Hyena

After you are baptized, what do they call you? I understand the established members of the church are called "Elders." Those who are considering joining the church are called Investigators. But what are new converts called? How long after joining do you begin to become involved, as in getting assignments, requests to do things, missionary work, and such things? How do they decide what they think you would be best at and place you? How long before you are considered an Elder and someone of value in the church as opposed to just someone filling the seats on Sunday? More importantly, how often do newly baptized members slide back into the obscurity of their secular lives, back into their old habits, and become distant from the Church? How does the Church react to these people? Is there a section of the church who's duty it is to seek out the wayward or non-devoted members and try to bring them back in? And if they can't... can the Church punish you? Do they ever kick someone out for not living up to their baptismal promises?

Thank you all! As long as you can stand me I'll keep you updated on my exploration and use you all as a valued resource for any questions I might have. So far, I feel very welcomed by the church and if this is what it is like to be a member, I think it makes my decision process that much more easier. Like I said, it's going to be very hard for me to become a Mormon and what I'll probably endure and my biggest fear is that it'll be one of those situations where they say, "well, we got him converted, on to the next needy soul." And I'll be tossed onto the heap and forgotten as just another in a long line of converts who probably cease to attend sacrament within a year of baptism. Which brings to mind another question but I'll post it in the forum appropriately. As for this thread, I've completed my fasting and it was... not as bad as I thought. I had to try to pray a few times because the desire to eat and the lightheaded feeling I got towards the end felt more like excuses to give up but I stuck it out. I've been reading the Book of Mormon, and whilst I'm totally confused about Nephi and Lehi, I'm sure re-reading on a full stomach might help my cognitive abilities better. Thank you all for the advice. Next time I'll attempt to do it without water. The only thing I didn't know was WHAT I was supposed to pray or pray about so I just repeatedly prayed for understanding and strength to not give in and eat.

Good point. It would be good to get different perspectives! 7 hours of fasting to go. Lord give me strengtnh.

Oh, quick question! What about chewing gum? Is that considering breaking fast? Or is that acceptable.

Well I began my fast last night around 10 pm, mostly because it was a convenient time. I was already preparing to pray and reading the Book of Mormon. so I figured it was as good a time as any. But I didn't fully realize that drinking water was bad too and already drank some this morning when I woke, so I'm contemplating attempting to go the duration without water or just drinking water this time and next time attempting to do it without the benefit of water. Ironically, the hunger part is not really bothering me... it's the THOUGHT of eating. I'm consumed with thoughts of foods and all the things I want to eat that I could eat right now if I only quit. It's been a little over 13 hours now. I feel like I've done well enough, I could just end it here and now, but I feel I made a commitment so I'd probably better stick to it to get the best result. In a sidebar, some of you might be pleased to know that I took your advice and chatted with some nice LDS girls on Mormon.org and they gave my information to an online missionary who immediately emailed me and so now I've been communicating with him pleasantly. I feel a little sad because I suppose that means my time here on the forums is somewhat over since I'm certain he can or should be able to answer any questions I need to learn about the Mormon church. I sincerely thank all of the wonderful people who have provided their guidance and support over the past couple of weeks.

SKippy, thank you for merging them. I'm sorry for going at it from two different locations, but part of it I felt was a question and the other part I felt was instructional so I posted in both forums lol. So would you or Vort recommend, just to be clear, no water as well during the 24 hour fast? Or is it JUST food? I want to be absolutely clear, since I live in Texas and the idea of a dry throat is not exactly making for a great time. Thanks. I just want to know for certain.

lol Disclaimer received loud and clear. I hereby absolve Vort of all legal obligation and responsibility if I ignorantly cause my own demise attempting things I know nothing about.

Absolutely LOVE that. So, Vort, would you recommend I attempt to fast and pray for greater and swifter understanding of the Book of Mormon as I try to discover how I want to proceed with the church?

AHHHHHHH.. So while I am fasting I'm meditating on something to keep my mind from the hunger?! AHA! How do you determine how long to fast? Is there some sort of guideline? So if I pray for greater understanding of the truths in the Book of Mormon and to feel the spirit, then I can begin fasting? And when I'm done, I pray to thank God for my prayer and fast?

