Snow

cont. And Snow said this: Jakeman's latest is nothing but a tour de force, a whirlwind ride that never pauses long enough to let you catch your breath... not only did it keep me up reading until the wee small hours of the morning, it had me waking up early to read some more. If you appreciate fiction, of the fictional kind, this book is must read. Can't wait for the movie.

Jason, The story you linked about the illegal activities of fundamentalist polygamist is hardly any indication that individual wards in the LDS church are subject to or prone to or in danger of group apostacy. Likewise, I scanned the first eight links from you think is a good indicator of sex-abuse cases in the Church. First, I mostly just skip the tripe that cult-hounds publish and promote, but still in this case I find not much much at all about sex abuse in the Church. Mostly I find that the Church settled on a case as a matter of expediency, not as a matter of guilt and then a bunch of lard from clowns like Kosnoff or whatever the slime bucket's name is and the unfounded/unsubstantiated allegations of others. What is your point? That abuse in the Church is any more or less prevalent that in the general population?

Hmmm,But isn't God the father of our spirits (though not the creator or our "intelligences") and isn't spirit material, only finer and if so wouldn't that make us physically part of God? Besides, we are of the same species as God and therefore have the same basic genetic makeup, no? Is it being Gods actual physical Son what makes Christ also God? And besides the besides, we don't even know in what specific way Christ is the physical Son of God.

According to LDS theology, it would be very important. As you know, the bible was pieced together in an unorganized process that took hundreds of years. Lot's of important things could have been left out. In fact, it would have been a miracle in important things were not left out. Do you know of anyone involved in the compilation of the NT that claims that a miracle took place>

Congrats sgallan.

Jenda is RLDS, maybe they have a different page count in their publication, plus there is a lost written 116 pages... Say, by the way, since this was originally my topic... I have been studying the translation process for the past couple weeks preparing for a lesson next week. I'll grant that Mormons who don't pay attention (like me) may not be fully informed about the process, but I also believe that the anti's who think they know what really happened, are mostly just blowing smoke.

Is that sarcasm coming from you Curvette? I surprized at you.

I'd like to. Peace is one of my favorite people on the board. She has always treated me well and always contributes to the discussion. I don't understand why she gets in arguments with so many people. I don't understand because I don't know what on earth she is talking about half the time. It's beyond me.

Well thanks. Miss your post but I know this stuff doesn't interest you as much anymore.A general apostasy may not be explicit in the NT but there certainly are enough relevant verses that a logical inference could be made, more than just the hint you say is missing. Of course, from your perspective, I'm not sure what relevance any of that would hold. Is it your position that the NT is the final word on all that is true, correct and complete? Thank goodness Mormons don't have to rely just on the NT for our doctrine. Besides, there's alway Isaiah.

Jason,How you been? You are interpreting the clause about the gates of hell not prevailing as meaning that there would be no apostacy and/or no need for a restoration. By "hell" you want us to infer the devil - that he won't conquer the Church. I don't read it that way. Personally I can think of lots of ways that your argument fails. Here's one. Gates of hell refers, not to satan, but to Hades which is the unseen world, the Hebrew Sheol, the land of the departed, that is death. We needn't picture Hell attacking the church. Christ's church will prevail and survive because He will burst the gates of Hades, (meaning his mortal death is not the end), and come forth conqueror. He will ever live and be the guarantor of the perpetuity of His people or church. (RWP) When viewed that way, along with the many verses that predict an inevitable apostacy ( ex: 2 Thessalonians 2:3), this particular argument makes more sense than your. Besides, that just one of several ways of rebutting your argument.

Peace, His name isn't Rodney.

Wrong answer.Doctrine is not so defined because of it's location (standard works) but is the eternal, unchanging, simple truths of the gospel of Jesus Christ, regardless of where it is found.

Atta way to answer a question by asking more questions Ray. What this world needs is more questions. Don't ya think?

I prefer to think of her, fondly, as the liberated women of Babylon, not afraid to assert herself and use her sexuality as an asset.

