Satan and the final judgement

[Traveler]

I am wondering what posters - LDS and non-LDS believe to be the role and function of Satan (if any) at the final judgement when all are brought before G-d.

The Traveler

[Hemidakota]

None at all... yet, there is going to be some assistance on judging others of this earth, along with GOD and the Savior. Adding references from Burton's book of collected quotes:

Judgment on Earth to Some Extent Is Given Into the Hands of Certain Priesthood Leaders.

Charles W. Penrose

But judgment, to a great extent, is given into the hands of certain quorums and councils in this Church. One body to exercise judgment is the bishopric, the bishopric of a ward are appointed and ordained to be judges. A bishop is a common judge in Israel to sit with his counselors in judgment upon transgressors and upon those whose difficulties cannot be settled by the teachers who visit them in their homes. . . .

So when we are called upon to sit in judgment, either in a bishop's court or in a high council (to which the bishop's court may be appealed), if we are members of the high council, just remember what the Lord has said concerning such quorum or council. Every decision of these quorums that are organized must be given in justice, in righteousness, in equity, in fear of the Lord, and with the desire to do what is right, not out of personal feeling. [see D&C 102:16.] Personal feelings ought to be banished from our souls when we sit in judgment having the right to sit in judgment. CR1916Oct:21-22

President Joseph F. Smith

Out of the things which have been written in the books, this people shall be judged, according to their works. The Lord shall make a record also, and out of that shall the whole world be judged. And you men of the holy Priesthood-you Apostles, Presidents, Bishops and High Priests in Zion-will be called upon to be the judge of the people. Therefore, it is expected that you shall set the standard for them to attain to, and see that they shall live according to the spirit of the Gospel, do their duty, and keep the commandments of the Lord. You shall make a record of their acts. You shall record when they are baptized, when they are confirmed, and when they receive the Holy Ghost by the laying on of hands. . . . You shall write their works . . . but we shall judge the people, first requiring them to do their duty. CR1901Apr:72

Joseph Smith

And verily in this thing ye have done wisely, for it is required of the Lord, at the hand of every steward, to render an account of his stewardship, both in time and in eternity.

4. For he who is faithful and wise in time is accounted worthy to inherit the mansions prepared for him of my Father. . . .

16. And now, verily I say unto you, that as every elder in this part of the vineyard must give an account of his stewardship unto the bishop in this part of the vineyard- (Revelation received at an assemblage of elders and members, Dec. 4, 1831) D&C 72:3-4,16

Elder Harold B. Lee

Acts that may affect your standing in the Church, or your right to privileges or advancement in the Church, are to be promptly confessed to the bishop whom the Lord has appointed as a shepherd over every flock and commissioned to be a common judge in Israel. He may hear such confession in secret and deal justly and mercifully, as each case warrants. (Decisions for Successful Living, p. 99) TLDP:551

Elder Harold B. Lee

I was in a stake conference recently where one of the bishops frankly stated that he had determined that he would never excommunicate any person no matter what the sin. I told him that if this was his true feeling, then he was in the wrong position-as a common judge in Israel. . . . When we let members lead a double and destructive life, instead of doing them a favor as we suppose, we damage them, sometimes, irreparably. We must let the light of gospel standards shine fully, and not try to deflect the penetrating rays of its standards. The gospel is to save men, not to condemn them, but to save it is sometimes necessary to confront and to discipline as the Lord has directed us. When individuals are on the wrong path, our task is to redirect them lovingly, and not to watch idly from our vantage point on the straight and narrow path. (Address given at Regional Representatives' seminar, Oct. 1/2, 1969, pp. 11-12) TLDP:81

(2) Judgment After Death

[Just_A_Guy]

I think it's the Book of Jude that alludes to Michael disputing with Satan about the body of Moses, which I believe alludes to an old story that when Moses was about to be translated Satan stepped in and objected (because Moses had killed a man).

I don't look at the Final Judgment as an extremely formal process. But if it is, I think it's conceivable that Satan might serve some kind of accusatory role.

[Hemidakota]

Elder Bruce R. McConkie book, 'Doctrinal New Testament Commentary Volume-3, talked about this subject;

"Michael Disputed About Body of Moses"

What is mighty Michael doing disputing with the devil over the body of Moses? Why does the foremost (under Christ) of all the sons of God contend about the passing of a prophet from this scene of action? That he did so, Jude tells us-parenthetically, almost casually-in the course of a severe and near merciless castigation of false teachers in the Church.

