martybess

You do realize Justice that if they anti's show up for your challenge this thread could get long! LOL Is your intention to convert them when proven wrong? Can there be any other good reason to cause yourself pain. LOL

Well yes it was much like that. Really I don't know why either, just happen. I'm grateful. My father in-law lives in Finland and his conversion story is really cool! He heard the missionaries preaching in the street of Sweden on day while he was on his way home from work. He had to get work where ever he could after their war with the Soviet Union. Anyway he went home got down on his knees and asked if the things he hard were true. Just as with the angle Moroni did with Joseph Smith his roof opened up and angle came down to about a foot above the floor and told yes what he heard was true and to join the church and then left in the same way he appeared. He went to find the missionaries, found where they lived, knocked on the door and when they opened it he said I want to join your church. They thought he was joking started laughing and told him good one and shut the door. Of course he finally convinced them. He is 85 years old now. Was a great instrument in establishing the church in Finland. He is an amusing man. One of the first missionaries from Finland, first couple to be sealed from Finland and on. Is still Finland's patriarch and sealer. Has served in every calling pretty much including the temple presidency of the Sweden temple. Now they have their own temple. President Monson knows him well. He still come here often. Will be here next mouth to deliver the P. Blessings to the church office. There's more concerning the temple that Monson came here to give him when he was a counselor to Hinckley but I can't say more and really shouldn't of said that much but there was a thread concerning it just lately so I will say that it still goes on today. That I do know. Though I shouldn't. He is old and rambles on sometimes. I myself am grateful to of known such a great man. Hmmmm now I'm rambling on too. LOL

No I didn't walk and talk with the Savior on a daily basis. LOL

Yes I agree. Mine ultimate conversion was a sacred moment. Now I do not doubt! Can not doubt! It will come if it hasn't. Sounds like your in that process. Really cool!

How did you find brother Perkins and Bishop Ethel? Who are they? I'm so happy for you!! This is what it's all about!!! The trail of our faith comes first then a special witness! It makes us so much stronger! If you haven't had the witness concerning this you will!!!

Strange transition isn't it! Now What? I wonder how many times all of us here have asked that! Get down on your knees and ask Heavenly Father what’s next, he will tell you. Has he already told you and you’re just having a hard time with the answer? Go see your bishop, talk over the answer you probably already have.

I always close my eyes and try to think about it. I'm starting to get a greater reverence but it's taking me years really. The only problem I'm having now is sometimes because my eyes are closed I drift off to la-la land. LOL

Lovely, Remember there's bigatrey, hatred and prejudiced against Latter Day Saints as well. Missionaries are killed; members in the work place are treated unfairly and so on. Why because people are taught it mostly. Do we turn those who feel this way away? No we pray for them that they will see us for who we really are. We don't look for ways to judge but for ways to mend. It's all satin; he is the author of all this junk.

1- If they are not in a sincere penitent way or if the Bishop request they don't. I really wish there were more acceptance for those who feel unworthy. Many partake unworthily because they don't want to hurt parents/spouse/children or they dont wont the ward thinking/talking. 2-Yes 3- Handbook does not indicate. 4- Talk to them later. 5- I think to myself what a BIG person they are! I don't look around though. The newest handbook of instructions (book 1 2006) say this about what the bishop should do if a nonmember partakes. There's a guy in my ward who partakes every week and has for years and he's a non-member. "Although the sacrament is for Church members, the bishopric should not announce that it will be passed to members only, and nothing should be done to prevent nonmembers from partaking of it."

[Jhn 14:9] "Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou [then], Shew us the Father?" We can know without seeing. Have we not had a witness from the HG? Has not our breasts burned within? Then why can we not know? The spirit gives us a witness and we know spiritually. Just as I know how to turn on the lights in my house. 300 years ago that would of been a miracle if witnessed but is it not. It knowledge. Knowledge to produce electricity and the understanding of the principles behind it. The spirit works within the same principles, we just haven't been given that knowledge but none the less a witness is a witness we do not need to understand how it works. IT JUST WORKS. That is how I know, spiritually. -Marty Ps. How does Christ know all things? By the spirit. (or light really) [Jhn 21:17] "thou knowest all things; thou knowest that I love thee. Jesus saith unto him, Feed my sheep"

You are welcome Lovely. May you always come off victorious and may the Lord always be your guide. :) - Marty

Lovely, I’m sorry you’re having such a hard time with this. May you find rest in the Lord from the torments of the advisory. Remember adversity, in one form or another, is the universal experience of man. It is the common lot of all to experience misfortune, suffering, sickness, or other adversities and doubt. Our faith is tried in various ways—sometimes unjustly tried [it seems]. At times it seems that even God is punishing us and ours. One of the things that makes all this so hard to bear is that we ourselves appear to be chosen for this affliction while others presumably escape these adversities. . . . [but] we cannot indulge ourselves the luxury of self-pity." The Gospel is true hang on. When George A. Smith was very ill, he was visited by his cousin, the Prophet Joseph Smith. The afflicted man reported: "He [the Prophet] told me I should never get discouraged, whatever difficulties might surround me. If I were sunk into the lowest pit of Nova Scotia and all the Rocky Mountains piled on top of me, I ought not to be discouraged, but hang on, exercise faith, and keep up good courage, and I should come out on the top of the heap." Listen only to the living Prophet and apostles and what they say and follow and you will come out on top. May God Bless You and remember “Trust in the LORD with all thine heart; and lean not unto thine own understanding. In all thy ways acknowledge him, and he shall direct thy paths.” [Pro 3:5,6] - Marty

