When the kids are gone

[jolee65]

My youngest is leaving for college in 8 monthes and my husband and I dont seem to be getting along we argue over everything and its always over something small, how something sounded when said to just not seeing things the same as the other , Im thinking if we dont get it together soon i dont see me staying.

We divorced back in 2002 got back together in 2004 and remarried but the same problems remained it was mostly for the kids even though I do love him hes not the kind of man I would have thought I would have been with , we are very unlike one another in many ways.

He comes home from work and he doesnt take care of anything around the house that needs done, we have a pontoon last year he never did cover the boat it sat out in the snow all winter in mean this is a 15,000.00 boat the seats cracked carpet molded it was in bad shape. Thats just the tip of things to mention i have lost respect for him because he has been blessed with a good job and good wages but he doesnt take pride in the things that he has and I have said that to him , God blesses you with a good life and your not doing your part in maintaining what hes blessed you with and he will even agree but it doesnt kick in the attitude it should.

His main interest is politics and history so thats all he does read or watch videos theres no hobbies or friends of any kind he doesnt ever say this saturday lets do this or this saturday I want to get this done he could sit all 12 hrs and do nothing.

He never sets a plan in motion or has an opinion on anything unless its history or politics , He has a guy from church from his youth that came over to clean the furnace and he would ask David how should we do this or how should we do that davids responce was always I dont know so it got to the point to were Andy would say do you ever have an opinion, David was alittle shocked because I have said the same thing but I would say can you try to have a thought. I know this doesnt sound good but he has really put these feelings there and I have told him how I feel and he just blows me off .

He will not go to marriage counseling and I dont know if it would do any good anyway

I want to travel but he never has any ideas on what to do once you get there,lol. Im always in the for front of everything and i would like to have him in the drivers set once in while but nothing would ever get done.

I dont know what im going to do.

[BenRaines]

We have, wait had, no kids at home and it was almost like being newlywed again. My wife and I have been married for 33 years. We come from two different cultures, both are converts to the church in our teens. We are both very strong willed and have our own opinions. I enjoy the computer and football, she does email and that is it and can't stand football. She likes to sew and read, I like to read too. I like to eat whatever I want and she is very particular with her diet. I am the constant procrastinator, she is very organized and our house is show model perfect all the time.

The reason I said all that was to show that I believe many of us are very different from our spouse. Yen for the Yang type thing. If he won't take charge then you do. If he won't plan a trip but will go along then plan the trip. I think that would be much easier than fighting over who wants to go where and who wants to do what.

For all the challenges we have had in our marriage we have had one common goal and reminder of our marriage in the Manti temple. When we married we made covenants between each other and between our God. This is a three person partnership. When we think or talk about what we should do with our lives and how we should do it we think of what God would want us to do.

No kids at home and life could not be better.

If you have divorced and remarried and you are considering divorce again to be able to do the things you want to do with life I would say there are deeper issues.

Ben Raines

[jolee65]

I dont want a divorce but if my life is going to be constant arguing then what quality of life is that, I have planned our trips its just the lack of interest in everything he can do his reading and videos but have some interest in other people other then yourself, care about what im talking about even if its not your interest. Im building my own granite (tile) counters I prelay the tiles and I had them layed out I asked him to come and see how they looked and he said no im busy lol reading on the computer , not i'll be there in a minute just no.

Are resent blow up was about the heat on when leaving the house he wants to put it at 65 its 15 degrees outside I said it would take an hr to warm the house back up its to cold out he went into this you never agree with me your just a #$%^ I just stood there in shock so he went in town alone , its just small nonsence but it turns into this major fight.

[BenRaines]

First let me say that I didn't grow up in Utah or Idaho so I have lived in what is know to the Utahans as the mission field. I say that so that you know I don't live where people think that all is lovely.

It sounds like there are a few differences to our lives. One is that even when my wife and I disagree on things there are no voices raised and there is no profanity. That said there are many ways to hurt someone without profanity or raising your voice.

