Guest User-Removed Posted May 12, 2008 Report Share Posted May 12, 2008 That fig tree represents israel..We do need to get into God's word though and we do need to be aware of what is happening on the world scene.Eretz Yisrael turns 60 this month...do i hear a Havanagila???Lost...from an LDS perspective, there is a Biblical Israel...12 tribes...a political Israel...the modern nation composed of one and a half tribes...and the spiritual Israel...that global Zion we're adopted into...AND...Yes the word of God is important...can I send you a Book of Mormon so you can learn more????? <VBG> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WillowTheWhisp Posted May 12, 2008 Report Share Posted May 12, 2008 I see where you get the Rapture idea from when reading 1 Thessalonians 4:15 - 18 but it says that the Lord will descend from Heaven and the righteous will rise up to meet him. To me that sounds like going up to meet him on his way down and he's coming down to reign for 1,000 years on the earth. It says the righteous will not be separated from him so logically that's where the righteous will be too - both those who have been resurrected and those who have been changed without tasting death.We believe that 'the earth will be renewed and receive its paradisiacal glory'. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lostnfound Posted May 12, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 12, 2008 I see where you get the Rapture idea from when reading 1 Thessalonians 4:15 - 18 but it says that the Lord will descend from Heaven and the righteous will rise up to meet him. To me that sounds like going up to meet him on his way down and he's coming down to reign for 1,000 years on the earth. It says the righteous will not be separated from him so logically that's where the righteous will be too - both those who have been resurrected and those who have been changed without tasting death.We believe that 'the earth will be renewed and receive its paradisiacal glory'.That is one thought that christians do hold. Pre-Tribulation---raptured out before 7 year tribultionMid-Tribulation-raputred out in the middle of the tribulationpost-tribulation--is what you described above. after tribulation of 7 years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lostnfound Posted May 12, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 12, 2008 Eretz Yisrael turns 60 this month...do i hear a Havanagila???Lost...from an LDS perspective, there is a Biblical Israel...12 tribes...a political Israel...the modern nation composed of one and a half tribes...and the spiritual Israel...that global Zion we're adopted into...AND...Yes the word of God is important...can I send you a Book of Mormon so you can learn more????? <VBG>skip,..maybe you should call me lnf.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HizWife625 Posted May 12, 2008 Report Share Posted May 12, 2008 I like Dr T's thinking.....He calls you FOUND !!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lostnfound Posted May 12, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 12, 2008 I like Dr T's thinking.....He calls you FOUND !!!!! he calls me found one! I like that! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnBirchSociety Posted May 12, 2008 Report Share Posted May 12, 2008 okay but lds does teach that he will confirm the peace treaty? What about bibical prophecies telling us who he is and what his character willl be etcc?? These would not be theories..Well, we believe that the Anti-Christ will be a Son of Perdition...A Son of Perdition is one who has (in this dispensation) had their calling and election made sure and then rejected it...In this dispensation having your calling and election made sure involves certain temple ordinances that are by invitation of the Prophet only...THEREFORE, it seems evident that a good conclusion of this information is that we believe the Anti-Christ will be a former LDS person...Hope that piques your interest... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lostnfound Posted May 12, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 12, 2008 Well, we believe that the Anti-Christ will be a Son of Perdition...A Son of Perdition is one who has (in this dispensation) had their calling and election made sure and then rejected it...In this dispensation having your calling and election made sure involves certain temple ordinances that are by invitation of the Prophet only...THEREFORE, it seems evident that a good conclusion of this information is that we believe the Anti-Christ will be a former LDS person...Hope that piques your interest...former lds?? that did peek my interest..where is that sited? