Word of Wisdom and Vegetarianism

[Hemidakota]

In seriousness, a good book that was written back before WWII, was done Elder John A. Widtsoe called "Word of Wisdom: A Modern Interpretation". Noting the age of the book and when it was written is still good today and filled with science attestation.

In chapter 10, breaks down the meaning of the phrase, "All Wholesome Herbs".

"And again, verily I say unto you, all wholesome herbs God hath ordained for the constitution, nature, and use of man—as also the fruit of the vine, that which yieldeth fruit, whether in the ground or above the ground." 1

Definition of "Herbs". The word "herb" was frequently used a century ago to include plants and vegetables, direct products of the soil. The dictionary defines it to be: "a plant that dies completely, or down to the ground, after flowering". Also, "an herbaceous plant used medicinally". As used in the Word of Wisdom it was undoubtedly meant to include all plants the use of which is good for man. The modifying words "all wholesome" indicate that all edible vegetables and fruits of earth are included in the term; they also indicate that some "herbs" are not fitted to be used as food.

Composition of Vegetables and Fruits. It was shown early in the history of plant science, but after the Word of Wisdom was received, that plants contained all of the necessary food substances: Proteins (flesh-formers), fats, starches and other carbohydrates, minerals and water. Much later, as will be shown, it was discovered that the plant kingdom is the best source of the sixth necessary group of food substances, vitamins.

Water is present in large proportions in most vegetables. Young plants often contain more than 90% of water—that is above the proportion in whole milk.

The proportion of the necessary food substances varies greatly in different plants. The mineral content depends on the composition of the soil where plants are grown. Therefore, to secure the best results, vegetables should be so selected as to insure a balanced diet. This requires a knowledge of the composition of the vegetables usually consumed. The following tables show the proximate composition of the edible portions of a few well-known vegetables and fruits:

COMPOSITION OF VEGETABLES

Carbohydrates Calories

Water Protein Fat Ash Total Fibers Sugars Starch per lb.

Asparagus .. 93.0 2.2 0.2 0.67 3.9 0.7 1.24 0.4 120

Lima Beans . 66.5 7.5 0.8 1.71 23.5 1.5 595

Soy Beans .. 64.7 12.4 6.3 2.2 14.4 2.2 325

Red Beets .. 87.6 1.6 0.1 1.11 9.6 0.9 205

Cabbage .... 92.4 1.4 0.2 0.75 5.3 1.0 3.5 130

Carrots .... 88.2 1.2 0.3 1.02 9.3 1.1 7.5 205

Celery ..... 93.7 1.3 0.2 1.08 3.7 0.7 1.25 100

Onions ..... 87.5 1.4 0.2 0.58 10.3 0.8 6.7 0.5 220

Potatoes ... 77.8 2.0 0.1 0.99 19.1 0.4 0.87 14.7 385

(From "Proximate Composition of Fresh Vegetables," Charlotte Chatfield and Georgean Adams, Circular 146, U. S. Dept. of Agriculture)

Some vegetables used for human food contain a considerable proportion of starch. Fruits, on the other hand, contain little starch but relatively much sugar. Most fruits also contain small quantities of organic acid. (Malic acid indicated by "m" and citric acid indicated by "c" in the following table.)

It is evident that vegetables and fruits contain all the necessary food substances, and that they are rich in minerals. They are also the best sources of all vitamins. It is now conceded that vegetables and fruits are of first importance in maintaining full health.

COMPOSITION OF FRUITS

Carbohydrates Calories

Water Protein Fat Ash Total Fiber Sugars Acid per lb.

Apples..... 84.1 0.3 0.04 0.29 14.9 1.0 11.1 0.47m 290

Apricots ... 85.4 1.0 0.10 0.59 12.9 0.6 10.4 1.19m 255

Bananas .... 74.8 1.2 0.2 0.84 23.0 0.6 19.2 .39m 445

Oranges .... 87.2 0.9 0.2 0.47 11.2 0.6 8.65 .78c 230

Peaches .... 86.9 0.5 0.1 0.47 12.0 0.6 8.78 .64m 230

Pears ...... 82.7 0.7 0.4 0.39 15.8 1.4 8.90 .29c 315

Strawberries 90.0 0.8 0.6 0.50 8.1 1.2 5.27 1.09c 185

Watermelons .92.1 0.5 0.2 0.27 6.9 0.6 6.00 .03m 140

(From "Proximate Composition of Fresh Fruit," Charlotte Chatfield and Laura I. McLaughlin, Circular 50, U.S. Dept. of Agriculture)