Is the computer in a public area of your house? I am not wishing to accuse anyone of anything but such dedication to a computer smells of pornography addiction.

As many can tell you from this site I spend a lot of time here but usually it is done with my wife and I sitting on the couch watching tv together while I am online.

Just from what you have shared it sounds like the two of you need to work on communication skills. From your OP you said that you had tried counseling but he won't, is that correct?

Oh and we keep our house at 65 in the winter. Not 15 degrees outside but 21. 65 degrees is the same if it is 15 outside or if it is 45 outside. :)

Ben Raines

Edited December 6, 2008 by BenRaines

[john doe]

I think you should see a marriage counselor. A professional who can help you get down to the real reasons why you are having problems.

[NeuroTypical]

If there's anything I've learned about making a marriage work, it's this: The more you gripe about the other person, the less better anything will get.

You control only one thing in your marriage - you. If you're looking for advice, here it is: Go take all the effort you're currently taking in figuring out and describing what's wrong with him, and go point it at yourself. If you need to focus on faults, focus solely on your own. Work on them and fix them.

Imagine a marriage where there are no "constant arguing" and "major fights", because you-jolee65 -refuse to argue or fight - you'll only discuss. Imagine a marriage where you find 3 compliments to pay your husband every day. You think any husband could endure 8 months of that without deciding to reciprocate in some positive way?

We all create our own destiny. If you don't ever get around to creating the kind of wife someone would be happily married to, don't be surprised if you end up with a husband who isn't happily married.

There's my free advice - take it for what it's worth or leave it.

LM

[jolee65]

Our computer is a lap top and hes always in the livingroom where our daughter is sitting , No he had that problem yrs ago he stopped that on his own. He even helped a guy at work with that problem hes over it. Yeah thats right he wouldnt (counseling)thats why I divorced him the first time we went after the divorce was final but it didnt work out so i know he wouldnt this time. We have done so much remodeling on this house the heating layout doesnt fit this house anymore wehave opened it up alot and theres not enough cold air exchange vents I have on a sweater, sweat paints and socks with slippers on and my feet are cold lol and its on 73.

The name calling is out of controll he has resently quite smoking and he refuses to admit that might have something to do with it but I know better.

[BenRaines]

Jolee, are you LDS? If so have you talked with your Bishop? If not LDS do you hav a clergy that you could talk to?

Remember the only things you can work on are the your things. You can't make anyone do something they don't want to do but you can do and or change things that you can for yourself.

Ben Raines

[jolee65]

If there's anything I've learned about making a marriage work, it's this: The more you gripe about the other person, the less better anything will get.

You control only one thing in your marriage - you. If you're looking for advice, here it is: Go take all the effort you're currently taking in figuring out and describing what's wrong with him, and go point it at yourself. If you need to focus on faults, focus solely on your own. Work on them and fix them.

Imagine a marriage where there are no "constant arguing" and "major fights", because you-jolee65 -refuse to argue or fight - you'll only discuss. Imagine a marriage where you find 3 compliments to pay your husband every day. You think any husband could endure 8 months of that without deciding to reciprocate in some positive way?

There's my free advice - take it for what it's worth or leave it.

LM

WOW, tell me what your really thinking I never said i didnt argue I said we are always arguing and it wasnt his faults it was our uncommon behaviors i care about my things and I have interest in others interest not just my own that is our differences.

You have a very different idea of what makes a happy marriage then I do.

(We all create our own destiny. If you don't ever get around to creating the kind of wife someone would be happily married to, don't be surprised if you end up with a husband who isn't happily married.)

So im the reason hes unhappy because thats what I just got from your sentence there

i have put a 110% into my life with him and our kids thank you very much.

Im so insulted I dont even know what to say, why would a person make a commit like that based on a small discription of a 24 yr relationship .

[jolee65]

Ok i just blow up sorry im not trying make him out to be this really bad person but our diffirences are getting harder to live with , I told him I think we needed to sell the boat so we dont have to worry about it anymore, he agreed and thats whats going to happen in the spring. We are LDS and its not something im willing to discuss with the bishop.