If the adulterers and sexual perverts of Sodom and Gomorrah suffer the vengeance of eternal fire, Jude says, why should these filthy dreamers who defile the truth think to escape? In their ignorance, as brute beasts, they corrupt the course of nature. They are condemned with Cain who slew Abel (Gen. 4:1-15), with Balaam who divined for hire (Num. 22, 23 and 2 4), and with Korah and his band who were slain for their rebellion against Moses and Aaron. (Num. 16.) And yet with it all, no railing accusations are intended, for even the archangel left condemnation to the Lord, as witness the affair about the body of Israel's lawgiver.

What then was this dispute between Michael and Satan all about? As it happens, this is our only scriptural allusion to it, although it seems perfectly clear that Jude had before him some other scriptures bearing on the point. Its use as an illustration here is manifestly intended to clarify rather than confuse the doctrine being taught, and the facts relative thereto must have been known to and understood by the saints of that day.

Commentators assume, and it surely must have been so, that Jude had before him and was quoting from a then current apocryphal book, "The Assumption of Moses," which has been preserved to us in fragmentary form only. This non-canonical work presents the doctrine that Moses was translated and taken up into heaven without tasting death. It appears to deal "with certain revelations made by Moses," and "with his disappearance in a cloud, so that his death was hid from human sight... Michael was commissioned to bury Moses. Satan opposed the burial on the ground (a) that he was the lord of matter and that accordingly the body should be rightfully handed over to him; (b) that Moses was a murderer, having slain the Egyptian. Michael having rebutted Satan's accusations proceeded to charge Satan with having instigated the serpent to tempt Eve. Finally, all opposition having been overcome, the assumption took place in the presence of Joshua and Caleb." Another "Hebrew Apocalypse tells of Moses' transformation into the form of a fiery angel and his ascent through the seven heavens." And yet another deals "with the temporary translation of Moses before his death into heaven... When translated into heaven the heavenly Jerusalem and the Temple were revealed to him, and he was told these would descend to earth after God had gathered Israel a second time from the ends of the earth." Included in these same works are a number of statements not found in the Bible but known by revelation through Joseph Smith to be true, as the fact of a pre-existence for all men and that "Moses was prepared from the foundation of the world to be the mediator of God's covenant with his people," and that "during his 'life Moses was Israel's intercessor with God." (R. H. Charles, The Apocrypha and Pseudepigrapha of the Old Testament, vol. 2, pp. 407-413.)

That Moses was in fact translated is confirmed by President Joseph Fielding Smith. After quoting, from the Prophet Joseph Smith, these words: "The Savior, Moses, and Elias [Elijah, in other words] gave the keys to Peter, James, and John, on the Mount when they were transfigured before him," President Smith says: "From that we understand why Elijah and Moses were preserved from death: because they had a mission to perform, and it had to be performed before the crucifixion of the Son of God, and it could not be done in the spirit. They had to have tangible bodies. Christ is the firstfruits of the resurrection; therefore if any former prophets had a work to perform preparatory to the mission of the Son of God, or to the dispensation of the meridian of times, it was essential that they be preserved to fulfill that mission in the flesh. For that reason Moses disappeared from among the people and was taken up into the mountain, and the people thought he was buried by the Lord. The Lord preserved him, so that he could come at the proper time and restore his keys, on the heads of Peter, James, and John, who stood at the head of the dispensation of the meridian of time. He reserved Elijah from death that he might also come and bestow his keys upon the heads of Peter, James, and John and prepare them for their ministry.

"But, one says, the Lord could have waited until after his resurrection, and then they could have done it. It is quite evident, due to the fact that it did so occur, that it had to be done before; and there was a reason. There may have been other reasons, but that is one reason why Moses and Elijah did not suffer death in the flesh, like other men do." (Joseph Fielding Smith, Doctrines of Salvation, vol. 2, pp. 110-111.)

"Moses, Elijah, and Alma the younger, were translated. The Old Testament account that Moses died and was buried by the hand of the Lord in an unknown grave is an error. (Deut. 34:5-7.) It is true that he may have been 'buried by the hand of the Lord,' if that expression is a figure of speech which means that he was translated. But the Book of Mormon account, in recording that Alma 'was taken up by the Spirit,' says, 'the scriptures saith the Lord took Moses unto himself; and we suppose that he has also received Alma in the spirit, unto himself.' (Alma 45:18-19.) It should be remembered that the Nephites had the Brass Plates, and that they were the 'scriptures' which gave the account of Moses being taken by way of translation. As to Elijah, the account of his being taken in 'a chariot of fire . . . by a whirlwind into heaven,' is majestically set out in the Old Testament. (2 Kings 2.)" (Mormon Doctrine, 2nd ed., p. 805.)

