LeSellers Posted August 20, 2016 Report Share Posted August 20, 2016 37 minutes ago, james12 said: There are two statements of Joseph regarding the Holy Ghost which deserve serious consideration. Quote The Holy Ghost is yet a spiritual body and is waiting to take to himself a body, as the Savior did. [Joseph Smith, Encyclopedia of Joseph Smith’s Teachings, edited by Larry E. Dahl and Donald Q. Cannon (Salt Lake City: Bookcraft, 1997)] Quote The Holy Ghost is now in a state of probation which if he should perform in righteousness he may pass through the same or a similar course of things that the Son has. (Joseph Smith, The Words of Joseph Smith, p. 245; Sabbath address, Nauvoo, 27 August 1843. Reported by Franklin D. Richards.) And, without further light and knowledge, how could we possibly comment on these? And, with that light and knowledge, who would want to divulge* the sacred whisperings of the Spirit? * divulge, from the Latin, to make common or vulgar. Lehi Blackmarch 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
james12 Posted August 20, 2016 Report Share Posted August 20, 2016 3 minutes ago, LeSellers said: And, without further light and knowledge, how could we possibly comment on these? And, with that light and knowledge, who would want to divulge* the sacred whisperings of the Spirit? * divulge, from the Latin, to make common or vulgar. Lehi Care must be taken, as I have done. But as Paul said, "faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God" (Romans 10:17). How can one believe the truth unless he hears it? How can one hear the truth unless someone speaks it? Now then, you can of course comment on Joseph's quotes. You do not need to know them in full to provide a comment. Nor are you ignorant on how to gain further light and knowledge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeSellers Posted August 20, 2016 Report Share Posted August 20, 2016 3 minutes ago, james12 said: you can of course comment on Joseph's quotes. You do not need to know them in full to provide a comment. Nor are you ignorant on how to gain further light and knowledge. What you say above is true. But I cannot divulge what I may or may not know on the matter: it would be vulgar. Lehi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
james12 Posted August 20, 2016 Report Share Posted August 20, 2016 7 minutes ago, LeSellers said: What you say above is true. But I cannot divulge what I may or may not know on the matter: it would be vulgar. Lehi Yes, in the end the truth of this matter will be left to personal revelation. But I like Joseph want to see truth in all it's bearings and hug it to my bosom when things of great import are passed over without serious thought. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeSellers Posted August 20, 2016 Report Share Posted August 20, 2016 10 minutes ago, james12 said: Yes, in the end the truth of this matter will be left to personal revelation. But I like Joseph want to see truth in all it's bearings and hug it to my bosom when things of great import are passed over without serious thought. There's no problem with that. It's discussing, especially in a public forum like this, where the problems arise. Heber C. Kimball once said that he didn't share his insights/revelations even with his wife because, when he did, the Lord stopped showing him new stuff. Lehi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
james12 Posted August 20, 2016 Report Share Posted August 20, 2016 6 minutes ago, LeSellers said: There's no problem with that. It's discussing, especially in a public forum like this, where the problems arise. Heber C. Kimball once said that he didn't share his insights/revelations even with his wife because, when he did, the Lord stopped showing him new stuff. Lehi Sometimes silence is worse than speaking the truth. For instance, it was clear from your previous posts that you did not understand the nature of the Holy Ghost. This led to statements from you and others alluding to the fact that we worship the Holy Ghost. This is not true and can lead a person to serious error. At other times I have seen where we attempt to hide part of our doctrine in an attempt to appear more main stream Christian. This causes people to say we whitewash our teachings. Sometimes the spirit stops my utterance but I for one want to shout truths from the house tops that all may hear. Let them rail and complain it matters not, the truth will go forward boldly, nobly, and independently till all shall know it from the least to the greatest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeSellers Posted August 20, 2016 Report Share Posted August 20, 2016 6 minutes ago, james12 said: it was clear from your previous posts that you did not understand the nature of the Holy Ghost. And I submit that you don't know what I know, and that you are not in a position to judge, and that your assumptions are erroneous. Lehi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeSellers Posted August 20, 2016 Report Share Posted August 20, 2016 8 minutes ago, james12 said: At other times I have seen where we attempt to hide part of our doctrine in an attempt to appear more main stream Christian. You can't possibly be lumping me in to such a class. Of all the Christians someone could mistake me being, "main stream" ain't on the list. Lehi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