Edited December 6, 2008 by jolee65

[Elgama]

Jolee don't take this the wrong way but Loudmouth Mormon has actually typed a lot of wisdom, basically you cannot change your husband but you can change yourself, and there is a possiblity he may respond as a result... I know I don't have your marriage experience but Richard and I went through a rough time with his depression and my health problems and we had to fight to keep us going.,

I find if I am frustrated about my husband's time doing other things, then getting on with my own hobbies helps, have you any interests or hobbies outside of the home? I go to Speakers Club twice a week. If he is reading then I either read sitting next to him or get out a quilt to finish, read my scriptures etc, that way I am not feeling neglected I am occupied myself. He does the same with me. We also have a date night once a week. right now it is merely kids in bed early, nice meal, bath, TV together and bed. If he won't have a date night could you have a night where you pamper yourself and do things to make yourself feel good.

If you have good self esteem and are confident you are doing everything you can, then its easier to decide whether to stay or go.

-Charley

[john doe]

You can't control your husband. All you can control is yourself. Be the best wife to him that you can be, that's all anyone can ask. Marriage isn't 50%-50%, it's 100%-100%.

[jolee65]

Jolee don't take this the wrong way but Loudmouth Mormon has actually typed a lot of wisdom, basically you cannot change your husband but you can change yourself, and there is a possiblity he may respond as a result... I know I don't have your marriage experience but Richard and I went through a rough time with his depression and my health problems and we had to fight to keep us going.,

I find if I am frustrated about my husband's time doing other things, then getting on with my own hobbies helps, have you any interests or hobbies outside of the home? I go to Speakers Club twice a week. If he is reading then I either read sitting next to him or get out a quilt to finish, read my scriptures etc, that way I am not feeling neglected I am occupied myself. He does the same with me. We also have a date night once a week. right now it is merely kids in bed early, nice meal, bath, TV together and bed. If he won't have a date night could you have a night where you pamper yourself and do things to make yourself feel good.

If you have good self esteem and are confident you are doing everything you can, then its easier to decide whether to stay or go.

-Charley

I guess I need to be honest he did just stop smoking but it was pot and he has had this problem for along time he doesnt hold a calling or attend preisthood meetings but he is trying to get back into the church and church standards hes taking alot of this withdrawl out on me and i am a strong confident women so i have a hard time standing by and having someone pick apart every word that comes out of my mouth so he can have that blast of anger come flying out and then hes ok again for awhile.

But its always something, he smokes, nothing gets done he doesnt hes hard to live with and now you know why he cant muster a thought or an opinion. theres no happy medium its one extream or the next theres even times i want him to smoke so i can get some relief from his nastiness. but then hes really lazy and that botheres me too.

Ok there it is and i hate the fact that I said that about him and that it makes him look bad , i guess i was kind of protecting him from peoples judgment its ok if i say these things but not anyone else.

Edited December 6, 2008 by jolee65

[Elgama]

I guess I need to be honest he did just stop smoking but it was pot and he has had this problem for along time he doesnt hold a calling or attend preisthood meetings but he is trying to get back into the church and church standards hes taking alot of this withdrawl out on me and i am a strong confident women so i have a hard time standing by and having someone pick apart every word that comes out of my mouth so he can have that blast of anger come flying out and then hes ok again for awhile.

But its always something, he smokes, nothing gets done he doesnt hes hard to live with and now you know why he cant muster a thought or an opinion. theres no happy medium its one extream or the next theres even times i want him to smoke so i can get some relief from his nastiness. but then hes really lazy and that botheres me too.

Ok there it is and i hate the fact that I said that about him and that it makes him look bad , i guess i was kind of protecting him from peoples judgment its ok if i say these things but not anyone else.

