[I can't stand someone!]

This is one of things that happens to nearly every new convert ... something comes along that is designed by the adversary to shake your faith. Keep learning and then follow the promise in Moroni 10:4 .... that promise applies to the gospel as a whole. If your teachers gets confrontational again tell him that you are here to learn and build your own testimony ... he can give you the foundation but he cannot force your testimony.

A new sister is our ward is an expert atthis kind of learning. She takes what the teachers are saying (she even takes notes in single adult home evening) and then goes home and reads all she can about it and prays. You can visually see her growing ... line upon line.

The author of all science is the Father ... makes sense that He uses it to fill His needs. Also makes sense that compared to Him we are still in the dark ages. Keep up the good work.

This is a challenge for me. In the past, if someone made me feel like I feel with him, that would be it, and I would just walk away; never talking to him again. Let me be clear, he is married and I am almost old enough to be his mother, so there is nothing going on there.

So, looking at Heavenly Father's higher purpose, and taking in mind what Jesus said, the realisation that we are to emulate his conduct even when we do not wish to do so. Surah 49 from the Qur'an also comes to mind and the realisation that Heavenly Father is calling me to something higher is unavoidable.

So, pleasing Heavenly Father is the goal, and the fact that he is leading me to a whole new way should not have been surprising, but it was. It is with some trepidation that I promise Heavenly Father to try to follow his will

[I can't stand someone!]

Hala read this account Joseph Smith wrote about the Angel Moroni in Joseph Smith History:

43 After this communication, I saw the light in the room begin to gather immediately around the person of him who had been speaking to me, and it continued to do so until the room was again left dark, except just around him; when, instantly I saw, as it were, a conduit open right up into heaven, and he ascended till he entirely disappeared, and the room was left as it had been before this heavenly light had made its appearance.

It appears to me immortal beings can travel in an advanced way beyond our understanding. Whatever this conduit was that Moroni ascended up into apparently is one way resurrected beings can travel at great speed.

Without wishing to sound impertenant, I think that perhaps it is all explainable with science, but most of that science may be beyond our present understanding. A physicist once told me that the theoretical folks postulate 16 dimensions at present, yet all we can explain right now is 4 of them, and really comfortable with Heavenly Father knowing more than me.

[I can't stand someone!]

I've appreciated your willing spirit and your insight as to what those coming from other faiths can believe.

While I don't agree with his methods, personally I agree with his conclusion and I'll try to explain why. Perhaps it will help =)

First off, from D&C 130:22 we learn that the Father has a body of flesh and bone. One day we too will have a glorified resurrected body of flesh and bone. At that point, rather than the body being quickened by blood as it is now, it will be quickened by the spirit instead.

One reason I believe as your teacher does can be found in Hebrews 1:1-3

Jesus Christ is the express image or likeness of Heavenly Father meaning he looks exactly like him the same way that Seth looked exactly like his father Adam (D&C 107:43).

Since I don't see Jesus Christ as ever ceasing to be the express image of his father, logic tells me that Heavenly Father doesn't change his physical shape or appearance.

Another reason I agree with your teacher as to our Heavenly Father's physical appearance can be found in the following scriptures; Alma 31:17, Mormon 9:9, D&C 35:1, 1 Nephi 10:18, 2 Nephi 27:23.

Basically these scriptures all say the same thing of:

Can you reconcile a belief that Heavenly Father could change in physical appearance and likeness with the above scripture? Personally I can not.

Therefore, having a knowledge of these and other scriptures, I conclude that Heavenly Father does not take on any other shape. Why would he being perfect, have any need or desire to do so? How could he and yet remain without variableness or shadow of changing?

Did this help?

Yes, thank you. I can not argue with your point of view because you have the intellectual high ground here. It does however generate just lots of questions for me.

So, the creator of the universe is running around in a flesh and bone body. How does he then get to other Galaxies at will. He stopped the rotation of the Earth. (Joshua 10:13) and I think Heavenly Father did it more than once. I am saying that I believe what the Bible says, but how can one who has only one form do all these things?