The Provident Earth. The great Builder of the earth provided well for the physical needs of His children. Countless varieties of edible plants, vegetables, cereals, fruits and nuts are yielded by Mother Nature for man's daily food; some furnish one predominating food element, some another, each filling some need of the human structure, each contributing to man's complete well-being. All vegetables and fruits have drawn upon the "dust of the earth", have combined the necessary mineral elements so that when eaten by man they may become a part of his body structure, as bricks in a wall, or as promoters of proper metabolism, to secure his health.

Variety Necessary. Man should partake in plenty of all edible fruits and vegetables. It is a mistake for a normal person to say: "I don't like this vegetable or that", and refuse to eat it. Children should be taught from the weaning period to eat and enjoy all the different kinds of vegetables (prepared in milk soups at first), so that their bodies may grow in bone strength and nerve tone as well as in size. This practice should be encouraged in adults as well, for all have need of the nutritive value of fruits and vegetables. One should insist that every vegetable to be found in the market forms some part of a week's food supply.

Many delicious vegetables grown in other countries would add greatly to the American diet, such as the kohl-rabi (a variety of cabbage which grows like a turnip, but above the ground) used largely on the continent of Europe. Rutabagas are among the most valuable vegetables grown but are not used as they deserve. One should be familiar with and help create a demand for all kinds of vegetables. The farmers will produce what people call for. It is a great pity for an individual, a family or a nation, to confine its taste to two or more vegetables. Meat, potatoes and cabbage (or sprouts or cauliflower) may make a good meal occasionally, but served every day they produce a very one-sided diet. Dr. Mottram says:

"We have all met and hated the persons who, with a tone of conscious rectitude and insufferable worth, assure us that they "never touch" some specified food. It is a dietetic vice, not a virtue, to exclude things from your diet." 2

The chief special value of fruit and vegetables in the diet is that they contain the valuable mineral salts and vitamins (see chapters 9 and 11). For this reason they greatly stimulate appetite and digestion; they produce vigor and resistance to disease; the regulating effect of the acid-alkaline reactions on the body function is increased, and partly because of their fiber and roughage they promote intestinal health and hence the well-being of the entire body.

Fruits are of further value because of their appetizing quality. Their varied color, aroma and flavor make them most stimulating to the senses of sight and smell as well as taste. As is well known, food which appeals to the senses becomes more appetizing and thus actually aids digestion. Insipidity is an actual, physiological defect in food. The vitamins, salts and juices of fruits stimulate the flow of gastric juice and with the indigestible fiber directly aid the peristaltic action of the intestinal muscles.

Most fruits should be eaten raw, fully ripe, and "in the season thereof", for reasons explained in chapter 11. Fruits and vegetables should be eaten in liberal amounts by young and old, and with grain products should form the bulk of the human dietary.

Live and Learn. Some one may object and say: "Well, our forefathers did not have all these fancy varieties of food, yet they fared pretty well." Did they? Could they have fared better? It is a fact that in the good old days in some countries flocks and herds formed the bulk of the people's food; in the autumn the animals which couldn't be fed over the winter were killed and their flesh salted, smoked or otherwise preserved. But in those good (?) old days, periodic ravages of sickness and death swept the land like a devastating fire. Scurvy was so prevalent in London that it was called "London disease". And who has not heard of the great plagues of history, the hideous "black death," cholera, and countless others? We are now beginning to understand that not a few of these diseases had their origin in wrong food and other faulty habits of life.

It is interesting to know how mankind generally has learned to eat. The custom of eating green salads was introduced into England by Catherine of Aragon, the Spanish wife of Henry VIII. She imported a Dutch gardener, as salad-growing in England at that time was an unknown art. Up to the present day green salads have never been as popular in Britain as on the Continent or in America, though their use is increasing.