I would like to add my suggestion and many thanks to those who suggested. ADVERSITY & TRIALS In our extremities, it is possible to become born again, born anew, renewed in heart and spirit. We no longer ride with the flow of the crowd, but instead we enjoy the promise of Isaiah to be renewed in our strength and "mount up with wings as eagles." (Isa. 40:31.) We live in an age when, as the Lord fore-told, men's hearts are failing them, not only physically but in spirit. (See D&C 45:26.) Many are giving up heart for the battle of life. Suicide ranks as a major cause of death of college students. As the showdown between good and evil approaches with its accompanying trials and tribulations, Satan is increasingly striving to overcome the Saints with despair, discouragement, despondency, and depression. Yet, of all people, we as Latter-day Saints should be the most optimistic and the least pessimistic. For while we know that "peace shall be taken from the earth, and the devil shall have power over his own dominion," we are also assured that "that Lord shall have power over his saints, and shall reign in their midst." (D&C 1:35-36.) "Salvation," said the Prophet Joseph Smith, "is nothing more nor less than to triumph over all our enemies and put them under our feet." (Teachings, p. 297.) When George A. Smith was very ill, he was visited by his cousin, the Prophet Joseph Smith. The afflicted man reported: "He [the Prophet] told me I should never get discouraged, whatever difficulties might surround me. If I were sunk into the lowest pit of Nova Scotia and all the Rocky Mountains piled on top of me, I ought not to be discouraged, but hang on, exercise faith, and keep up good courage, and I should come out on the top of the heap." we see many joys and sorrows in the world, many changed plans and new directions, many blessings that do not always feel like blessings, and much that humbles us and improves our patience and our faith. We have all had those experiences from time to time, and I suppose we always will. "Adversity, in one form or another, is the universal experience of man. It is the common lot of all . . . to experience misfortune, suffering, sickness, or other adversities. Ofttimes our work is arduous and unnecessarily demanding. Our faith is tried in various ways—sometimes unjustly tried [it seems]. At times it seems that even God is punishing us and ours. One of the things that makes all this so hard to bear is that we ourselves appear to be chosen for this affliction while others presumably escape these adversities. . . . [but] we cannot indulge ourselves the luxury of self-pity." "When through fiery trials thy pathway shall lie, My grace, all sufficient, shall be thy supply. The flame shall not hurt thee; I only design Thy dross to consume and thy gold to refine." - [How Firm a Foundation] Pro 3:5-8 & 11-12 5 Trust in the LORD with all thine heart; and lean not unto thine own understanding. 6 In all thy ways acknowledge him, and he shall direct thy paths. 7 Be not wise in thine own eyes: fear the LORD, and depart from evil. 8 It shall be health to thy navel, and marrow to thy bones. 11 My son, despise not the chastening of the LORD; neither be weary of his correction: 12 For whom the LORD loveth he correcteth; even as a father the son [in whom] he delighteth. Peace, Marty

Absolutely fantastic! - Service motivated by love = charity. - Paying penance is real. We receive forgiveness through LOVING service. (Do we not feel good like God loves us and is happy with us when we help the one in need). Absolutely! Amen. Many of the talk topics are linked, really. If we have this love through a rebirth [topic4] which happens because of the atonement [topic2] then will accept calls and fulfilling them [topic1] and so on. . .

i like it!

I think this goes on quite a bit. It's just those that are in the mix of things don't see it. -Marty

Hmmmmm, thus far all suggestions are pretty much one in same really. Interesting.

Hey look prisonchaplain were trying too!!!! :) Alex Boyé is cool! This is pretty far from traditional MTC as you know. YouTube - I Want Jesus To Walk With Me (with Alex Boyé) .

If you could give one message,talk or lesson what would it be on and why? What do you think the world needs most? - How about if it were for Adults with children ranging from 2 to 21. That would encompass all those who can hold ward calling, attends the temple, raises children, fast, judge, procrastinate, help, donate, exercise, work, garden, prepare, etc. -Marty Here's the suggestions: 1- Importance of accepting callings and fulfilling them. (By palerider) 2 - Atonment - (Hemidakota) 3 - An active relationship with HF - (dazed-and-confused) 4 - Being Born Again - (Justice) 5 - Service - (Truegrits) 6 - Persons word...the value of being a person of character, trust and integrity - (Truegrits) 7 - Importance of teaching effectively - (Tough Grits) 8 - "Men are that they might have joy". Through Christ - (rameumptom) 9 - Stress to parents that children need to participate in service opportunities and work. - (Pam) 10 - Honesty - Importance of honesty starts when children are little and goes on to eternity. - (fish4kitty) 11 - Divisions between us - Fellowship ALL not just some and the good that will follow. - (Moksha) THANKS!

Prisonchaplain, Why do you come here? Are you trying to learn about Mormonism, convert us, answer questions about Protestants or all of the above? -Marty

I really have more important things to do than worry about this. Sheesh crazy fanatics!!

Wolves in sheep's clothing?

Wow that's profound

Pam, Your Bob Hope quote say's it all. "When we recall the past, we usually find that it is the simplest things - not the great occasions - that in retrospect give off the greatest glow of happiness". Bob Hope -Marty

I think we’re talking about two different sets of folks here. Anti’s and extreme anti’s. Most anti’s know it’s true but cannot live it so the conjure up in their mind by using satins great tool of “justifying” that’s it’s not true. Or were all stupid, or crazies or whatever. Extremes are a whole different animal. Satin has great hold upon their hearts. Love is the key to convincing them not debates. -Marty