I completely understand when Richard went through his depression I protected him, remember a horrible interview with the Stake President where I got blamed for our none church attendance, it wasn't entirely down to me I was struggling at the time but Richard couldn't cope, he was barely out of bed before 3pm sometimes, not helping with the baby etc, I told people he was working at our business when he wasn't. We now laugh about it and refer to it as his Rip Van Winkle phase (he took to his bed and his hair grew lol)

Things came to a head one night and I said to him he had an hour and half to convince me he loved me, and our marriage was worth fighing for or I was taking the next bus out, The panic in his eyes and upset was what I needed, I had, had a year with very little love he had gone of anythng physical, he never remembered my birthday (he still doesn't lol but it is less important now I know he loves me), it was also the turning point for him, he knew he had to change things or our marriage was over. I needed to stop protecting him so much and start letting him sort himself out.

I am now incredibly proud of him, he has held down a job for over a year now, for 6 months of it he cycled 8 miles a day, and spent 1hr on a bus because we couldn't afford a car, and he helps with the kids, does his best to understand my illness and is back to protecting me like he used to before his long sleep:) Our marriage was worth fighting for, but I needed to fight and I wasn't I was lying down and taking everything he threw at me. It took a long time for me to get to the point when I was very serious about leaving if I didn't get a glimour of hope, I didn't want to I still adored him, but it was the right thing to do.

But I have also needed to make huge changes to my personality one thing that contributed to his depression was me changing from a strong and very confident person to someone very clingy, I needed to get past that so he could go to work and get his self esteem back. I have a lot of friends who say he was lucky I stuck by him, but I took him on in sickness and in health and he deals with my illness.

It sounds like your husband is trying hard to sort himself out, and withdrawl does take time. I hope it goes well for you and my ramble is of some use at same time when he is calm maybe you should agree to when he starts you walk away rather than take it

-Charley

[BenRaines]

My brother smokes pot regularly along with alcohol, can't hold a job and has little extra energy other than to chat online with people about how miserable his life is and if he could just catch a break.

I believe we make our own breaks.

Thanks for confirming that drugs do hamper life and relationships.

Ben Raines

[FunkyTown]

Ok i just blow up sorry im not trying make him out to be this really bad person but our diffirences are getting harder to live with , I told him I think we needed to sell the boat so we dont have to worry about it anymore, he agreed and thats whats going to happen in the spring. We are LDS and its not something im willing to discuss with the bishop.

To be fair... You did log in here and ask for advice. If I were to guess based on what you're saying, you want him to be a 'take charge' type of person, correct?

And he is not, in any way shape or form, an 'alpha male' who makes decisions and sticks by it.

If you were to be honest, based on what I've read, your complaints are twofold:

1) Your husband doesn't have an opinion and just agrees to go along al the time.

2) Your husband doesn't take care of the house and, when you bring it up, he agrees and then just doesn't do anything about it.

If those are the major problems, then you have to ask yourself this question:

Would I be happy with a guy who had a strong opinion and absolutely refused to give in to mine?

If I were to be honest, it sounds like you're bored with the marriage and looking to blow off steam. I understand that - He doesn't have an opinion, he doesn't seem to care. It's hard to keep passion alive in a relationship like that.

If that's the case, then be honest with yourself: Say "I want to divorce this man because I'm bored with him. The boredom is constantly irritating me, so I must leave him."

Frankly, I don't think that's a reason to leave someone, but if you're going to do it, then be honest.

[jolee65]

To be fair... You did log in here and ask for advice. If I were to guess based on what you're saying, you want him to be a 'take charge' type of person, correct?

And he is not, in any way shape or form, an 'alpha male' who makes decisions and sticks by it.

If you were to be honest, based on what I've read, your complaints are twofold:

1) Your husband doesn't have an opinion and just agrees to go along al the time.

2) Your husband doesn't take care of the house and, when you bring it up, he agrees and then just doesn't do anything about it.

If those are the major problems, then you have to ask yourself this question:

Would I be happy with a guy who had a strong opinion and absolutely refused to give in to mine?