Sir Walter Raleigh is supposed to have introduced the potato plant into England in Elizabethan times, but it was a much later date before potatoes were extensively used for human food. For generations after their introduction they were looked upon as pig food and were eaten only by people who were too poor to buy other foods. Likewise, today many first-class vegetables used in America are unknown in Europe and vice versa. 3

In such manner have food customs developed; and by using knowledge it may be possible to improve the diet and eventually to help stamp out disease.

Cooking of Vegetables. Many vegetables may be eaten raw as salads with profit to the teeth as well as the general health. Such are lettuce, cress, cabbage, carrots, celery, young peas, turnips, rutabagas and many others. The root vegetables may be cut very fine or grated. In this manner may the necessary elements of earth come to man in their purity.

Most starchy foods taste better and are more easily digested when cooked, but the cooking should be done in such a way that the mineral and other nutritive elements are not destroyed or thrown away. Much of the mineral content of fruits and some vegetables is found near the skin; for that reason, if possible, the skin should be eaten. Especially is this true of the potato which should never be peeled but either baked and the skins eaten, or boiled with the skins on, then mashed or riced if desired, and the cooking water used in soups.

Vegetables should not be allowed to soak in water, for their minerals and vitamins are usually soluble, and thus wasted in the water commonly thrown away; neither should the cooking water when vegetables are boiled, be thrown away, for the same reason. One writer has said that if kitchen sinks and garbage cans had hearts and lungs they would be the best fed animals in captivity! The solutions obtained when vegetables are cooked should be saved and served with the vegetables or used for sauces or soups.

Vegetables should be prepared only when ready to use; soaking should be unnecessary. If cut fine most vegetables will cook in from 5 to 20 or 30 minutes. Care must be taken not to overcook them as this destroys their vitamins as well as changes their delicate flavor. They should be cooked with a minimum of water, or better cooked in a double boiler, or the waterless way, and the whole served together. Familiar to every one are the sloppy, tasteless, colorless vegetables of the average cook which often look to be a "tangle of brown weeds and they will taste like vegetable matter spread on paper and horsehair." 4 Alas, this description fits the cooking of vegetables in many homes and hotels. It is not to be wondered at that most children and many adults dislike vegetables, for they are often so poorly cooked that their natural flavor is changed beyond recognition.

In contrast are the properly cooked peas, beans, spinach or asparagus which resemble little bunches of jade-green goodness as delicious as a breath of fresh clean air. Each vegetable has a distinct flavor and when properly cooked should be enjoyed as a real epicurean delight. They ought to be so well cooked that, as in France, they may serve as a delicious course by themselves rather than as negligible additions to the meal.

Soda should never be used in the cooking of vegetables for it destroys the vitamins and makes the food tasteless. 5 If cooked quickly with little or no water, all vegetables will retain both flavor and color.

Roughage in Vegetables. It is necessary to have bulk and indigestible material in food to promote normal peristalsis of the alimentary tract and evacuation of the bowels. "This is true for all normal people over nine months of age." 6 Such a prevention or cure of the bug-bear of "stasis" in the large intestine or constipation should come from natural foods.

The tables near the beginning of this chapter show that fruits and vegetables contain relatively large proportions of cellulose, or crude fiber. This does not dissolve to any large extent in the alimentary tract, but serves the important purpose of furnishing bulk, which together with vitamin B (see chapter 11) is necessary to overcome the common and serious ailment of constipation. (see chapter 13)

The Question of Fat. The value in the diet of the fats of the plant and animal kingdom must not be overlooked. Edible fats and oils are valuable energy foods, and perform other distinct functions in nutrition. Recent researches show that one or more of the fatty acids which are normal constituents of natural fats, such as butter, are actually indispensable in complete nutrition. Linoleic acid, for example, is reported by McCollum and Becker to be necessary for an adequate diet. 7 A chief value of fats is the warmth yielded when burned in the body; hence their direct need in cold regions. Secondly, they tend to delay the rate of digestion, which results in a feeling of well-being and satisfaction, since pangs of hunger are felt when the stomach is empty. On the other hand when fat is mixed with protein or starch it may become a menace for it takes as long as six hours before the stomach is emptied. Fats further add much to the flavor of different foods.

The yellow animal fats also contain vitamin A which is necessary for complete nutrition. The fact that fats generally have 2 1/4 times as much fuel value as sugars and starches indicates that they must be used with intelligence.

