Why are you not married?

[Sunday21]

Why are you not married?

i just have to ask this as I cannot ask this in real life, 'Why are you not married?'

You have 3 children. You live together. You have liived together for a decade. What are you waiting for? What needs to happen? Are you waiting for a better offer? Do you think not being married gives you more....what? Freedom? A chance to escape? You have 3 children!

Why are you not married?

sigh. I visit teach people in this situation. I used to ocassionally introduce the subject which resulted in a conversation about who pays for what, the truck is mine, the house belongs to me (in my country if you are cohabiting, the house belongs to both of you and you can't kick the other person out).

So why are you not married? You don't trust this person with whom you have 3 children? 

I went along on a missionary discussion to a couple who had 1 child and another on the way. The missionaries and I tried to persuade them to get married. Why not? They wanted to save for a wedding. We countered: The licence is $50 and the Relief Society will cater. But they worried about getting their relatives to the wedding and how about flowers and a dress?  We suggested that they renew their vows at some point. No sale.

So why are you not married? Once you have a kid, the argument is over. Get married!

[Guest]

Several couples I knew lived together simply because the threat of divorce was too much for them to handle.  They liked the fact that they have the "option" of just leaving any time.  This really didn't make much sense when you analyze it.

1. They are afraid of all the damage of divorce (separating their lives, family, and assets).  So, they avoid marriage.
2. They want it to be easier to separate their lives, family, and assets.  So, they avoid marriage.

One of these couples gave into pressure and got married.  Then they got divorced over some little thing and went on with their lives. They still had to deal with dual custody of their one child.

Another couple I knew were doing it as a protest.  They were atheists and saw marriage as a religious legacy.  (YEY! They get it.)  So, they saw no reason why they couldn't just live together.  If I were an atheist, I wouldn't see any reason to either.  Finally, the man's mother expressed with great love how much she loved the woman in her son's life.  But she told him,"I'd really like to introduce her as something more than 'my son's girlfriend'."  The man then realized that "marriage was more than just two people."  They decided to get married.  And they're still very happy.

I would have just said,"Mom, you can call her whatever you want to call her."

[anatess2]

3 hours ago, Sunday21 said:

Why are you not married?

i just have to ask this as I cannot ask this in real life, 'Why are you not married?'

You have 3 children. You live together. You have liived together for a decade. What are you waiting for? What needs to happen? Are you waiting for a better offer? Do you think not being married gives you more....what? Freedom? A chance to escape? You have 3 children!

Why are you not married?

sigh. I visit teach people in this situation. I used to ocassionally introduce the subject which resulted in a conversation about who pays for what, the truck is mine, the house belongs to me (in my country if you are cohabiting, the house belongs to both of you and you can't kick the other person out).

So why are you not married? You don't trust this person with whom you have 3 children? 

I went along on a missionary discussion to a couple who had 1 child and another on the way. The missionaries and I tried to persuade them to get married. Why not? They wanted to save for a wedding. We countered: The licence is $50 and the Relief Society will cater. But they worried about getting their relatives to the wedding and how about flowers and a dress?  We suggested that they renew their vows at some point. No sale.

So why are you not married? Once you have a kid, the argument is over. Get married!

Because, the only difference between being married and not being married to someone who does not have a testimony of eternal marriages in your country is the piece of paper.

So, the question you should ask is... Why should they marry?  Once you can help them have a testimony of THAT answer, then there's no need to buy a dress or flowers or invite family over.  They'll want to get married right now, right this very minute, even if they have to bum $50 from the next-door neighbor.

Edited April 18, 2017 by anatess2

[person0]

5 minutes ago, anatess2 said:

So, the question you should ask is... Why should they marry?  Once you can help them have a testimony of THAT answer, then there's no need to buy a dress or flowers or invite family over.  They'll want to get married right now, right this very minute, even if they have to bum $50 from the next-door neighbor.

Once on my mission we were teaching investigators about eternal marriage and encouraging them to get married.  They had lived together for a few years and had a baby.  Marriage was their main obstacle to baptism and so we counseled with them about eternal marriage.  As it turned out, the husband completely believed in eternal marriage, his hangup that came out right in front of his wife was that he wasn't sure he wanted to be with her for all eternity!!!!!   As soon as he told us that, with his wife right next to him, we were like  . . . come again? 

[anatess2]

21 minutes ago, person0 said:

Once on my mission we were teaching investigators about eternal marriage and encouraging them to get married.  They had lived together for a few years and had a baby.  Marriage was their main obstacle to baptism and so we counseled with them about eternal marriage.  As it turned out, the husband completely believed in eternal marriage, his hangup that came out right in front of his wife was that he wasn't sure he wanted to be with her for all eternity!!!!!   As soon as he told us that, with his wife right next to him, we were like  . . . come again? 

whoops?