If I were to be honest, it sounds like you're bored with the marriage and looking to blow off steam. I understand that - He doesn't have an opinion, he doesn't seem to care. It's hard to keep passion alive in a relationship like that.

If that's the case, then be honest with yourself: Say "I want to divorce this man because I'm bored with him. The boredom is constantly irritating me, so I must leave him."

Frankly, I don't think that's a reason to leave someone, but if you're going to do it, then be honest.

I did mention the other reason you must have missed it.

[jolee65]

we had went to dinner tonite and I told him how I felt about being the one always in charge and on guard protecting the wall so to speak he said i think you like it I told him he was wrong and I dont like that im the one thats watching out for everything I have been in this position so long i dont know if i could trust him enough to let go he blows me off if asked to do the simples of things, and I end up doing it he listened but in the end his responce was well if you dont want to be with me then leave and I know he doesnt want me too but its him feeling defensive , I said why so you can take it to another relationship and she not knowing what to come thinks your the one steering the ship and finds out no one is and everything is falling down around you.

I told him a persons life needs to be maintained a life doesnt live itself you have to make it happen.

and all he says is yeah, and ive heard that before.

So if you think that I want a man that sits back and is just along for the ride that your mistaken , I have had relationships growing up and they all were the alpha dog and that was just fine.

He is a good provider and makes good money but thats were it ends, also smoking pot is all he does no drinking.

[Alaskagain]

If you are both working at becoming more active and living church standards, then you are walking in the right direction. Your husband deserves praise for giving up his addiction to pot. You have stuck it out this long, why give up now? Is it not true that when you grow the most weary, you are closest to a great reward? You may find great joy just around the corner.

Having a husband who likes to read and watch movies a lot, and thinks very little about temporal/maintenance type issues, and recently becoming empty-nesters, this is very familiar to me.

He forgets my birthday. One year, I just didn't mention it at all. The kids were old enough to keep a secret, and the next day, I baked myself a small cake and we had it at lunch. By the time he got a slice of it for that night's dessert, it was just a cake, and then two weeks later, he realized he had forgot. About the 10th day, I did start getting a bit upset, but still kept silent. I just wanted to see how long it would take.

I have to tell him it's time to change the furnace filter, or add salt to the water softener, or that the back step needs repaired or whatever else should be obvious or routine maintenance. He never puts the lawn mower back. But in all these things, I just mention it once, in a normal voice, in a regular conversation - oh, it's time to add salt, etc. I do not nag. If he hasn't done something by the third day, I just do it myself. If it's something I can't do by myself, I will ask him to help me. And I figure if it's something I can't do myself, then he probably can't either, so when he says "Oh, I was supposed to do that!", I hang around the vicinity to see if I can assist. I hang around to help, not to see if he is doing the task.

So when yours is reading, what is he reading? Mystery novels or church magazines? What kind of movies does he watch? How about a church video or DVD? Reading wholesome books and watching good movies will strengthen his resolve to live church standards. Try making a snack or popcorn, and sit down with him to watch a movie, even if it is not church related, it lets him know you want to spend some time with him. Try reading scriptures out loud together. Or read scriptures yourself at night, and (when he is not in the middle of a movie) say "Listen to this, it made me feel awesome", and then read out loud your favorite scripture and see if he will turn it into a conversation. Maybe he won't, but at least you have vocalized a spiritual thought with him, and will help bring you closer to each other.

Mine spends a lot of time taking missionaries out. And that helps me accept a lot of his "faults". So I would encourage both of you to assist your local missionaries in whatever capacity you can - it brings great blessings to your home life. It's like I have to be the one to take care of all the temporal stuff, make the plans, be the secretary, maintenance overseer, travel agent, and manager, etc, but he does the spiritual work. (Not that I don't do my personal scripture study, etc.)

I hope some of this is helpful to you, and pray for blessings of comfort for you! I know it is not easy.