Except in the coldest climates the fat in the diet must always be balanced with starch and sugar. That is, fats should be eaten in a definite ratio with carbohydrate foods. Without such balance the fat is incompletely burned, which gives rise to injurious substances known as acetone bodies. This condition causes a feeling of nausea, or general illness, and may induce the so-called bilious attack. The "morning sickness" of pregnancy is largely a result of this disturbed balance. During pregnancy, fats should be confined if possible to those containing vitamin A, and starches and "sweets" should be increased in moderation. During the nursing period, however, starches and sweets as well as fats should be curtailed in the mother's diet and the mineral and vitamin bearing foods increased. 8

There are other disadvantages in a too free use of fat in the diet. Its digestion, which is not affected by the gastric juice, must wait until it passes out of the stomach. The slow emptying of the stomach may aggravate or even cause the fermentation of starchy and sweet foods and the putrefaction of protein foods. The fat forms a coating over the starch or protein particles, which is penetrated by the digestive juices with difficulty. This, in the presence of the warmth and moisture of the alimentary tract, also favors fermentation and putrefactive changes.

Therefore, pastry and rich foods which are mixtures of fat and starch or sweets are always difficult of digestion. Excessive use of fats leads to indigestion and liver trouble. Another factor is that, with the exception of butter and the yellow animal fats, they lack vitamins, mineral salts and fiber. Vegetable oils, bacon and lard contain no vitamins.

A warning must also be given regarding the use of fried foods. When brought to a high temperature some of the fat is apt to be broken down into substances irritating to the alimentary tract. If properly cooked, fried foods may be eaten in moderation. However, they should be left out of the diet of children altogether. Butter and cream, the yellow fats of meat, with a minimum of salad oil, should form the chief supply of fat in the diet.

Vegetarianism. A discussion of vegetables and fruits as foods would not be complete without a comment on vegetarianism. Modern research has shown as already indicated that all of the necessary food constituents are found in plants. From that point of view, vegetarianism should be practicable.

However, studies of the protein or flesh-forming constituents of plant and animal foods, point to the conclusion that it may be desirable to include some animal protein—milk, eggs, meat—in the human dietary. This conforms to the dictum in the Word of Wisdom that meat may be used sparingly.

In fairness, it must be said that many vegetarians have lived well and happily to a ripe old age. The possibility of subsisting wholly on non-animal products cannot be denied. Man may live entirely upon the products of the soil, and do effective work and attain a high age. But such a diet is probably inadvisable for one who does hard physical work, unless the vegetable proteins are chosen carefully and wisely.

The suggestion has been made that the capacity of the human stomach makes it difficult to supply the body with the necessary protein from somewhat bulky vegetables. However, the legumes and the grains contain as much protein per pound as meat, though in all probability vegetable proteins are less rapidly digested than meat proteins.

Whether vegetarianism is successful depends no doubt upon the intelligent skill with which vegetable food products are selected and combined in the human dietary.

However, for temperate and cold climates, most nutrition experts agree that meat, used sparingly, should be included in the human dietary.

The Word of Wisdom Confirmed. When the Word of Wisdom was given in 1833, plant chemistry had scarcely been born. A number of plants had been studied for the medicinal, stimulating or toxic substances they contained. There was no certain knowledge at the time that all the substances necessary for the maintenance of life were found in plants, except as certain vegetarians had succeeded in living on a wholly vegetarian diet. A number of years after the revelation was received, it was demonstrated by scientific methods that all known substances required for the nutrition of the animal body were found in varying proportions in all plants, and that plants might therefore be used for human food unless they contained in addition, injurious substances, as for example, caffeine in the coffee bean. Moreover it was shown that fruits and vegetables are of chief value in maintaining human health. This was in direct confirmation of the statement in the Word of Wisdom that "all wholesome herbs are ordained for the constitution, nature and use of man." The Word of Wisdom is again confirmed by science.