Please do not see me as a questioner because of lack of faith, but simply one who quests to more fully understand Heavenly Father.

[I can't stand someone!]

Hala....just for the record if this brother told you that Heavenly Father has a body of flesh and blood...that is incorrect. Heavenly Father has a body of flesh and bone....not blood.

The "Flesh and Blood" part was my mistake. Sorry. After praying and talking to some of the other Sisters, we have decided that I could learn much by continuing with being taught by him.

[I can't stand someone!]

Don't worry about filling anyone else's shoes. Mormons have shoes of all different sizes. I know I will never grow into some members' shoes. DH, due to a brain injury, will never grow into some members' shoes. But that's not why we're here. We're here just to grow and learn to the best of our own ability and not compare ourselves to others.

Please do not let yourself feel somehow "less than" because of your brain injury. Heavenly Father will help you to be everything you need to be in spite of that. Because of my own past, I have spent just lots of time reading about Neuro Science and Early Childhood Development. I just so hope that you are in a nurturing environment, because the love of Heavenly Father and others can overcome so much. Please do not sell yourself short.

[I can't stand someone!]

Well, my intention was not to call you to repentance, Gwendolyn.

My intention was merely to point out one of the most effective tactics that Satan uses to keep us from being able to enjoy the blessings of the gospel in our lives. He likes to get us so worked up over our perceived differences that we lose sight of the love and concern we should have for the soul with whom we are discussing such matters.

I know that Heavenly Father will answer your prayers and I have every confidence that you will make the choices He wants you to make; even if they seem difficult for a season.

I do not know if I can grow into the LDS shoes. Mormons have shown me love like no one else in my life. Thank you Heavenly Father...

[I can't stand someone!]

Gwendolyn, I don't know you very well, but, it seems to me that you are on the right track!

These are the statements of someone who is drawing nearer and nearer to the most non-abusive Man that exists. I know that the Lord loves you and must be SO PLEASED with your decisions!

With that being said, I can promise you that the path towards our Heavenly Father has a lot of obstacles (sometimes in the form of people!). The adversary is clever and quick to try and get us off track. I have found that one of the sneakiest tricks he uses is to attempt to bring contention into our hearts:

Whatever the topic that was being discussed, it was less important than maintaining the Holy Spirit and avoiding contention.

Contention has a way of consumming our thoughts and cutting us off from receiving further light and knowledge into the matter being discussed.

Sigh. So, I have a choice to make peace with him, or lose Heavenly Father's blessings.

[I can't stand someone!]

Have patience, Gwendolyn, we will have much understanding over time. Is there a particular principle that was bieng taught? Perhaps focusing on the principle rather than the specific scripture will help.

I love your humble nature, and your desire to learn. That is a most important thing to have, and important way to be as we will enter into God's kingdom teachable as little children are.

Thank you. I am searching for Heavenly Father's will in this. My experiences with men early on were abusive and traumatising. Then as I aged I met both good men and abusers, so while I learned to relate to the good ones, those who feel abusive to me feel awful and frightening. Last night I thought I stood up to him fairly well but then after I cried, and today I cried, and I just feel a wreck.

Maybe it is as simple as Heavenly Father wanting me to learned to not be so frightened of forceful men. I definitely am praying about this.

Much Peace

Gwendolyn

[I can't stand someone!]

Thank you both. This situation has deeply upset me. I won't be harshly confronting him, because Heavenly Father has been so good to me, and now I wonder if this is some sort of learning experience, so I'm going to pray a lot about it.

One thing I do not understand is D&C 130:22 does say, "The Father has a body of flesh and bones as tangible as any mans's; the Son Also...

I agree with that, and in the case of God, I think he can assume any form that he wishes. I am not God, and do not know everything about God, and for me to say that Heavenly Father can only have one form, to me is presumptive and arrogant, to put it mildly.

In the past I would have simply left and gone home and he would never see me again. However, I feel like Heavenly Father is wanting me to learn something here, so out of obedience I am going to pray a lot and take it. This is so upsetting that I am actually physically ill over it, and I have never had anything affect me like this. I don't know what I'm doing wrong but I certainly want to stop it.

