human rights for ambiguous gender

[ruthiechan]

Backroads, I approve of the parents' decision. It allows the child to be involved in the choice in the future. With something that is so personal that has such profound consequences on that child I feel that intersex children have the right to choose for themselves.

And that goes back to the question, what is a right? Do parents have a right to choose a gender for their intersex child?

[Hala401]

Backroads, I approve of the parents' decision. It allows the child to be involved in the choice in the future. With something that is so personal that has such profound consequences on that child I feel that intersex children have the right to choose for themselves.

And that goes back to the question, what is a right? Do parents have a right to choose a gender for their intersex child?

I agree with you. As bitter and angry as I have been at my parents, I have now come round to the idea that the Doctor did the best he could with what he knew at the time, and my parents functioned on the same sort of ignorance. It is heartening that non XX or XY children are increasingly treated with compassion and care.

I once thought it was cruelty to not have come into the world just like other children, but now I wonder if the experience allows for extra learning for us all.

[iinarihoudai]

I don't understand why, but you keep avoiding my questions. Let me try again:

• What, specifically, is wrong with my definition?
• What is the definition you propose to replace it with?

There is nothing "wrong" with the definition. The only issue is that there is ambiguity about what constitutes a right. Do homosexuals have the right to marry? Some say they do, others say they don't. As already asked, do parents have the right to pick a gender for an intersex child? Some would say yes, most here seem to say no. Do blacks have the right to walk down the street unmolested? So some say yes, but, with recent news about Trayvon Martin some still say no (theoretically the law should be on Trayvon's side, but no, it's Emmitt Till all over again).

Do you see what I mean about the ambiguity? If you still don't see what I am saying then I have no idea what else I can say to get you to understand my point of view.

[Vort]

There is nothing "wrong" with the definition.

Perhaps I misunderstood you when you wrote:

Vort, your argument doesn't work because you have a different definition basic rights than others do

The only issue is that there is ambiguity about what constitutes a right.

Not according to the Declaration of Independence, a document you claim to agree with.

Do homosexuals have the right to marry? Some say they do, others say they don't.

I have heard no one say that homosexuals do not have the right to marry. Everyone I have ever heard speak on the topic agrees that they do, assuming they can find someone willing to marry them. Male homosexuals can marry unmarried adult females to whom they are not related. Female homosexuals can marry unmarried adult males to whom they are not related. That is, homosexuals have exactly the same rights to marry as anyone else.

As already asked, do parents have the right to pick a gender for an intersex child? Some would say yes, most here seem to say no.

Not sure this is a question of rights.

Do blacks have the right to walk down the street unmolested? So some say yes, but, with recent news about Trayvon Martin some still say no (theoretically the law should be on Trayvon's side, but no, it's Emmitt Till all over again).

Have you actually followed what's going on in that case?

Are you claiming that people are saying blacks lack the right to walk down the street unmolested?

Do you see what I mean about the ambiguity? If you still don't see what I am saying then I have no idea what else I can say to get you to understand my point of view.

I see that your view of news events is deeply skewed. I see nothing that indicates that rights are fluid.

[Hala401]

There is nothing "wrong" with the definition. The only issue is that there is ambiguity about what constitutes a right. Do homosexuals have the right to marry? Some say they do, others say they don't. As already asked, do parents have the right to pick a gender for an intersex child? Some would say yes, most here seem to say no. Do blacks have the right to walk down the street unmolested? So some say yes, but, with recent news about Trayvon Martin some still say no (theoretically the law should be on Trayvon's side, but no, it's Emmitt Till all over again).

Do you see what I mean about the ambiguity? If you still don't see what I am saying then I have no idea what else I can say to get you to understand my point of view.

As far as Travon Martin is concerned, there is STILL an element of hateful bigots in this country. I do not know how many they number, but they are vocal as long as they have the anonymity of the internet. I'd rather hope that their numbers are small, but I fear not. No one has openly said anything racist to me, and if it ever happens, I hope that I have the courage to confront them.

I've heard a lot of different racial slurs; chink, whap, rag head, terrorist, sand nigger, and the list just goes on and on. I'll never forget the day that I was volunteering at a local Veterans Administration Hospital( when I was still Muslim) when someone told me I was a terrorist. It was quite shocked, but it did give me some insight about racial hatred.

[NadiaStar]

This is exactly why I have trouble dismissing all transgendered individuals as crazy. Yes, the spirit is either male or female, but human bodies are notoriously imperfect. As a parent, I would probably want my child to grow up with some sexual identity, but... what if I got it wrong?

[annewandering]

This is exactly why I have trouble dismissing all transgendered individuals as crazy. Yes, the spirit is either male or female, but human bodies are notoriously imperfect. As a parent, I would probably want my child to grow up with some sexual identity, but... what if I got it wrong?

I would guess in most cases the child will grow up with a sexual identity from their inside feelings although hormones could interfere.

The possibility of the human body being messed up always bothers me in trying to form an opinion on gender issues. We CANNOT know, except by revelation, the true answer in ambiguous cases. It behooves us to withhold judgment.

[bcguy]

Initially, I did not know this employee was now a HE rather then a she. She never told me and once I was in my work office with co-worker, I said "When is SHE coming back here to pick up this equipment? Coworker gave a distorted expression and said "shhhhh quiet, she is not a she, but a he!" I said what?? yea, she had a sex change to be a male and is adapting to it.

This was a very prominent electronics R&D and MFG firm in the US. I personally never knew but it was my first encounter with some one like this. Never less, I excepted it as the person was very bright and nice.

From what I have read online, some people are not born with brains that are properly wired right and a male may be gay and female lesbian. This has been proven in cat scans where the scan confirmed the male brain to wired like that of a woman, and a woman's brain wired like that of a male.

[Hala401]

I would guess in most cases the child will grow up with a sexual identity from their inside feelings although hormones could interfere.

The possibility of the human body being messed up always bothers me in trying to form an opinion on gender issues. We CANNOT know, except by revelation, the true answer in ambiguous cases. It behooves us to withhold judgment.

An that is one of the main reasons that the Missionary Sisters won my heart. The Holy Spirit used them to show me just how mindful, thoughtful, and sweet Mormons can be in areas that the evangelicals and others break into foaming at the mouth over.

In the short time I have been with the church, I feel that so much psychotherapy and counseling would simply be unneeded if those suffering simply had people around them who loved them and tried to understand.

Sometimes, I wonder if life long LDS members really understand how unique our church is and how much Heavenly Father loves us.

[annewandering]

I was baptised at 12 but always considered myself LDS. I know how much our Heavenly Father loves us. He even loves me so thatt says a lot! We are so blessed. Even those outside the church.

[Hala401]

When I first started with the Missionary Sisters, they would say things like Heavenly Father, and it felt like my soul was jarred. I could not understand how anyone could put "Heavenly" and "Father" together in the same sentence. The word Father always carried great menace for me.

I did not look for it, the healing came to me unbidden, but especially since my Baptisim Heavenly Father has healed my soul in ways that I thought not possible. It was like I was a wild animal and God just tamed me. And it feels good, and secure to be able to relax in Heavenly Father's love.

I hope that what I write does not get too soppy for you all. It just feels so wonderful to be able to express my love for Heavenly Father.