[Hemidakota]

good morning! i have a question for anyone who cares to answer. i received a copy of the word of wisdom from a friend, and i find it to be a very beautiful document! many of the items mentioned within the body of the text are things i follow every day as a buddhist. i took a vow many years ago to refrain from intoxicating substances, and i believe, if i am reading the word of wisdom correctly, this is prohibited for lds people as well. i have a question about a certain portion of the word of wisdom....

and again, verily I say unto you, all wholesome aherbs God hath ordained for the constitution, nature, and use of man—

every herb in the season thereof, and every fruit in the season thereof; all these to be used with aprudence and bthanksgiving.

yea, flesh also of beasts and of the fowls of the air, I, the Lord, have ordained for the use of man with thanksgiving; nevertheless they are to be used sparingly;

and it is pleasing unto me that they should not be aused, only in times of winter, or of cold, or famine.

all grain is ordained for the use of man and of beasts, to be the staff of life, not only for man but for the beasts of the field, and the fowls of heaven, and all wild animals that run or creep on the earth;

and these hath God made for the use of man only in times of famine and excess of hunger.

all grain is good for the food of man; as also the fruit of the vine; that which yieldeth fruit, whether in the ground or above the ground—

nevertheless, wheat for man, and corn for the ox, and oats for the horse, and rye for the fowls and for swine, and for all beasts of the field, and barley for all useful animals, and for mild drinks, as also other grain.

and all saints who remember to keep and do these sayings, walking in obedience to the commandments, shall receive health in their navel and marrow to their bones;

and shall find wisdom and great treasures of knowledge, even hidden treasures;

and shall run and not be weary, and shall walk and not faint.

my first question is this....are lds people vegetarians or vegans? i had never heard this, but i was curious. as a strict buddhist, i do not eat animal flesh of any kind (including oceanic life).

my second question is....where it says, "health in their navel and marrow to their bones," what does this mean? sorry if that is a stupid question!

As I stated, you need to start with the background on why the revelation was given:

Historical. The revelation known as the Word of Wisdom was received by the Prophet Joseph Smith on February 27, 1833, when the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints was not quite three years old. The young Prophet had received revelations from time to time, as occasion demanded, for the building and guidance of the Church that he had been commissioned to restore.

According to the custom of the day, a number of the early converts to the Church were users of tobacco. In fact, several who had been called into the higher councils of the Church had the tobacco habit. Some were accustomed also to the use of alcoholic beverages, chiefly such as were brewed by the people of the "pioneer fringe". There was little or no drunkenness. Coffee and tea were favorite family drinks when they could be secured. In the use of alcohol, tobacco, tea and coffee the early Church members were much like their pioneer neighbors, perhaps more temperate.

These habits did not seem to the Prophet to comport with the sacred nature of the work entrusted to and accepted by the Church. Especially did it seem out of keeping with the spirit of the occasion to have the odor of tobacco in the council rooms of the Priesthood. This was aggravated when, as occasionally happened, a tobacco chewer brought his "cud" into the council chamber. That explains the reference to the "council of high priests" in verse one of the revelation. It was the use of tobacco by this body of Priesthood that brought the matter to a head.

The practice of the Prophet was to lay before the Lord all questions that arose, and await answers. Such an appeal was made with respect to tobacco, and in due time the revelation called the Word of Wisdom was received. The inquiry may have been confined to tobacco; the response covered the whole field of food and drink. It was often so. A simple question was the beginning of a vast unfolding of truth.

While the inquiry was occasioned by experiences among the "council of high priests, assembled in Kirtland" and the answer directed in part to them, the revelation was also for "the church and the saints in Zion" and "all saints, who are or can be called saints," that is, for the Church everywhere. It was so interpreted by Joseph Smith and has been so taught by his successors

[MrNirom]

Hmm, so the WOW is NOT an important belief in your church? I'm confused.

Yes.. I can see that.

I said "It's not" in response to your question: Could not the Word of Wisdom be considered a subtext of the Articles of Faith in your church?

In otherwords.. the Word of Wisdom 'is not' a subtext of the Articles of Faith in my church. The Word of Wisdom was a revelation from God... The Articles of Faith are a statement from man. :)

[Elgama]

Hmm, so the WOW is NOT an important belief in your church? I'm confused.

