, and if they did, surely others did also.

←

The old testament also includes fathers having sex with his daughters, brothers with sisters, and so on...

Just because something is in the old testament doesn't make it right.

[Jason]

Originally posted by shanstress70+Jan 5 2006, 07:31 AM-->

<!--QuoteBegin-Josie@Jan 4 2006, 10:44 PM

Plural marriage has been practiced from the beginning of time.  It was in the old testament.  Many times the Old Testament talks about the prophets having more than one wife, and if they did, surely others did also.

←

The old testament also includes fathers having sex with his daughters, brothers with sisters, and so on...

Just because something is in the old testament doesn't make it right.

←

Yeah. Incest is ok too. Just look at ole' "righteous" Lot who had sex with his daughters.

[Guest sugarbay]

Dude, chill. B)

[Franken]

Originally posted by Snow+Jan 4 2006, 08:36 PM-->

<!--QuoteBegin-Franken@Jan 4 2006, 06:44 PM

Even so with that being that, how can God's law be true that a man can be sealed to two wives. 

←

Why does it bother you so? Why does the magic number have to be one?

←

I just know someone in that position who is possibly going to be sealed to two women since his first wife died early. And I mean I can see how hard it would be, and that maybe he just wants to be married so he's not lonely anymore, I mean she is coming over from the Ukraine. Anyway, it's my friends father and she's struggling with the whole idea of having two moms and a whole different family and how the church can stand behind something like that so I thought I'd try and find some answers of my own since I have never really known either why it is the way things are. Josie's explanation really cleared up a lot of things though.

[Red]

Originally posted by Franken@Jan 3 2006, 05:16 PM

I'm just really struggling about this aspect of the church and don't feel like I really understand it at all.

How is it that a man can get re-sealed to another woman should his first wife die?  What would happen in the afterlife?  It just seems like polygamy in heaven to me.  And personally if I was the first wife and had passed away I wouldn't want to meet my husband in the afterlife and find out that oh hey he brought someone else with him by the way.  How does that work out?  Last thing, is the second wife sealed to the first children as well? 

--Franken--

←

You may want to chew on this passage. Basically Jesus is teaching that there will be no marriage in heaven at all, which would certainly solve your dilema. Instead, we all be one family...

"On that day some Sadducees (who say there is no resurrection) came to Jesus and questioned Him,

24asking, "Teacher, Moses said, 'IF A MAN DIES HAVING NO CHILDREN, HIS BROTHER AS NEXT OF KIN SHALL MARRY HIS WIFE, AND RAISE UP CHILDREN FOR HIS BROTHER.'

25"Now there were seven brothers with us; and the first married and died, and having no children left his wife to his brother;

26so also the second, and the third, down to the seventh.

27"Last of all, the woman died.

28"In the resurrection, therefore, whose wife of the seven will she be? For they all had married her."

29But Jesus answered and said to them, "You are mistaken, not understanding the Scriptures nor the power of God.

30"For in the resurrection they neither marry nor are given in marriage, but are like angels in heaven." (Mattew 23-30, NASB)

[Justlooking]

Yes, exactly, the question was whose wife she would be since she had been married to seven men over the course of her life. Jesus says we will be like the angels in heaven, in the bible none of the angels are married and they are all discribed as looking like human males.

Incest wasnt good in the old testament either. Lots daughter's childrens were cursed due to this ungodly union. Even tho Lot was a cousin of Abraham, these decendants were excluded from the promises of the children of Israel.

Gen 19:37 And the firstborn bare a son, and called his name Moab: the same [is] the father of the Moabites unto this day. 38 And the younger, she also bare a son, and called his name Benammi: the same [is] the father of the children of Ammon unto this day.

Deu 2:9 And the LORD said unto me, Distress not the Moabites, neither contend with them in battle: for I will not give thee of their land [for] a possession; because I have given Ar unto the children of Lot [for] a possession.

Deu 2:19 And [when] thou comest nigh over against the children of Ammon, distress them not, nor meddle with them: for I will not give thee of the land of the children of Ammon [any] possession; because I have given it unto the children of Lot [for] a possession.

