tiancum

Miss half way, that is a bit simplistic, please expand... Plus, i don't think anyone was saying we earned anything. It is very different than the Father requiring something of us, which he does.

how do you interpret this? Does the lord require something of us before we are "saved"?

hethe, have you already experimented with Tarot?

I just found this old thread. Found it fascinating. I reread Scott Peck's views (on first page) and found them very close to the mark. A good self checker for me.

Isn't Salem where they make SALEMI ...SALAMI...??? Wow, i think i got dumber creating that humor.

The only thing I do not totally agree with is that it has to be canonized in order for it to be binding. Other than that, I am with ya'll 100%. Also, i believe a living prophet trumps an anterior prophet. So if P. Monson told us that the lord told him ALL the BoM took place in Alaska, then I would tend to believe him.

Good and bad... I know it's going to turn out with them getting angry when they come in telling me what i believe and calling me names. I am a really good debater in person. So I usually win....and they calm down.

I totally agree. We are not to take all the Ga's say as doctrine. When they receive revelation is a little bit different situation though isn't it? If the revelations they received aren't real, then... Well, i can see the problem this creates that Joseph Fielding mentioned. All I am saying is that MANY of them received many documented revelations about BoM locations. I don't believe Revelation can "sometimes" be true from a prophet of God. If one of the Apostles receives a revelation, and the prophet says its correct, and I choose not to believe it, don't i stand on shaky ground? These are hard pills to swallow, I know. I have believed many things strongly, but when I saw what the Ga's have said about it, i saw that it was time for me to change my opinion.

Joseph Fielding said so...but just out of curiosity... does the church need to make an "official statement" about every single thing Joseph prophesied for it to be true? They say he was a prophet. "officially"... that pretty much says his revelations are true. Can you name a revelation that he received that is not approved?

The church officially hasn't, but Joseph, Oliver, Heber, and others made prophecies, and had revelations that it was. I cut and pasted a little of what they have said.

That was never said. Joseph, Oliver, Heber and many others received revelations as to specific locations. They are documented. The church has no official position on locations. Not the revelation from the early days. The Locations don't really matter that much to me...I believe what the above have said, as I know they were the Lord's servants and backed up each other's testimony about the locations...beyond that...it mattereth not...LOL

That will be sweet

I went to it. All I saw were the accounts of it being an actual cave...some might have seen it in vision, but many claimed to have set foot in it, including Brigham young. They even said that joseph deposited the plates there.

the only thing that doesn't make sense about him transplanting the plates is that Joseph and Brigham actually went into a huge cave with lots of plates, inside Cumorah. It was not a vision as they actually entered. That, and everything that Joseph said about Nephite civ taking place in north and south america. It's in doctrines of salvation...if ya have gospelink check it out. here are some quotes Joseph Fielding Smith Furthermore, There are many accounts of the City of Manti being located in Missouri. There are more there. feel free to read. I do not care much about the Locations, but for the sole fact that the Prophets and Apostles have never EVER said anything to suggest that the Nephites did not possess the Land northward. They have, in fact taught the opposite A LOT. Many of them claim to have received revelation about it. They clearly state that The book of Mormon lands included New York and the USA. Something Joseph Fielding said disturbed me too. "Because of this theory some members of the Church have become confused and greatly disturbed in their faith in the Book of Mormon". I did not even imagine that this theory was hurting people, but apparently it is, according to Joseph Fielding. That is the only reason I post on this thread. I do not debate the fact that the nephites and Lamanites were in South and central America, but i simply assert that according the what prophets and apostles have said, including Joseph Smith, It happened in North America too. And....the hill cumorah was Ramah, and when the prophet saw the many waters in the vicinity, he stated they were Ripliancum.

Lol, to whom do you ask? What an interesting question.... Is asking such a question appropriate? I mean, why would someone reveal such a thing in such a place as anon. online forums. -to give their opinions more authority? -to receive honor/acceptance/respect? -to help others know they can achieve it? -to simply bear testimony? If you have seen Him, do you need to say that you have every time you give testimony?