Eating Healthily

Early to Bed, Early to Rise

Writing a Journal

Family History

Family Home Evening

Daily Scripture Study

Home and Visiting Teaching every month

Attending Conference

Training Meetings/Meetings

Family Counsel

Regular Daddy/Daughter/Son Dates and Interviews

Each one of these is very important - however we have 24 hours in the day and not one of us is perfect, we have basic things that we have to do in order to enter the temple, and remain worthy of taking sacrament - after that its up to us to grow using some of the things in the above list and probably many I have forgotten and others can tell you about.

The Word of Wisdom is vitally important if you want the promises and blessings contained within the section - however have only met one or two that live it perfectly. And I have seen the promises completly fulfilled in them. However if I want the promises and blessing promised from keeping my journal or holding Family Home Evening that is where I need to put my work first.

We are in this progression thing for eternity and hopefully I will continue to grow more perfect and closer to my Heavenly Father

-Charley

[Aesa]

". I'm certain she can't say that doctrinally, and she seems to be a bit of an extremist to me, but I won't argue there is something to be said for abstaining from meat."

Genesis seems to allude that humans were vegans in the garden of eden.

Genesis 1:29 ¶ And God said, Behold, I have given you every herb bearing seed, which is upon the face of all the earth, and every tree, in the which is the fruit of a tree yielding seed; to you it shall be for meat.

That would lead me to conclude that this God would have veganism in his kingdom.

[Elgama]

". I'm certain she can't say that doctrinally, and she seems to be a bit of an extremist to me, but I won't argue there is something to be said for abstaining from meat."

Genesis seems to allude that humans were vegans in the garden of eden.

Genesis 1:29 ¶ And God said, Behold, I have given you every herb bearing seed, which is upon the face of all the earth, and every tree, in the which is the fruit of a tree yielding seed; to you it shall be for meat.

That would lead me to conclude that this God would have veganism in his kingdom.

yeah but presumably they also had a different metabolism - as they could not get sick and die, we can. I certainly found living a vegan diet (we did it when my daughter had an elimination diet) made me feel very ill - but if I have MS (which I probably do) that would make sense

-Charley

[bodhigirlsmiles]

What is the purpose of being a Vegetarianism? Just curious...

for myself, it is because the buddha taught that all sentient life must be respected and that we are not to kill anything willfully.

[bodhigirlsmiles]

As I stated, you need to start with the background on why the revelation was given:

Historical. The revelation known as the Word of Wisdom was received by the Prophet Joseph Smith on February 27, 1833, when the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints was not quite three years old. The young Prophet had received revelations from time to time, as occasion demanded, for the building and guidance of the Church that he had been commissioned to restore.

According to the custom of the day, a number of the early converts to the Church were users of tobacco. In fact, several who had been called into the higher councils of the Church had the tobacco habit. Some were accustomed also to the use of alcoholic beverages, chiefly such as were brewed by the people of the "pioneer fringe". There was little or no drunkenness. Coffee and tea were favorite family drinks when they could be secured. In the use of alcohol, tobacco, tea and coffee the early Church members were much like their pioneer neighbors, perhaps more temperate.

These habits did not seem to the Prophet to comport with the sacred nature of the work entrusted to and accepted by the Church. Especially did it seem out of keeping with the spirit of the occasion to have the odor of tobacco in the council rooms of the Priesthood. This was aggravated when, as occasionally happened, a tobacco chewer brought his "cud" into the council chamber. That explains the reference to the "council of high priests" in verse one of the revelation. It was the use of tobacco by this body of Priesthood that brought the matter to a head.

The practice of the Prophet was to lay before the Lord all questions that arose, and await answers. Such an appeal was made with respect to tobacco, and in due time the revelation called the Word of Wisdom was received. The inquiry may have been confined to tobacco; the response covered the whole field of food and drink. It was often so. A simple question was the beginning of a vast unfolding of truth.

While the inquiry was occasioned by experiences among the "council of high priests, assembled in Kirtland" and the answer directed in part to them, the revelation was also for "the church and the saints in Zion" and "all saints, who are or can be called saints," that is, for the Church everywhere. It was so interpreted by Joseph Smith and has been so taught by his successors

thank you. i had been curious for some time.

[MrNirom]

I think the people who probably live the word of wisdom the best.. and they are not Mormon.. are the Amerindians.