Well that I kinda got.. but what I don't understand is the practice itself? So you just say, "Okay no food or drink for a day and hope that I don't slip into a diabetic coma in the process!" and that's all there is to it? I guess I got the opinion that it was a more... involved and serious thing than that. That there was a way you do it. I mean, I suppose I could go tomorrow without eating anything and just read a few lines from the Book of Mormon but it hardly seems like the revelatory spiritual tool it was made to sound like in descriptions I've read in other testimonies from members of the LDS church. Maybe it's easier than I thought.

I am investigating becoming a member. I have been reading a bit of the Book of Mormon in order to seek its truth and I've been praying as I have done so. I have read about fasting helping the prayer process. But can someone instruct me on how to fast properly and safely? I don't understand what it involves beyond starving? Thank you.

So I've been doing a lot of reading as most of you are probably aware and exhausted with lol. I have come across several instances of people fasting. Can someone explain this practice to me? How does one do it? From what I gather, it is often used to help someone game spiritual enlightenment or to help a prayer? As I am reading the book of Mormon and praying in my investigation does anyone recommend fasting to help me in my efforts to help me move closer to what God wants for me or what he is trying to guide me into?

One thing bothered me greatly in my reading: “In the celestial glory there are three heavens or degrees; “And in order to obtain the highest, a man must enter into this order of the priesthood [meaning the new and everlasting covenant of marriage]; “And if he does not, he cannot obtain it” (D&C 131:1–3). That sounds an awful lot like ugly and obese people are totally going to get hosed in the afterlife, pardon my language. Full disclosure, Im a big guy and not terribly attractive or interesting. So basically, Im going to be looking down a celestial barrel of never achieving the highest level of reward because what are the chances Ill be married any time soon if ever? So it seems to me that LDS single members get the short end of the stick. This would depress the heck out of me. I wouldnt want to be a member of church where worst case scenario Id be looked down upon for being single and at best openly pitied by fellow members over something I cant help. Plus Id never feel happy realizing Im "different" from all the other members. Also, from what Im reading, Temple marriage is eternal. I see nothing where it can be undone. So does this mean that divorce is something that is not allowed or performed as far as the Mormon Church is concerned? Once sealed, the sealing is permanent and eternal?

This creates a potentially unique problem. You see, my family is almost CERTAINLY to never transition to Mormonism. In fact, my younger brother is becoming quite a well respected and exciting young Baptist minister who is invited to give sermons at many different churches due to his impressive preaching (I call it fire and brimstone from the pulpit). My mother is more reserved but leans towards him whilst my father (who passed away a year ago) was staunchly irish Catholic as is all my family from that side (and until recently, me as well). My other brother and sister.. well they arent particularly aligned with any spiritual institution either by choice or lack of interest. So given that... I would hope someday to be married within the Temple should I become LDS and meet an LDS woman that would find me worthy of such an honor as matrimony. What this means, however, is that tragically, I would have absolutely no one there for me at our Temple Marriage. In the long run I suppose I wouldnt be too bothered by that, but you can see how this might make for an uncomfortable situation. But a lot of great links and information given here.. Thanks everyone. I appreciate the warmth and friendliness Ive recieved on these forums. Im seriously considering speaking to a missionary very soon. Perhaps as soon as right after New Years. I dont want to bother anyone during the Holidays when they should be spending the time with their families.

What is a temple marriage? How does it differ from a regular wedding? Or rather, do Mormons have more than one type of marriage? I was reading how it seems to be the hope of most to be married in the temple. It sounded like there is some advantage in the afterlife for this? Is it related to sealing? Or is that something completely separated to be "sealed" to someone else? What is involved in a temple marriage that you wouldn't have in a normal wedding? If the wedding is held in a temple, are guests allowed to the ceremony? How if you must be Temple worthy to enter an LDS temple? Finally what are the requirements of being temple Married? Must your partner also be a Mormon? If so, do both have to be Temple Worthy or just temple recommend? If Mormons do not drink alcohol, what is served at the wedding reception? Is there an approval process? How does one get approval for a Temple Marriage?

