2 Nephi 24:13-14

[pam]

Reference Search: 2 Nephi 24:13-14

13 For thou hast said in thy heart: I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God; I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north;

14 I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the Most High.

Quote for Discussion

Fall of Lucifer

Lucifer’s statement (14:13-14) about his goals demonstrates his extreme self-centeredness. He begins all five lines with the personal pronoun I, which shows that he is interested in his own goals and in glorifying himself. Lucifer had a fivefold plan: He wanted to enter heaven (without following God’s laws), to be greater than other souls, to become part of the assembly of gods, to be exalted above other authorities and powers, and to become like God himself (14:13-14). In contrast, God’s Saints are taught to lose themselves in the service of others (Matt. 16:25; Luke 9:24) not by looking after self but by seeking out the widows, the poor, the fatherless, and those with spiritual and temporal needs.

Isaiah’s treatment of the archdevil and enemy of all humanity, Lucifer, sets forth terms and phrases that on one hand demonstrate Lucifer’s attempt to imitate God’s exalted state, and on the other present Lucifer’s true degradation. Note the language connected with Lucifer’s attempts at exaltation: ascend, heaven, exalt, above, stars, mount, and north (14:13); and ascend, above, heights, clouds, and Most High (14:14). Contrast that with the language that deals with Lucifer’s actual lowliness: fallen, cut down, to the ground (14:12); brought down to hell, pit (14:15); and cast out of thy grave, go down, pit, and trodden under (14:19).

Donald W. Parry, Jay A. Parry, and Tina M. Peterson, Understanding Isaiah, p.146

[thablue718]

Studying 2 Nephi 24:13-14 I have been studying and found that North Means in the Hindu Upanisads as Eternal, so in the sides of the Eternal it could be said , Or Celestial Kingdom. The next verse Says " Clouds " for me , remember the cloud of witness in Hebrew and so I , See he wants to set his throne over " The Great Witnesses " Christ and the Holy Spirit . Remember Christ has not done or said anything that he has not seen our Heavenly Father do , and the Holy Spirit is the Witness for us.

[Hemidakota]

Actually, nothing against Don’s statement, but Lucifer wanted to use the same plan that was developed for intelligences that fall under the group that is termed; to be 'acted upon'. This however, is nothing new to the FATHER, or those who knew by this alteration would throw away the eternal agency of the children of GOD. This is and was the same plan presented not only to this world, group of children by the FATHER; not just this world but all worlds, which fell under HIS creation. Lucifer wanted to ‘modify’ the original plan and to nullify our choosing for ourselves, from a state ‘to act’ for itself, back to a group that resembles the lesser intelligences [namely animals, insects, fishes, birds, plant life, and so forth]. Yet simple, but, easier to make it back into the presence of GOD without the worry of making choices for oneself. Hard to believe but among those who are considered telestial spirits, found it an easier way of life. As it may be hard to swallow for now, there was more than a third host that accepted his plan.

When you study the differences that Lehi gave between two groups of intelligence, those to be 'acted upon' and those to 'act', the first group had a limited choice of agency, the latter has full agency to choose for themselves. Amazingly, many naïve spirit children accepted the first.

“Lucifer, son of the morning." - Lucifer in Hebrew means morning star or son of dawn. It may have some implication to the timing of his birth as a spirit child in the premortal life or reference to his once-held position of prominence before his fateful fall. (See Elder Marion G. Romney, CR, April

1971, p. 23; DCE, 332)

"In the sides of the north." Among the Babylonians and others of that era, there was the belief that the residence of GOD was in the north. (See Psalm 48:2, Isaiah 14:13) Lucifer wished to ascend to this godly residence.

[HoosierGuy]

Lucifer’s statement (14:13-14) about his goals demonstrates his extreme self-centeredness.

Makes me think about my self-centeredness too.

ascend, heaven, exalt, above, stars, mount, and north (14:13); and ascend, above, heights, clouds, and Most High

Yes, I want those, including "above."

Contrast that with the language that deals with Lucifer’s actual lowliness: fallen, cut down, to the ground (14:12); brought down to hell, pit (14:15); and cast out of thy grave, go down, pit, and trodden under

And how I feel because of my wants.

[neudawn]

I have always found it interesting that Lucifer wanted to destroy the agency of men, yet at the same time, he "Chose" not to follow Heavenly Father's plan.

[pam]

Interesting comment neudawn. Never quite thought of it in that way before. Thanks for that insight.