Sunday21 Posted May 7, 2017 Report Posted May 7, 2017 And it came to pass that I did frankly forgive them all that they had done, A great line of scripture! A good example to follow. Quote
zil Posted May 8, 2017 Report Posted May 8, 2017 In the middle of the verses, Nephi is somewhat baffled at how dense Laman & Lemuel are, and it occurs to me that L&L's entire problem is being divided in their own hearts and minds. They clearly value wealth, ease, their buds back home, and things of this nature; and don't value the scriptures, truth, the things of God. This is why they want to go back, why they rail against anyone who calls them to account, forget about angels, don't ask of God, etc. But at the same time, they are just scared enough that Lehi might be right about what's going to happen back home, that they don't dare go back on their own. Even when their "girlfriends" (2 of the daughters of Ishmael) and the sons of Ishmael back them up a bit, they're still too scared to go it on their own. How terrible it would be to want something with all your heart, and yet fear going after said thing. No wonder they were miserable and angry all the time. There's an inverse lesson there for us - if we want the things of God, we shouldn't fear working for them; if we want other things, but fear the truth of God, we would be wise to learn to let go of our earthly wants, thereby eliminating the fear and enjoying peace. Sunday21 and person0 2 Quote
person0 Posted May 8, 2017 Report Posted May 8, 2017 (edited) Quote 1 . . . his sons should take daughters to wife. . . 3 And it came to pass that I, Nephi, did again, with my brethren, go forth into the wilderness to go up to Jerusalem.| 4 . . . and we did gain favor in the sight of Ishmael, insomuch that we did speak unto him the words of the Lord. Notice that Laman and Lemuel are not mentioned to have complained about going back to Jerusalem for the purpose of obtaining wives. They complained about leaving, they complained about going back for the plates, they complained on the way back with their wives to be, but they sure as heck werent about to complain about going back to get them in the first place. In fact, the way the record is written, Nephi indicates 'we', as in all 4 of the brothers, spoke the words of the Lord to convince Ishmael to come. I have to wonder, and personally would assume that Laman and Lemuel's intentions were less than noble. They probably saw the opportunity to have a wife as a positive thing for a number of reasons, due to their culture. However, given their overall nature, I would say that the natural lusts of the flesh were enticing enough to them to convince them to go and even teach the words of the Lord to Ishmael and his family. It kind of reminds me about how many more people will show up to a church activity, conference, temple session, etc, if you entice them with 'free' food. However, once Laman and Lemuel had achieved their goal, had their 'girlfriends' as @zil wisely pointed out, what was stopping them from staying in Jerusalem and letting everyone else go back? Hence the main events of the chapter took place. Quote 8 And now I, Nephi, being grieved for the hardness of their hearts, therefore I spake unto them, saying. . . 9 How is it that ye have not hearkened unto the word of the Lord? Nephi was grieved. He was grieved because he was 'sick and tired' of his complaining brothers. "I mean, seriously, whats it going to take? When will these guys get it?" were likely the types of questions going through his mind at that moment. How many times do we ask ourselves that question about our children, or siblings, or friends, or co-workers? I would assume, enough for us to adequately empathize with Nephi. More importantly though, is how many times Heavenly Father must face a similar experience with us. What will it take, when will each of us finally reach that moment where we decide to strive for exact obedience? How many times does He have to tell us to have faith in His son, Jesus Christ, before we will realize what that really means for us. How many times does he have to remind us to repent, or to do x/y/z thing and then reap the reward? Nephi continued to strive to help his brothers, despite their clear wickedness and rebellion, because he loved them. Just as Christs hand is stretched out still, all the day long, to those who will take hold, even after turning away time and time again. Quote 15 Now behold, I say unto you that if ye will return unto Jerusalem ye shall also perish with them. And now, if ye have choice, go up to the land, and remember the words which I speak unto you, that if ye go ye will also perish; for thus the Spirit of the Lord constraineth me that I should speak. In other words: "I dare you! I dare you to go back to Jerusalem! Do it and see what happens. You have agency. If you want to go back, be my guest, but. . . if you go, you will die. I'm just telling it like it is; this is what the Spirit told me to tell you." Quote 18 And it came to pass that when I had said these words, behold, the bands were loosed from off my hands and feet and I stood before my brethren, and I spake unto them again. I truly hope that I live sufficiently in tune with the Holy Spirit to recognize when the Lord deems it appropriate to call upon him to loosen my bands. This applies equally to literal bands as well as with our trials. I sincerely believe that if we are righteous, after we have done our part and are on the brink of the bitter end, assuming it be the Lords will, we can call upon Him to 'loosen our bands' and provide an escape alongside the trial, sometimes even a miraculous escape, just as he loosed the literal bands restraining Nephi. Nephi, got right back up on his feet and started teaching them the truth they didn't want to hear once more. Such resilience is awe inspiring and faith inducing. Interestingly it reminds me of a popular lyrical refrain 'I get knocked down, but I get up again, you're never gonna keep me down!' Quote 21 And it came to pass that I did frankly forgive them all that they had done . . . Wow! How many times will Nephi do this over the course of his journey? What is equally interesting is how sincere Laman and Lemuel actually were in their repentance. As Zil pointed out, these guys really desired all of the things that led them to act out as they did, but they also had at least enough of the light of Christ that they were willing to sincerely repent (at least for a time) when they recognized the seriousness of their atrocities. But alas, how fleeting those feelings from the Spirit can be. No wonder we are extorted to write down our spiritual impressions and to refer back to them again and again. In our day we have even more evil pulling us in all directions except the straight and narrow, when you think about it, Laman and Lemuel just wanted to go be lazy at home in peace and not have to work hard to do the right thing. That's about 50% of the USA these days, and then we have many, many other temptations on top of that! Quote 22 . . . they did give thanks unto the Lord their God; and they did offer sacrifice and burnt offerings unto him. We must always give thanks to God when we see His hand in our lives, both spiritually and temporally. Failure to express gratitude is akin to actually being ungrateful. When you really think about it what do we have in this life that we actually deserve? Nothing, that is the answer, nothing. All belongs to the Lord; He giveth and He taketh away. Even if we are seemingly left with nothing, we have our salvation in and through Him, and that is more than we could ever gain for ourselves. If all is the Lord's, we ought to be grateful for whatever he sees fit to bestow unto us. Edited May 8, 2017 by person0 zil and Sunday21 2 Quote
pam Posted June 5, 2017 Author Report Posted June 5, 2017 One of the interesting things that I learned was this. When Ishmael's family joined Lehi's family in the wilderness, it fulfilled a prophecy that Jacob made in Genesis regarding the joining of the tribe of Manesseh and the tribe of Ephraim. Lehi was from the tribe of Manesseh and Ishmael was from the tribe of Ephraim. You can read this in Genesis 48:16. If I had learned this in the past, I have totally forgotten it. So it's kind of amazing how we can see a prophecy made in the Old Testament come true in the Book of Mormon. Quote
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