Edited December 7, 2008 by Alaskagain

[skalenfehl]

I've been married now 17 years and as an adoptive parent with two boys on their own and almost an empty house again, it's kind of weird how my wife and I are as close as ever, though as independent as we were when we first married...me in front of a screen or working out or doing my own thing and her in the sewing room or doing her own thing. We've settled into our grooves, have our date nights, etc.

We seldom to never ever fight and that is because we have learned to look inwardly. Early on in our marriage when she wanted to fight and blow things out of proportion (at least in my mind), I just sat there for the most part and listened and agreed until she had nothing left to gripe about. It completely disarmed her. She came to realize what I already knew. It wasn't worth the effort to get all worked up over something that could be worked out.

I also had to realize that many things really were my fault. I agree with the above post that says we have to look at our own selves first. If I have a problem with my wife or my marriage, then it is my problem and I need to work it out. The solution must first begin with me before I am prepared to discuss it with her. A marriage is a partnership and when a couple realizes fully that they are on the same side, then they can, in effect, step on the same side of the line and pull together through trials and tribulations rather than play tug of war amidst their trials and tribulations.

Oh by the way, my thermostat is at 67. If I'm cold I just put on an extra shirt or a sweatshirt. It's easier on the gas bill.

[jolee65]

We do read scripture out loud and his movies are political or historical, thats his interest and he enjoys it and I do watch them with him from time to time , I guess im tired and I dont want to deal with it anymore but im strong and I will continue pushing forward but sometimes I forget why.

[Alaskagain]

. . . I guess im tired and I dont want to deal with it anymore but im strong and I will continue pushing forward but sometimes I forget why.

That is great to hear! You are turning that corner.

We all get tired. You are not alone in this. Get some rest. That may mean physical rest - if you are doing too much, slow down and do less, make sure you get enough sleep. It may mean emotional rest - if you are finding yourself living with inner turmoil, do things that bring you peace. A few moments of quiet private time in prayer, meditation, or self-affirming thoughts may help.

And please remember WHY.

If he doesn't have an opinion on anything else in the world, isn't his opinion of YOU the most important one that he holds? And you are wondering if he really loves you, because of his lackadaisical personality, then consider this. He told you, if you are not happy, then why don't you leave? Maybe he wonders if you really love him, because after all, you actually are thinking about leaving. So now that you have committed yourself to continuing to push forward, let him know that you are not going to leave and that you do love him, you just get frustrated or overwhelmed or whatever other thing you are feeling.

Sit down with your photo albums or just remember the day you married your husband (both times). Remember how you felt. Call upon those feelings to be with you now. You stated that the second time was 'for the kids'. That shows how important your children and family are to you -and to him. You didn't just remarry him. He remarried you.

[by the way, how did the granite tiles turn out? I bet they look fantastic!]

[Elgama]

could you manage to go away either just yourself or together? somewhere where you just spend time together.

-Charley

[pushka]

Maybe a compromise, to begin with, would help..perhaps arrange a surprise holiday for you both, to a place of particular political or historical interest to your husband? It may make him feel a little more secure and appreciative of your efforts?

[BenRaines]

Did your husband have these same interests when you married? Has he always been interested in history and politics? If not what were his interests when you first met some 18 years ago? Have his interests changed or you have just gotten tired of them no matter what they are?

I do not enjoy doing yard work, my wife does. I keep the lawn mowed and the leaves gone. She trims the bushes, plants the flowers and bulbs. I have no interest in it. I will go and buy the flowers, I don't pick them out but I go along with her because that is what she wants to do. I carry them, pay for them, put the flats out in the yard and she plants them. Very different interests but working together. I will watch football while she plants. She is fine with that and so am I.

After 33 years we have learned to accept each other for who we are and not try to change each other. If she wants to go to the mall, I don't. I drive her there, take a book and hang out in the food court reading and watching people while she shops and has a dropoff point for her purchases. That is getting along. I would rather be reading at home but that is my compromise, hers is she shops but doesn't have to drive and fight traffic and we do it together.

Ben Raines