Then how does the church justify so much suffering? Even the members of the church have their own issues and pain. People lose children. They suffer divorces and cheating. They lose their jobs. They lose family members, people they depend and rely upon and love. They end up alone and in pain, broken both in heart and spirit. Why do some people find love and others are condemned to a life of quiet desperation and loneliness? It can't all be due to the Devil. At some point, you have to question why God who wants the best for us, his children whom he loves so much, sits back and turns a blind eye during our most trying and horrible moments. Why doesn't he intervene in more tangible ways? Why do we never blame him for the awful things that happen to us? I've been reading the Book of Mormon and even there I see whole peoples who suffered needlessly. All God had to do is step in. Even Joseph Smith was martyred. Why did God allow that? He was the prophet! I get Jesus... he had to die for our sins, I get that was the price he was paying. But why so many others? Why do children lose their fathers too early in life when they needed them most? Why do we fall in love with people that can't or won't return that feeling? More importantly, why SHOULDN'T we blame God for some of our woes? I don't mean to offend, but I need to know why I should put any more of my faith and stock in a God that for all intents and purposes claims to be a loving father and at the same time abandons us when we need him the most? Is it possible the deists were right, and God simply created us and the world and the universe and then went off to do something more interesting to an omnipotent being? What's the point of prayer if prayers aren't ever answered?! I mean, it's a little forgiving to simply say "Oh well they are ARE answered... he answers yes, no, and maybe!" Great! But if you can't distinguish one from the other what's the good of the answer? Maybe by even asking these questions I'm demonstrating I'm not worthy of consideration by the LDS Church for membership, but I couldn't in good conscience continue investigating without resolving this line of inquiry. I want to believe and have faith and be at peace like so many others. But I don't know how to do that. It consumes me with grief. Maybe one of you has an answer that can better explain what God's intention and purpose for us is and how you can discover what God is trying to tell you to do? Again, if I offend I apologize profusely in advance.

I think this singular concern ranks chief amongst my greatest fears and probably what holds me back the most.

And I'm sorry for being something of a pest... I just noticed I tend to create a bunch of new threads. I'll try to taper off a bit from now on.

I guess I'm just looking for some constructive suggestions to help those of us struggling with the decisions on how to proceed with considering the LDS church. There are too many concerns to list, but I imagine that many of the people here once went through similar experiences. So if you had a list of words of wisdom for those considering the LDS, specifically in addressing potential fears like the apprehensiveness of joining a group that is unfamiliar, to the best way to seek out missionaries or how to address them or questions that should be presented once missionaries are involved, if they even need to be? I mean, could someone just walk into an LDS church and request an immediate baptism because they did their own research? I just figure since some of you already went through this you'd have a few good things for the uninitiated that you wish someone had told you before hand.

Is it true that LDS members are expected to form relationships with other LDS members and are discouraged from dating and marrying non-LDS faith people? And if this is the case, is that cause for motivation for someone to join the LDS church? I mean, even if the person already believes in Jesus and serves God in another faith, would it be encouraged or discouraged for that person to consider conversion in order to gain the heart of the person they love who is already an LDS member? Would it even matter? If you converted to Mormonism would a Mormon person find that an appealing action that might open up the avenues to romance or would they find it annoying that you converted just for them? This is not my situation, but I do wonder what would happen if later on after conversion I found someone to be romantically interested in that was non-LDS and if I should dismiss her or pursue her and strive for her conversion first before moving forward with a relationship.

Interestingly enough, although the church did officially grant priesthood to Blacks (I hate African American as a label as I am not from Africa and am related to nobody who has BEEN to that continent in probably 200 years), it wasn't the first time the Church had a more positive opinion of blacks in service. According to a lot of what I've read, it wasn't until Brigham Young came along that those "policies" towards negroes were hashed out, and I have a sneaking suspicion that it was more due to social pressure than any true malice... I mean, New York State, Missouri... these states haven't been notoriously friendly towards Mormons let alone colored people to begin with, so it was probably one less fence the church wanted to build at what was already a difficult time where from my understanding Mormons were literally being slain for simply being MORMON. Sounds like blacks and LDS church members have more in common than we think. But there were already priests of color in the LDS under Joseph Smith. We know of at least one or two historically. And Joseph Smith from what I've read in his papers (The Joseph Smith papers is an amazing book, if you can find a copy... I bought one off Amazon and have been reading it. I find biographies of historical persons particularly fascinating regardless of their reputation. I read a lot of them.. and he was an amazingly fascinating man. And an avid Abolitionist). But what I've sort of learned in life is that I've stopped caring about race history to be honest. What people and organizations did 30, 40, 100 years ago no longer is relevant to me. It's been nearly 40 years since the Church reversed course on its stances on minorities. What we should concern ourselves with is how WE can best serve our Lord God, what the church's stance is NOW and will be in the FUTURE, and how you and I and other blacks (I'm assuming you're black based on you asking the question, but I could be wrong and I doubt it's very relevant anyways if you aren't) help to shape and change those stances, opinions, and policies through our dedication and acts. As someone considering conversion too, I have concerns too. So if you'd like you are welcome to message me and maybe we can learn together. :)