It appears, then, that Satan-ever anxious to thwart the purposes of God-"disputed about the body of Moses," meaning that he sought the mortal death of Israel's lawgiver so that he would not have a tangible body in which to come-along with Elijah, who also was taken up without tasting death-to confer the keys of the priesthood upon Peter, James, and John.

[Misshalfway]

Satan? At the final judgement? It was my understanding that the final judgment will be between me and God the Father and the mediator of all of us the Savior. It wouldn't surprise me if Satan wants to be there considering his efforts to take over God's job, but I don't think he will be involved. I think he will be busy being banished to outer darkness. ..... as if his testimony could be trusted.....LOL.

[Traveler]

Let me clarify something: Satan is one of the Cherubum that cover. This refers to the two Cherubum associated with the ark of the covenant. According to scripture the Cherubum are at the "mercy seat" which, I believe, is symbolic of the judgement of G-d. My question is - Why is Satan there at the "left hand" of G-d?

The Traveler

[Hemidakota]

Satan will not be there as part of the final judgment. His fate, along with those spirits accepted him as there leader, including the sons/daughters of perdition who received the second comforter, will cowardly accept there fate in ‘hell’ until it is paid in full and then disassembled back to chaos.

Now what I am going to part with is something that most do not understand about with I term, “The Council of Seven”, which I did speak briefly before.

Reference is again made to the "seven angels" who minister before the throne of the Son of God, reflecting upon the account of the particular work which they will be related to during and following the millennial period of one thousand years. The same "seven angels," at a future time closely associated with the final judgment of all men before the "great white throne" of God, [Rev 20:11-12] are to be instrumental in the opening of the book of the "seven seals" that will reveal "the secret acts of men and the mighty works of God" in each of the seven thousand years of the earth-life or mortal existence of man. [D&C 88:108-110] At this time of exposure, shown in panoramic retrospect, there will be "nothing covered, that shall not be revealed; that which has been spoken in darkness shall be heard in the light." [Luke 12:2-3; Matthew 12:36, 10:26] Before the eyes of all men will be seen the re-enactment of the work of God the Father to bring to pass the immortality and eternal life of his spirit children. The manner in which the earth was organized by the Gods as a dwelling place for the mortal existence of man will be made known. [D&C 101:32-33.]

It will require some reading, pondering, and seek an answer to what John witnessed and what I believe stand at the throne of GOD and His Beloved Son.

[Hemidakota]

Joseph Fielding Smith, Answers to Gospel Questions v2 (J. Smith) , "Cherubim Seraphim and Angels", it reads;

Question: "I am somewhat confused in regard to the difference between cherubim and seraphim and angels, as recorded in the Bible. Who and what are the cherubim and seraphim mentioned in the Old Testament?"

Answer: These are terms that are sometimes applied to angels. The Lord set cherubim, according to the Hebrew Ha-Kerubim, to guard the way to the tree of life, when Adam and Eve were driven out of the Garden of Eden. There is no doubt that these were heavenly beings, or angels, as the plural form is used. However, down through the years this has been a mystery. Dr. Adam Clark in his Commentary says in speaking of the cherubim:

But what are these? They are utterly unknown, conjectures and guessers relative to their nature and properties are endless. What these were we cannot distinctly say, it is generally supposed, that a cherub was a creature with four heads and one body; and the animals of which these emblematical forms consisted were the noblest of their kind. The lion among the wild beasts; the bull, among the tame; the eagle, among the birds and man at the head of all.

According to dictionary definitions which have come to us through the ages of apostasy, there is a prevailing notion that angels are superior beings to human beings. A seraph is an angel of the highest order and cherub denotes "(1) a beautiful child or infant, one of the order of angelic beings ranking second to the seraphim in the celestial hierarchy, and held to excel in knowledge. The archangel holds highest rank."

The simple truth gathered from modern revelation is that these beings that guarded the way to the tree of life were angels. Evidently faithful personages belonging to this world who had not, at the time, received the privilege of partaking of mortality, for the Lord revealed to the Prophet Joseph Smith that "there are no angels who minister to this earth but those who do belong to it." (D. & C. l30:5.)