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnBirchSociety Posted May 12, 2008 Report Share Posted May 12, 2008 Skip i could not agree more..Nobody misread above. I never said bush was the anti-christ. Skip is corrrect he will be european. Hal-lindsey well I am not sure about him ethier..but yes we will not know the day or hour but we will know the season.The bible states when we seeing the budding of the fig tree we will know that summer is nigh. That fig tree represents israel..and that budding happened when it became a state. The season is here! Now do we need to get worried. Nope not if your saved..do we need to store tons of food. nope God already told us not to worry about such things.We do need to get into God's word though and we do need to be aware of what is happening on the world scene.I personally do not believe that the current State of Israel is the Israel of the last days in the Bible.The reason for this is the current Israel was formed by decree of the UN which is not a Godly organization. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnBirchSociety Posted May 12, 2008 Report Share Posted May 12, 2008 former lds?? that did peek my interest..where is that sited?Well I'm sure you can find where the Anti-Christ is a Son of Perdition.To be a Son of Perdition (in LDS terms) you must have the full witness of the Holy Ghost so that you KNOW (not believe, or have a "testimony", but actually, physically KNOW) Christ and the Atonement. In this dispensation, the confirmation, if you will, of that witness, is done in the Temple, through a specific ordinance, by invitation of the Prophet (calling and election made sure). Then you would need to reject that witness and be a Son of Perdition.(A non LDS person cannot be a Son of Perdition, because they haven't recieved the gift of the Holy Ghost)I agree that it seems rather clear that the Anti-Christ will arise from the European bloc.I wish you could go through the Temple...it is SO IMPORTANT!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlamedwFaith Posted May 12, 2008 Report Share Posted May 12, 2008 lostnfoundHave you ever visited the website for endtime ministries? The news it presents is most interesting.....I guess you would have to google it as I do not know the exact web address. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lostnfound Posted May 12, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 12, 2008 lostnfoundHave you ever visited the website for endtime ministries? The news it presents is most interesting.....I guess you would have to google it as I do not know the exact web address.yes I have..great website at least for current events updates but I would not advise anyone going there to listen to him for the gospel message. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlamedwFaith Posted May 12, 2008 Report Share Posted May 12, 2008 Yes, I would agree on the teachings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lostnfound Posted May 12, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 12, 2008 Yes, I would agree on the teachings.you would agree with Irvin's version of the gospel?? or did you mean the current event stuff? Irvin believes one must speak in tongues to be saved. I don't agree with that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Seraphim Posted May 12, 2008 Report Share Posted May 12, 2008 lostnfoundHave you ever visited the website for endtime ministries? The news it presents is most interesting.....I guess you would have to google it as I do not know the exact web address. HizWife:When you are banned, do not register under another account. You are now looking at a permanent ban.Seraphim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VisionOfLehi Posted May 12, 2008 Report Share Posted May 12, 2008 From a post by HizWife:The Rapture is described primarily in 1 Thessalonians 4:13-18 and 1 Corinthians 15:50-54. 1 Thessalonians 4:13-18 describes the Rapture as God resurrecting all believers who have died, giving them glorified bodies, and then departing the earth with those believers who were still alive, who have also been given glorified bodiesJoseph Smith translated that as: JST 1 Thes. 4: 17 Then they who are alive, shall be caught up together into the clouds with them who remain, to meet the Lord in the air; and so shall we be ever with the Lord.So, by modern day revelation, we LDS know that that verse meant those that were made alive (who were just dead) will be taken up, in this verse.Corinthians 15:50-54 focuses on the instantaneous nature of the Rapture and on the glorified bodies we will receive. "Listen, I tell you a mystery: We will not all sleep, but we will all be changed - in a flash, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, the dead will be raised imperishable, and we will be changed" (1 Corinthians 15:51-52). 51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep*, but we shall all be changed, 52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.