Gwendolyn

[I can't stand someone!]

I am really ashamed to tell this but right now I just don't know what do to.

So I finally got Baptised last month, and am really thankful for that. Heavenly Father has blessed me so much.

So, now we are starting the New Member Lessons and what happened last night felt like the Spanish Inquisition. The man was blunt and rude and it felt like he tried to force me to believe just a certain thing. It started with The Articles of Faith, and I belive them and will obey them. Then he moved on to D&C 130:22-23. He practically forced me to say that God has a body of flesh and blood. Well, fine, I agree, but I also assert that Heavenly Father can take pretty much any form he wants to. He seemed really upset by that, and really pushed me to the point that I really wanted to just get up and go home.

Today, another sister, and a good friend, said that i missinterpret what he says and see him as another abuser. Yalllah !!!!

So, right now I am not in a good place. I want to please Heavenly Father, and will be praying and trying to find a way to cope with him. I would really appreciate some sage advice and prayer.

Much peace

Hala

[I'm a WET MORMON !!!!!]

Wahooo!!! That is wonderful!!! Know that you are loved and wanted!!!!

What a wonderful, wonderful day. A great beginning!

Thank you, and now I would like a calling; to be put to work; doing for others what so many have done for me! It all still rings in my soul! I feel like I have been rung like a bell, a happy one! :)

Gwen Ellen Boucher

[I'm a WET MORMON !!!!!]

I always park under the Joseph Smith building. It's very easy. If you drive on south temple there is an underground parking lot where the entrance is basically in the middle of the street (it goes down a ramp). Then you just walk through the JS Building to all the things around there. Too many to mention here.

Welcome to the official Temple Square tourism site | Visit Temple Square

Restaurant Validated Parking | Restaurants | Temple Square Hospitality

And yes, the trax is free for the few blocks around the area. make sure you go to the Gateway Mall.

Note: The link says the lot is under construction, but gives alternatives.

Wow, I can hardly believe this is happening! Heavenly Father is being so kind and loving to me, I "scarce can take it in". I won't go into it, but just think of me as a person that was judged and rejected most of my life. It is imposible to express how this is all affecting me. Maybe someday, but not now.

[I'm a WET MORMON !!!!!]

Thank you. I finally got home last night and went almost straight to bed and slept 10 hours, something I seldom do, and I feel really happy today, but as limp as a wet rag. Wow, such an emotional experience and wow, so many well wishers and wow, I hope that I can measure up. This isn't just a religion, but a whole intelectual culture, and so into... inclusive and now a calling and how do you all absorb it? :))

Baptised... Gwen Ellen Boucher

[I'm a WET MORMON !!!!!]

OK, wow, I was baptised on Sunday, 1/29/2011 at the Colonial Heights Ward, in Portland Oregon. Wow !!!! It was something that I never believed was going to happen until just a few days ago. WOW !

So now, when it seems like the weather has moderated, I think in late March, the two sisters that taught me when I was in Kirtland and I want to meet for Breakfast. After that, on my way home on Monday, I'd like to take a few, or several, hours to tour the Area around the Temple in Salt Lake. One of the first things I notice about the area around the Temple, Is there does not seem to be parking. OK, I do not mind walking; I even thought of brining my bike to ride around, and I can do it in a skirt, except I'm thinking that they probably don't allow bikes in the area and I respect that.

So, being freshly baptised what areas can I walk in? This is really exciting !!!

And to think I was Muslim less than one year ago !!!!

[I am getting Baptised !!!]

Congratulations! When is the big day?

''

I don't know the date yet, but in a couple weeks! Someone pinch me!!!!

[I am getting Baptised !!!]

Though at times I worried it might not happen. I am getting baptised! Yaaayyyyyy!

[Where can I get good politcal advice?]

I am very sorry I started this thread.

[Where can I get good politcal advice?]

When it comes to political truth the best place to find it is - me! Private message me and I'll be happy to answer by email.