james12 Posted August 20, 2016 Report Share Posted August 20, 2016 50 minutes ago, LeSellers said: And I submit that you don't know what I know, and that you are not in a position to judge, and that your assumptions are erroneous. Lehi I do not know all you know, but I do know what you stated: Quote Nonetheless, we do worship Him because, as @Carborendum said in the other topic, we worship Those we deify, those who have Priesthood and Godly responsibility over us. This statement has some errors, and if you believe what you wrote then there is some misunderstanding regarding the Holy Ghost. Now, I know you have wonderful insight into the scriptures and LDS doctrines. I am not judging you personally, simply correcting this sentence. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeSellers Posted August 20, 2016 Report Share Posted August 20, 2016 5 minutes ago, james12 said: This statement has some errors, and if you believe what you wrote then there is some misunderstanding regarding the Holy Ghost. And we wonder who appointed you to define doctrine. Lehi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
james12 Posted August 20, 2016 Report Share Posted August 20, 2016 3 minutes ago, LeSellers said: And we wonder who appointed you to define doctrine. Lehi Sigh... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 21, 2016 Report Share Posted August 21, 2016 10 hours ago, james12 said: I spend very little time on this site commenting on the trivial. There are two statements of Joseph regarding the Holy Ghost which deserve serious consideration. You should now see at least a part of where I am coming from. You may judge for yourself the importance. Fair enough. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 22, 2016 Report Share Posted August 22, 2016 What's sad is i know someone who worships Joseph Smith. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Traveler Posted August 22, 2016 Report Share Posted August 22, 2016 2 hours ago, Zarahemla said: What's sad is i know someone who worships Joseph Smith. How do they worship Joseph Smith? Do they pay their tithing in the name of Joseph Smith? Do they baptize in the name of Joseph Smith? Do they pray in the name of Joseph Smith? Have they taken upon them the name of Joseph Smith? How do you “know”? The Traveler Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 22, 2016 Report Share Posted August 22, 2016 3 minutes ago, Traveler said: How do they worship Joseph Smith? Do they pay their tithing in the name of Joseph Smith? Do they baptize in the name of Joseph Smith? Do they pray in the name of Joseph Smith? Have they taken upon them the name of Joseph Smith? How do you “know”? The Traveler They believe Joseph Smith is the Holy Ghost and are obsessed with him and think Doctrine and Covenants is the most important book of scripture in canon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 22, 2016 Report Share Posted August 22, 2016 13 minutes ago, Zarahemla said: They believe Joseph Smith is the Holy Ghost and are obsessed with him and think Doctrine and Covenants is the most important book of scripture in canon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Traveler Posted August 22, 2016 Report Share Posted August 22, 2016 19 minutes ago, Zarahemla said: They believe Joseph Smith is the Holy Ghost and are obsessed with him and think Doctrine and Covenants is the most important book of scripture in canon. It is interesting that you did not say that the Holy Ghost has given you a witness. Moroni chapter 10 testifies that the Holy Ghost bears witness to all truth. I would agree that your friend is a little cuckoo – maybe even a little intellectually unstable but to be honest I find a lot of deeply religious people in that same boat. But, you know what? I can love weirdness without a lot of effort. It is the smart ones like me that know so much and do so little in comparison that worry me to sadness. The Traveler Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 22, 2016 Report Share Posted August 22, 2016 9 hours ago, Zarahemla said: They believe Joseph Smith is the Holy Ghost and are obsessed with him and think Doctrine and Covenants is the most important book of scripture in canon. You're sad about someone being obsessed with a piece of doctrine that is probably not true. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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