First off let me preface by saying that I am truly sorry for what you are going through and my heart, love, and support go out to you earnestly. Secondly, let me provide you full disclosure: 1. I am not a member of the LDS church, although someday I would hope to be, should I find way to resolve my fears in doing so, but that is another matter altogether. 2. I am not a certified counselor, therapist, or expert in dating advice. I am a humble man with humble thoughts and I probably have made more mistakes in love than a person should be allowed. Thirdly, As a Catholic, I believe I might be able to empathize somewhat. In fairness, I don't think our faith puts the emphasis on the importance of family the way the LDS people seem to, which is one of the more appealing aspects of their faith to me. Lastly, I'm a rather young man, just in my 30's and thus please accept any offerings I might have here in the realm of advice to be understandably lacking in terms of experience due to the short-sightedness of youth. That out of the way, Here is my thoughts. Marriage is a holy union, a covenant... moreso it is a partnership. Like any partnership, there must exist an amount of give and take and work must be done to ensure that both sides are suitably satisfied. This oft times requires the one thing most people are the least willing to give: Sacrifice. My first thought is to your statement about how your marriage has been sexless. That is probably one major factor right there. A man and wife MUST be intimate in their relationships. Especially since sadly us males have urges we cannot resist entirely too long. Sure we can discipline ourselves to remain chaste, but usually this is with the understanding that someday we will have a wife and thus be able to carry out our carnal urges in a more productive manner. But even the best of us, let me tell you, sexual desire is a beast locked in a cage within our hearts.. and it is always there.. smouldering, pacing too and fro, gnashing.. waiting for its chance to be freed from it's constraints. Sometimes, the cage weakens.. or someone else comes along and opens the door... But besides the problem of sex, which I have to wonder and ask WHY is your marriage sexless, there also is the major concern of financial hardship. It is my understanding that nothing ends more marriages in this world than financial stress and woe. So compound that with the lack of physical intimacy and you've got a recipe for disaster. For us men, being a breadwinner and providing goes far in curtailing our other baser desires and satisfying our emotional stability. At least from my own observations as a young man. In more basic terms, idle hands are the devil's playthings, so a man who stays busy taking care of his woman tends to find less time for straying away. Again, I could be wrong. But all of these trials are only sent to test us by the deceiver I believe. When you marry, it is to be through the worst and best of times under God and with his approval. You've made a commitment. So what must be happening is that somewhere in that commitment, something went awry.. and it may not be entirely one person's fault or the other. Have you tried speaking to your husband candidly? Calmly? If he's cheating or not, the bond of trust is obviously in great disrepair and having a confrontation about it will only serve to exasperate the situation. Instead, there needs to be an understanding that regardless of what HAS happened, it is now past. The Rubicon has been crossed, all you can do is focus upon the future. I would seek the counsel of your Priest if you are active in your church and even if you are not. I would speak to your husband and ask him what he feels has changed in your relationship, and what he would like to see happen in order to improve it. I would also begin to work on yourself. You mentioned you were a heavy woman. There's no need to be. Start walking, start finding ways to excite yourself into eating healthier and having a healthier lifestyle. This sort of positive hobby will give you a better sense of esteem and self-concept, which are integral to improving any relationship. Positive changes in yourself and not being so focused on your husband's doings will simultaneously aid you in coping and navigating through this stressful terrain, but it will also impact your husband. He may begin to see you in a new light and sometimes that's all it takes to reignite a spark that has long since began to wane into an ebbing ember. And pray. Prayer is far better than worrying and fretting.

LOL Okay thank you. Happy Thanksgiving though, to you all!

Great answers as always. The pioneer day is definitely something I'll try to do for my LDS friends this year. And as a non-LDS member I have to admit that some holidays hold special meaning for me. I'd relay some but.. well, sadly, while most holidays are sentimental to me, deeply so, the sentiment is due to their painful nature and thus difficult for me to recall. But I think it'll give my LDS friends a bit of joy if I show some appreciation for them by celebrating their special holiday each year.

I must say, I rather like the idea of that... a day where people tell stories of their family history and share more about themselves. And of course BBQ chicken doesn't hurt either. I have never heard of July 24th. Is that Pioneer's day? I'll check more into it. Maybe I'll organize something for my LDS friends that live here locally this summer to celebrate pioneer's day and that way I can learn much more about potentially converting!