Um, are you playing a joke on me?

[The LDS from a Muslim perspective.]

So are you in the process of getting baptized/converting? I am a new convert myself. I served in Afghanistan and find Islam, contrary to many peoples feelings, a beautiful thing with many tenet beliefs that I feel all people should follow.

Oh, I most certainly learned much about myself and God in Islam. I could just never resolve the Jesus Christ question in Islam to my satisfaction. And, for a white American woman who does not know Arabic, it is pretty hard for various reasons.

As I have said before, I first admired someone who obeyed the first commandment, and then found that the Prophet Muhammad PBUH and his revelation of the Qur'an seemed quite reasonable.

So, then when I encountered the LDS in Kirtland, and they were so absolutely, unreservedly, undeniably, loving, it sort of bowled me over. AND, unlike so many other faiths, they said that I could bring what I learned into the church! No one ever asked me to not wear my Hijab, and I mostly stilll dress like Muslim woman. They will not attack another religion. Wow, gag me with a spoon!

I'd still be Muslim if they accepted Jesus as the Christ...or maybe LDS/Muslim, um or something. :)

Salaam

Hala

[Where can I get good politcal advice?]

Moderator comment:

We are allowing this thread to remain open. But, remember the rules regarding discussing politics. Please do not discuss candidates in the thread.

Sorry.

[Where can I get good politcal advice?]

snopes.com is good for checking political rumors.

realclearpolitics.com offers the latest polls, and lots of opinion articles from different viewpoints.

The Week magazine offers a great set of summary articles about the news, again offering multiple viewpoints.

All of these are fairly objective. If you want conservative or liberal commentary, I can suggests specific sites...but the above should give you a fairly broad spectrum of opinions, so you can decide for yourself.

One of my pet peeves is I just wish opposing parties would at least tell the truth about each other ! Grrrrrr:mad:

When I was yet Muslim, those guys were telling some real woppers about Muslims. Then when I was an evangelical, a long time ago, they were lying about Mormons and Muslims. Gosh ! And then when I was Muslims, those guys didn't really know anything about Christians!!!!!! Gahhhh~!!!!! It just makes me want to pull both my remaining hairs out!!!!

Sigh... I just wish that people would do good research and verify it with their opponents before spreading it. Most of what I read now is as bad as used to come off the back of the manure spreader on the farm.

[Where can I get good politcal advice?]

Hi:

I know it is probably against the rules to talk about politics here, so can someone tell me where I can go to find information?

[Evolution/Creationisim]

To my understanding, the flaw is related more to what we plug into the science out of our own world-view, and not the science itself. On both sides of the debate.

Well, you've got to admit we don't know *everything* about very many things, if anything, at this point. Especially when the have the influence of the Light of Christ *and* the Holy Ghost surrounding us, and no way to measure or examine it in a physical or scientific way.

HiJolly

Yes, this should keep us humble. :)

[Evolution/Creationisim]

I do find it ironic that hardcore Darwinian Evolution is treated with almost as much religious reverence in most universities, that any professor or academic professional who expresses the slightest interest in or respect for Intelligent Design could be viewed as a willing martyr. Dissent from Darwin

Ironic? I think it is criminal! Many of us struggled greatly because we thought critically about things, I did. And then we get to college and the Profs want to stamp out the critical thinking and make us think just like them. It makes my head spin.

[Evolution/Creationisim]

You're right, but the CES (Church Educational System) does. And they're wrong. So sad to see!

Right again!

Right. The scriptures tell us WHY all things were created, but not so much HOW.

I would say that the evidence for long term evo is compelling. Just add time to what we see in the lab everyday.

HiJolly

But what do we do if evolution has a major flaw? I just don't like it when a bunch of people stand around yelling at each other over things that we do not know everything about. And I just don't care if God, Jesus, or an Angel comes to visit in a planet sized space ship or just pops out of a dimensional rift. I don't care if he looks like a Corporate President, or a homeless man. Though, it might be fun if he came on a big white horse carrying a huge sword.