I have always admired their love for mother earth. They took what they needed... nothing more.. and did not waste. We white people had to be reminded from God what they already knew and lived.

[Elgama]

What is the purpose of being a Vegetarianism? Just curious...

For me although I do struggle to give up meat entirely especially when pregnant - Its seeing the way animals are treated, nothing is worse than seeing and hearing the cattle trucks go by knowing that its the animals last experience of the world. And because I would struggle to kill an animal myself I think its irresponsible to eat meat, between my husband and I we can do it - He can shoot and I can butcher that bit doesn't bother me, but actually I can't even kill a wasp or fly if I can get it out the window first and I remember feeling very guilty about all the headlice I killed after my family got infected - it had to be done but they were only doing what they are on Earth to do.

I may feel better if we had our own animals and transported them to slaughter ourselves.

-Charley

[NeuroTypical]

for myself, it is because the buddha taught that all sentient life must be respected and that we are not to kill anything willfully.

I can respect those beliefs. I do have a question though - what's your definition of "sentient life"? This isn't really a hidden attack, I know people have argued over this for centuries. I'm just interested in how a Buddhist defines it.

Thanks!

LM

[bodhigirlsmiles]

I can respect those beliefs. I do have a question though - what's your definition of "sentient life"? This isn't really a hidden attack, I know people have argued over this for centuries. I'm just interested in how a Buddhist defines it.

Thanks!

LM

wonderful question. people often ask me what i consider sentient. usually this is a discusstion that leads to, "well, if plants are sentient, and you take a vow not to willingly kill any sentient life, how then can you eat anything at all?" the key term here is "sentient". sentient means having senses. in the buddhist reckoning, sentient beings have these senses by which they are conscious of the universe:

- eyes

- nose

- Ears

- tongue

- body

- mind

when we think of plants, we can see that plants do not have any of the above senses by which they are conscious of the universe. therefore, to say that plants are sentient beings is not in accord with buddhist reckoning.

such teachings, however, do not state that plants are entirely unconscious. observe how the lotus opens and closes its petals at times when prompted by its environment. such examples are countless. having said this, such stimuli response on the part of plants is not to be equated with the system of consciousness based on division of sensory perception ascribed to sentient beings as explained according to buddhist exegesis.

we should treat plants with respect.

plants are the beings with the lowest consciousness.

many buddhists consider plants to be so-called "automata". the have 10,000s of reactions to certain situations, and because of this complexity it may seems that they are sentient, or even intelligent. certain studies explain that they are not able to learn new situations and reactions, and this may be a proof that they are not sentient and, therefore, will not be reborn.

i cannot recall a part in a sutra where the buddha said that plants are sentient. he always cautioned agains eating meat and taught to eat plants instead. - however, the buddha also said that we should consider every dharma (everything in the universe), also stones or plants, having the buddha-nature.

some buddhist traditions have allowed followers to consume meat when there was little alternative. my parents, for example, often ate meat when they lived in tibet as land conditions were such that little vegetation would grow. they had no choice (other than to starve). now that we live in the united states, we fully observe vegetarianism.

[Hemidakota]

Remember, even the lesser intelligent, who inherited the form of a flower, a rock, or insects [or others], would demand the same respect.

[Guest HEthePrimate]

In answer to your first question, the WoW does not forbid us to eat meat. Rather, it encourages us not to eat too much meat, focusing on grains, vegetables and fruits. We are also to avoid wasting food. That's what the scriptures say, but to be honest, we don't always follow them, and it seems to me the average Mormon's diet is probably indistinguishable from the average American's diet, except that we avoid alcohol, tea, and coffee.

The Word of Wisdom doesn't tell us we have to be vegetarians, but it doesn't prevent us from being vegetarians, either, and I've known a number of LDS vegetarians. The family of one of my LDS friends here in town leans that way. The husband avoids red meat, the wife seldom eats meat at all, the daughter is a strict vegetarian, and the son calls himself a "flexitarian"--that is, he is usually a vegetarian, but if he's with friends and they're having meat, he will too (to avoid inconveniencing them).

"Health in the navel and marrow in the bones" I simply interpret to mean the general blessings of good health.

Nice to meet you. There's a lot in Buddhism that I admire. :)

DH

Edited November 3, 2008 by HEthePrimate