[Mike]

56 minutes ago, person0 said:

Once on my mission we were teaching investigators about eternal marriage and encouraging them to get married.  They had lived together for a few years and had a baby.  Marriage was their main obstacle to baptism and so we counseled with them about eternal marriage.  As it turned out, the husband completely believed in eternal marriage, his hangup that came out right in front of his wife was that he wasn't sure he wanted to be with her for all eternity!!!!!   As soon as he told us that, with his wife right next to him, we were like  . . . come again? 

When I was seven years old my grandfather died. I recall through the years hearing my grandmother repeatedly insist that she didn't want to have to be with him throughout eternity. 

[wenglund]

1 hour ago, anatess2 said:

Because, the only difference between being married and not being married to someone who does not have a testimony of eternal marriages in your country is the piece of paper.

Yup. Marriage and traditional families are one of the intended primary casualties of the modern culture wars.  THe objective is to marry people to the state rather than to each other. This was, in part, the unwitting irony of the same-sex marriage debate. On the surface it was made to appear that marriage was of great importance, when ultimately SSM intentionally diminished/diluted the value of marriage and expanded government control and peoples dependency on the state. (see HERE and HERE)

Conversion to the gospel is the anecdote.

Thanks, -Wade Englund-, 

[Mike]

1 hour ago, anatess2 said:

Because, the only difference between being married and not being married to someone who does not have a testimony of eternal marriages in your country is the piece of paper.

That actually sounds to me like it could be interpreted as a good thing. I'm thinking in terms of neither the piece of paper, nor the way anybody else looks at my relationship with my sweetheart as making any difference to the quality of our relationship. Our relationship is all about commitment to one another.  But I probably misunderstand you. So, what's the difference between being married and not being married in your country?

[wenglund]

28 minutes ago, wenglund said:

Yup. Marriage and traditional families are one of the intended primary casualties of the modern culture wars.  

I should add that perhaps the key weapon in the cultural war against marriage and family has been the feminist movement, particularly 2nd and 3rd wave feminism.

The misguided attempt to equalize males and females, rather than celebrating the diversity, has caused many women to adopt some of the worst characteristics of men. The inherent domestication and fidelity of women was sloughed off in favor of "liberation" and "free love" and and the single-minded or selfish pursuit of so-called "real jobs."  The consequences have become obvious (lower marital rate, increased birth control and single parent child births), but most particularly in thegeneral decline in happiness among women.

But, then, I am not one to speak since I am old and never married. [Shame]

Thanks, -Wade Englund- 

[anatess2]

31 minutes ago, Mike said:

That actually sounds to me like it could be interpreted as a good thing. I'm thinking in terms of neither the piece of paper, nor the way anybody else looks at my relationship with my sweetheart as making any difference to the quality of our relationship. Our relationship is all about commitment to one another.  But I probably misunderstand you. So, what's the difference between being married and not being married in your country?

Which country?

In the Philippines - big big big difference.  Divorce is illegal in the Philippines.

In the US - also big difference.  That piece of paper carries some benefits to it - from taxation to medical privacy to estate ownership, etc.

In the UK - not much difference. 

Edited April 18, 2017 by anatess2

[Mike]

11 minutes ago, anatess2 said:

Which country?

In the Philippines - big big big difference.  Divorce is illegal in the Philippines.

In the US - also big difference.  That piece of paper carries some benefits to it - from taxation to medical privacy to estate ownership, etc.

In the UK - not much difference. 

I see. Personally, I don't find the fact that divorce is illegal (in some countries) as very compelling to make me want to get married. In fact, taken by itself that fact wouldn't make any difference to my intentions. Tax benefits (again, just talking about myself) don't help make any difference, either. 

[anatess2]

5 minutes ago, Mike said:

I see. Personally, I don't find the fact that divorce is illegal (in some countries) as very compelling to make me want to get married. In fact, taken by itself that fact wouldn't make any difference to my intentions. Tax benefits (again, just talking about myself) don't help make any difference, either. 

It would if you want to make sure that person (and his family) is legally and culturally bound to provide for you and your children especially if you get incapacitated for the rest of his mortal life.

Edited April 18, 2017 by anatess2

[Mike]

5 minutes ago, anatess2 said:

It would if you want to make sure that person (and his family) is legally and culturally bound to provide for you and your children especially if you get incapacitated for the rest of his mortal life.

Yes, I see that if making sure my potential spouse were legally and culturally bound was important to me then it would be a reason to marry.