Well... there's Winona Ryder.

1. The heat, and2. The humidity. Fortunately a cooler, drier climate is predicted for the millenium.

What about the two do you think is analogous?

I don't know that it has a direct link to alt. sexual practices but if homosexuality is like anyother thing in the world, then publicizing it, encouraging it, making it easier, glamorizing it, etc, leads to a wider adoption of it. Think of tobacco and alcohol and consider how the image of them that is presented affects the use of them. They say you can't make a straight gay or vice-versa, but when don't you think that a breakdown of sexual mores leads to promiscuous lifestyles. It is quite the rage in certain circles for girls to have lesbian relationships with other girls, even though they aren't really homosexual, it's just for kicks, just for the fun of it. That's not the way I would look at it. I would say that society has a vested interest in promoting and protecting and entitling certain kinds of institutions. In this case that would be institutions that tend to create the best citizenry possible. It can be argued that standard, man-woman, nuclear families, on balance, are more likely to produce a stable, law-abiding, well-adjusted, population than are, say, child farms ran by an all-male staff. If it is true that traditional marriages produce, on balance, the best citizenry, then society should protect, and encourage it. I am not saying that it is absolutely true, but I have never seen evidence, scientific or antedoctal that gay unions are as likely to produce as good a citizenry as tradition unions. Since it is our traditional accepted model that is being changed, I think some burden of proof is in order to change it.

Only if you have had a gun pointed at you will you know what you'd do. People surprise you when they're faced with extreme circumstances. I've seen guys I thought were tough as nails hesistate and retreat while the guys I'd have picked to run did the best. But if you know you'd run, you're probably right! I get so excited when Trident does his Army Ranger routine. All I know is that last time Trident and I were on a special ops to invade Nova Scotia and overthrow the government and install a puppet regime, a teenage girl snuck up behind Trident, pushed her finger into his back and shouted, "stick em up cowboy,"... well, let's just say that it's was good that we had recently bought shares in Depends ®.

And I have heard that Keith Partridge is dating Marsha Brady.What's your point?

The person that wrote that is a sanctimonious moron. Example: The writer equates moving out of the way of dangerous lunatics as equal to ‘not denying Christ.’ Wrong. It simply equates to moving out of the way of dangerous lunatics. Nothing more. That assumes that the people in question believe the way to heaven is by doing what “the bible says,” but actively choose to otherwise. Gosh did it ever dawn on the writer that maybe people, or some people don’t think that the way to heaven is not by not eating pig…? Who, besides Martha Stewart, says that? I don’t know where the writer works or goes to school, but I don’t allow obscenity in my workplace, neither do they allow it at my children’s school. On the other hand, in my kid’s public school, there are teaching about Christ, and Mohammed and others. Additionally, we talk lots about religion at my work. I have had two such conversation today. I don’t know why the writer thinks everything is “funny.” Bad sense of humor I guess. But I won’t be passing this on to others – not because of the reason the writer suggests, but because I think it is moronic.

So back to the poster's implied arguement of equal rights. What rights, who gave them (anyone) the rights, how, when, where, what theory...?

What I like best about this topic has nothing to do with Bush. It is what Pat Robertson said: "I think George Bush is going to win in a walk. I'm hearing from the Lord that it's going to be a blowout." Not that God appeared to Pat in a vision and revealed it, or in answer to prayer, Pat was impressed that... No, Pat represents that 'he's hearing from the Lord' like God was kinda thinking outloud, Pat was in the room, and from this observation of God's thinking process, you know, it's gonna be a blow out.

Yeah, I am dying to hear that theory. What "rights" are you talking about. Where did they get those rights? That's right. Mormons are not humanists. I forgot. Please forgive my ignorance. Holy Smokes, What poster using an assumed name that starts an implied argument that he has no idea how to finish? Who on earth could it be? BTW, moderators, Pahoran is a poster, now banned and formerly known by another name. 1 guess who.

Yeah, I am dying to hear that theory. What "rights" are you talking about. Where did they get those rights?