Elph, I agree, there is a little bit of condescension towards ya in the thread. I have seen your heart, and that is why I love you so much. I think you are a good person. I plan on going the same place you are....If that's ok. If there is nothing, then we will surely go to the same place...Mutha Earth, if there is something, we can have a cross touching marathon. We as Mormons-Christians-humans really feel the need to be right. Sometimes we sacrifice being kind for needing to be right. While a person might technically be right about a certain issue, we treat others as fools because they believe differently.(SELF-RIGHTeousness) One of my favorite movies is "Harvey" Jimmy Stewart was talking to the Doctors who thought he was crazy. He said "there are 2 types of people in this world, the smart, and the kind, I've done smart, I choose kind."

To answer the original question.... Blessed are the pure in heart, for they shall see God. This is a promise that can happen in the flesh, it is something that every Saint should be striving for.

I was thinking, the whole face of the land was changed...greatly, when the savior came. The narrow neck of land could have come up from the Yucatan up through florida. parts of western Mexico, suggest that they were under the sea. I think we greatly underestimate the technology too. When a people flourishes and is following the gospel for the most part, they advance technologically very quickly. I think, many times, we are reinventing the wheel. I doesnt matter that much to me. where it all happened. The prophets have said where it happened round about. thats good enougth for me

lol, i love you Elphie it was funny BTW. I love the word accoutrement. It makes me want to touch Crosses, ALL FRIKKING DAY LONG! didja know...i have actually tasted holy water, in Africa? And I made my key chain holy by dipping it. i prolly shouldn't have, but that is what a stupid teen does when he's not fondling Holy Symbols, gesticulating wildly at cars that cut me off, or sleeping.

Lol, wheat. I bet he did some good too, in spite of his stupidity.

LOL are you allowed to touch other crosses, just not roman catholic ones? Are you allowed to play the song "hot cross buns"? are you allowed to type the letter t? Last time i checked touching crosses was not a pastime of Christians.I am sorry Elph. People like the lady you mentioned piss me off. Hey, we should hang out and touch crosses together. I touched 18 and a half yesterday. (1/2 was yesterday...I was at the gym, a lady was wearing a cross necklace....lets jsut say, i had to leave quickly, and got my joggin in)

a bit over the top in some places Yes because if we animalistic men do not have sex often, we will cheat. It is inevitable. LOL Those that don't take the time to learn who Santa Claus really is will be distracted. The real "santa" taught us how to follow Christ better when he was here. Ya know, all the above is all well and good, but all the devils have to do is make us fear facing our own weaknesses....needing to be right, and lying to ourselves about how righteous we are. It is then that the atonement's healing powers have no effect on us.

Me too, i know I will never know the hour and the day until that day comes. I was saying something totally different. when i said it bugged me, it was more a self righteousness thing, people thinking that because we can't know, that it is wrong to guess, and try to force their belief on others. About the Savior knowing, that is the big debate, many believe he knows. I tend to fall on the side of him knowing. He and the father are one...He IS the father.

Some in the church believe in the 2 Cumorah theory. That Moroni took the plates from the first hill Cumorah, somewhere in Mexico (they believe) and put them in New York so Joseph could get 'em. They are also of the belief that the majority of the BOM did not happen in north America. I don't believe in this theory personally. Things Joseph said throughout his life about different placed in the USA and the story that Hemi mentioned about the huge room filled with plates make me believe that it was probably in NY. IN Doctrines of Salvation 3 , there are many prophets and apostles that claim that "THE HILL" Cum. in NY, is the only hill Cumorah, and is named Ramah also. They further claim that the ancient city of Manti was located in Missouri too. I don't care much about locations. All I care about is that it happened. It did. No amount of proof I can purchase with money will help me "enrich my testimony". If i have a choice between what Indiana Jones says:lol: or prophets or Apostles of the Lord, the latter feels better to me.

I was thinking of one of the people i know, and she is one of the most spiritual people, and powerful people i have ever met. She has literally called down the powers of heaven many times. Most of the time, when i hear a person swear, i little part of me cringes. Occasionally, when she swears, it sounds, pure, and is not offensive in the least. When i heard her, i thought, this isn't swearing. Is it possible to use a word we consider swearing, and have it not be ugly/offensive to the spirit? While another can say the same thing and it sounds horrible????