Cherubim As Symbolic Figures

The cherubim on the Ark of the Covenant were placed there as symbolic figures, representing guardians, whose wings protected the altar. These, like the figures seen by Ezekiel, were symbolic, not necessarily living beings, and by them the Lord was teaching Ezekiel a lesson in relation to his mission to Israel. The same is true in relation to the several beasts seen by the Revelator John. All of these visions by symbolic representation had something to do with history which the Lord was revealing, the full meaning of which has not been made clear to our understanding.

Just when the notion arose that angels have wings may not be very clear. There is a prevailing idea today, which arose during the centuries of apostasy, that angels are superior to human beings in their nature-in fact, that they belong to an entirely distinct and different race. Angels are ministering servants who carry messages from our Eternal Father and his Son Jesus Christ. All angels coming to Adam after the fall were spirits belonging to this earth who had not yet obtained bodies of flesh and bones. After men had been translated as was Enoch, they, as translated beings, could and did come to minister unto the prophets. Thus it could have been a translated being who was sent to Jacob and with whom he wrestled. That he wrestled with the Lord is an untenable notion. (See Answers to Gospel Questions, Vol. 1, pp. 163-168.)

Speaking of angels, the Prophet Joseph Smith has revealed the following:

There are two kinds of beings in heaven, namely: Angels, who are resurrected personages, having bodies of flesh and bones-

For instance, Jesus said: Handle me and see, for a spirit hath not flesh and bones as ye see me have.

Secondly: The spirits of just men made perfect, they who are not resurrected, but inherit the same glory. (D. & C. 129:1-3.)

[Hemidakota]

Let me clarify something: Satan is one of the Cherubum that cover. This refers to the two Cherubum associated with the ark of the covenant. According to scripture the Cherubum are at the "mercy seat" which, I believe, is symbolic of the judgement of G-d. My question is - Why is Satan there at the "left hand" of G-d?

The Traveler

Donald W. Parry and Joseph Fielding McConkie made an attempt in explaining symbolism in the scripture [Guide to Scriptural Symbols],

Cherubim. Cherubim are angels. In the Garden of Eden, cherubim were placed to guard the tree of life, so that fallen man would not partake of the fruit of the tree (Gen. 3:24; Alma 49.:2-3 Huge cherubim of gold were placed on either side of the throne of Jehovah in the Holy of Holies (Ex. 25:18-22; 1 Sam. 4:4: 2 Sam. 6:2). Symbolic likenesses of cherubim were embroidered into the veil of the tabernacle (Ex. 26:31) and carved into the walls, doors, and panels of the temple (1 Kgs. 6:29-35; 7:29, 36). In the future temple of Ezekiel will also be found images of cherubim (Ezek. 41:18-25).

In angelic hierarchy, the role of cherubim is to guard the path which leads to Deity's presence. They are sentinels, so to speak, "The cherubim are obviously so stationed" in these various places, then, "to see that the holiness of God is not violated by those in transgression or those who have not complied with the proper rituals (see D&C 132:19)." (Joseph Fielding McConkie, Gospel Symbolism, p. 256.) At times cherubim are depicted as animals (Ezek. 1, 10). This personifies their role as monitors and watchmen of the sacred things of God.

If that is the case, I don't see where Satan [a.k.a Lucifer], was a Cherubim. I know that Cheribums are sentient beings but more or less, guardians.

[Justice]

If Satan is at the judgment, he will be there to be judged, not to have part in accusing us. However, I believe that with the mortal probabtion period over, the fact that he does not have a body stands as proof, not evidence or witness, of his lack of repentance.

The scriptures say the books will be opened, and we will be brought to a bright recolection of all our guilt (sins or bad deeds).

If you read Alma 12 and 13 (and maybe 14) you will see that judgment isn't meant to be a place where we go to get condemned, all men are already condemned. We go to judgment to receive mercy by and through the grace of Christ, the Great Mediator of all those who believe in and serve Him.

If you are not extended mercy then justice will make the claim it had on you because of what you did, not because of what Christ did or did not do, or not because of what Satan says about you. Christ is trying to reclaim you, not condemn you. Satan does not need to be there to condemn anyone, we have all done that on our own.

[Hemidakota]

Last one to be judge are those who have received the Second Comforter but did not fully repent in this life.