*GR die, sleep in death.This suggests to me that it just means that when people die they'll come alive again. So in a twinkling of an eye that shall go from mortal to immortal, instead of actually "dying."Latter-day revelation solidifies this stance: D&C 63:50 And he that liveth when the Lord shall come, and hath kept the faith, blessed is he; nevertheless, it is appointed to him to die at the age of man. 51 Wherefore, children shall grow up until they become old; old men shall die; but they shall not sleep in the dust, but they shall be changed in the twinkling of an eye. D&C 101: 31 And when he dies he shall not sleep, that is to say in the earth, but shall be changed in the twinkling of an eye, and shall be caught up, and his rest shall be glorious.There's the LDS stance for you, lostnfound. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lostnfound Posted May 12, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 12, 2008 thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VisionOfLehi Posted May 12, 2008 Report Share Posted May 12, 2008 No prob! :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest User-Removed Posted May 12, 2008 Report Share Posted May 12, 2008 Well, we believe that the Anti-Christ will be a Son of Perdition...A Son of Perdition is one who has (in this dispensation) had their calling and election made sure and then rejected it...In this dispensation having your calling and election made sure involves certain temple ordinances that are by invitation of the Prophet only...THEREFORE, it seems evident that a good conclusion of this information is that we believe the Anti-Christ will be a former LDS person...Hope that piques your interest...JBS...I've NEVER read nor heard that...might you have a citation for it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr T Posted May 12, 2008 Report Share Posted May 12, 2008 test Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnBirchSociety Posted May 12, 2008 Report Share Posted May 12, 2008 JBS...I've NEVER read nor heard that...might you have a citation for it?1) Anti-Christ will be a Son of Perdition: Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition; (2 Thess 2:3)2) A Son of Perdition in LDS Theology: Having denied the Holy Spirit after having received it, and having denied the Only Begotten Son of the Father, having crucified him unto themselves and put him to an open shame (D&C 76:35) The blasphemy against the Holy Ghost, which shall not be forgiven in the world nor out of the world, is in that ye commit murder wherein ye shed innocent blood, and assent unto my death, after ye have received my new and everlasting covenant, saith the Lord God; and he that abideth not this law can in nowise enter into my glory, but shall be damned, saith the Lord. (D&C 84:41)(It's as if the person would willingly crucify Christ KNOWING he was the Christ. Again, this KNOWING is in the literall sense, coupled with the personal manifestation of the Holy Ghost.)3) A Son of Perdition in LDS Theolgy must have had the Melchezidek Priesthood: But whoso breaketh this covenant (Melchezidek Priesthood) after he hath received it, and altogether turneth therefrom, shall not have forgiveness of sins in this world nor in the world to come. (D&C 84:41)4) The accomplishment / receiving of the "new and everlatsting covenant" mentioned above is fullfilled in the temple: And verily I say unto you, that the conditions of this law are these: All covenants, contracts, bonds, obligations, oaths, vows, performances, connections, associations, or expectations, that are not made and entered into and sealed by the Holy Spirit of promise, of him who is anointed, both as well for time and for all eternity, and that too most holy, by revelation and commandment through the medium of mine anointed, whom I have appointed on the earth to hold this power (and I have appointed unto my servant Joseph to hold this power in the last days, and there is never but one on the earth at a time on whom this power and the keys of this priesthood are conferred), are of no efficacy, virtue, or force in and after the resurrection from the dead; for all contracts that are not made unto this end have an end when men are dead. Behold, mine house is a house of order, saith the Lord God, and not a house of confusion. (D&C 132:7-8)So to recap:1) The Anti-Christ will be a Son of Perdition2) A Son of Perdition in LDS theology is one who has received a full / literal witness of Christ and the Atonement with a full confirmation / personal confirmation by the Holy Ghost, and then deny it. In effect, being willing to crucify Christ, fully knowing Christ is Lord.3) A Son of Perdition in LDS theology must have had the Melchezidek Priesthood, and rejected it.4) A Son of Perdition in LDS theology must have had the "new and everlasting covenant" made, in the Temple of the Lord, by special ordinance / invitation of the Prophet, and then rejected it.THUS, we can safely infer that in our theology (LDS) the end time Anti-Christ will be a former LDS person who has had direct revelatory contact with the Prophet, and has specific ordinances performed by invitation of the Prophet, and then rejected the full knowledge of the faith / atonement.I hope this is digestable. And don't hesitate to ask further questions! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest User-Removed Posted May 12, 2008 Report Share Posted May 12, 2008 1) Anti-Christ will be a Son of Perdition: Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition; (2 Thess 2:3)2) A Son of Perdition in LDS Theology: Having denied the Holy Spirit after having received it, and having denied the Only Begotten Son of the Father, having crucified him unto themselves and put him to an open shame (D&C 76:35) The blasphemy against the Holy Ghost, which shall not be forgiven in the world nor out of the world, is in that ye commit murder wherein ye shed innocent blood, and assent unto my death, after ye have received my new and everlasting covenant, saith the Lord God; and he that abideth not this law can in nowise enter into my glory, but shall be damned, saith the Lord. (D&C 84:41)(It's as if the person would willingly crucify Christ KNOWING he was the Christ. Again, this KNOWING is in the literall sense, coupled with the personal manifestation of the Holy Ghost.)3) A Son of Perdition in LDS Theolgy must have had the Melchezidek Priesthood: But whoso breaketh this covenant (Melchezidek Priesthood) after he hath received it, and altogether turneth therefrom, shall not have forgiveness of sins in this world nor in the world to come. (D&C 84:41)4) The accomplishment / receiving of the "new and everlatsting covenant" mentioned above is fullfilled in the temple: And verily I say unto you, that the conditions of this law are these: All covenants, contracts, bonds, obligations, oaths, vows, performances, connections, associations, or expectations, that are not made and entered into and sealed by the Holy Spirit of promise, of him who is anointed, both as well for time and for all eternity, and that too most holy, by revelation and commandment through the medium of mine anointed, whom I have appointed on the earth to hold this power (and I have appointed unto my servant Joseph to hold this power in the last days, and there is never but one on the earth at a time on whom this power and the keys of this priesthood are conferred), are of no efficacy, virtue, or force in and after the resurrection from the dead; for all contracts that are not made unto this end have an end when men are dead. Behold, mine house is a house of order, saith the Lord God, and not a house of confusion. (D&C 132:7-8)So to recap:1) The Anti-Christ will be a Son of Perdition2) A Son of Perdition in LDS theology is one who has received a full / literal witness of Christ and the Atonement with a full confirmation / personal confirmation by the Holy Ghost, and then deny it. In effect, being willing to crucify Christ, fully knowing Christ is Lord.3) A Son of Perdition in LDS theology must have had the Melchezidek Priesthood, and rejected it.4) A Son of Perdition in LDS theology must have had the "new and everlasting covenant" made, in the Temple of the Lord, by special ordinance / invitation of the Prophet, and then rejected it.THUS, we can safely infer that in our theology (LDS) the end time Anti-Christ will be a former LDS person who has had direct revelatory contact with the Prophet, and has specific ordinances performed by invitation of the Prophet, and then rejected the full knowledge of the faith / atonement.I hope this is digestable. And don't hesitate to ask further questions!WOW...you have certainly brought a new "spin" to this issue...I look forward to engaging in further discussions on this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnBirchSociety Posted May 13, 2008 Report Share Posted May 13, 2008 JBS...I've NEVER read nor heard that...might you have a citation for it?By the way, Elder Maxwell taught us this in the MTC while I was there...so this is not a personal understanding I've reached...but rather information given by another... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lostnfound Posted May 13, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 13, 2008 Hey you guys I just posted a community bible study thread. I would love for all of to particpate in..check it out. I believe Luke also talkes about prophecies too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Dorsey Posted May 13, 2008 Report Share Posted May 13, 2008 test This is a test of the emergency rapture system...this is only a test.......AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAThis has been a test of the emergency rapture system, the Christians in your area in voluntary cooperation with the Lord and other authorities have developed this test in the event of an actual rapture. If this had been an actual rapture you would have been instructed where to go to meet the Lord in the clouds. This concludes this test of the emergency rapture system.We now return you to your regular scheduled postings............ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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