Deu 27:20 Cursed [be] he that lieth with his father's wife; because he uncovereth his father's skirt. And all the people shall say, Amen.

Deu 27:22 Cursed [be] he that lieth with his sister, the daughter of his father, or the daughter of his mother. And all the people shall say, Amen.

Deu 27:23 Cursed [be] he that lieth with his mother in law. And all the people shall say, Amen.

As for poligamy, that also wasn't of God, but of man.

Mat 19:4 And he answered and said unto them, Have ye not read, that he which made [them] at the beginning made them male and female, 5 And said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be one flesh? 6 Wherefore they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder.

Notice that its one flesh, not one hub and spoke system.

[Josie]

Thank you Franken and Sethus.

[Maureen]

Originally posted by Jason@Jan 5 2006, 09:14 AM

Yeah.  Incest is ok too.  Just look at ole' "righteous" Lot who had sex with his daughters.

Originally posted by Justlooking

Incest wasnt good in the old testament either. Lots daughter's childrens were cursed due to this ungodly union. Even tho Lot was a cousin of Abraham, these decendants were excluded from the promises of the children of Israel.

The Moabites couldn't have been cursed too badly since Jesus is a descendant. Ruth a Moabite married Boaz (a Bethlehemite). The had a son Obed, you had a son Jesse, you was the father of King David - which is the family line of Jesus.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Book_of_Ruth

M.

[jiggypoo]

"Mat 19:4 And he answered and said unto them, Have ye not read, that he which made [them] at the beginning made them male and female, 5 And said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be one flesh? 6 Wherefore they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder."

This is terribly mis-quoted in my opinion. It simply states the relationship that should exists between husband and wife. It doesnt imply restriction of number - as this union should be unique between the two individuals and NOT shared (such as a threesome) among the rest.

As for the feelings this person is having about a new mom, family ,etc - I totally relate. My mother passed away from cancer shortly before my 11th birthday. Dad remarried 11 months later (too soon I think). That transition is bitter, difficult and greatly confusing. Life is never the same. She may feel "outside herself" for something - "outside herself" being that there is no more sense of home, security or direction. It is hell to go through that when you're young. I'll pray for her.

[Jason]

Originally posted by jiggypoo@Jan 6 2006, 01:23 PM

"Mat 19:4 And he answered and said unto them, Have ye not read, that he which made [them] at the beginning made them male and female, 5 And said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be one flesh? 6 Wherefore they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder."

This is terribly mis-quoted in my opinion.  It simply states the relationship that should exists between husband and wife.  It doesnt imply restriction of number - as this union should be unique between the two individuals and NOT shared (such as a threesome) among the rest.

If you can twist that to fit your view, it can just as well be twisted in favor of a "threesome".

[Justlooking]

Originally posted by Maureen+Jan 6 2006, 12:31 PM-->

<!--QuoteBegin-Jason@Jan 5 2006, 09:14 AM

Yeah.  Incest is ok too.  Just look at ole' "righteous" Lot who had sex with his daughters.

Originally posted by Justlooking

Incest wasnt good in the old testament either. Lots daughter's childrens were cursed due to this ungodly union. Even tho Lot was a cousin of Abraham, these decendants were excluded from the promises of the children of Israel.

The Moabites couldn't have been cursed too badly since Jesus is a descendant. Ruth a Moabite married Boaz (a Bethlehemite). The had a son Obed, you had a son Jesse, you was the father of King David - which is the family line of Jesus.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Book_of_Ruth

M.

←

Ruth converted to the God of the Israelites YHVH.

Rth 1:16 And Ruth said, Intreat me not to leave thee, [or] to return from following after thee: for whither thou goest, I will go; and where thou lodgest, I will lodge: thy people [shall be] my people, and thy God my God: 17 Where thou diest, will I die, and there will I be buried: the LORD do so to me, and more also, [if ought] but death part thee and me.

The god of the Moabites was Chemosh.

1Ki 11:7 Then did Solomon build an high place for Chemosh, the abomination of Moab, in the hill that [is] before Jerusalem, and for Molech, the abomination of the children of Ammon.