is mormon culture "doctrinal"?

[joheri]

But it´s in the scriptures. Why was it necessary once but not any more?

[Bethie]

I love the Mormon culture too!

It seems funny to me when someone says, "Oh you're Mormon, you can't do anything."

I think we have more FUN than anyone else!!!

[Wingnut]

But it´s in the scriptures. Why was it necessary once but not any more?

With large congregations, it can be disruptive. The priest administering the Sacrament kneels and acts as voice for the congregation. That is adequate.

[ozzy]

To the OP:

Sure its possible to escape 'mormon culture' and still be a good mormon. I will go so far as to say that it is possible to drink caffeinated beverages and watch R rated movies and still be a good mormon. I won't say those are the best ideas, but you can still be a good mormon. I don't personally mind most of mormon culture. There are two main things that bug me most, one being part of mormon culture and the other being the opposite of mormon culture. The first is present when individuals are so entrenched in mormon culture that they spend all of their time nitpicking how they live and, more importantly, how others live. The other is when individuals are so bent on avoiding mormon culture that they actively work to tear down the morals of those around them to what they consider to be the right level. I don't mean those who correct the radical nitpickers, I mean those who even try to break down those who are only living the basics.

[Just_A_Guy]

But it´s in the scriptures. Why was it necessary once but not any more?

Maybe because for the first twenty years after that scripture was given, Sacrament meetings were typically held out-of-doors?

[bytor2112]

The misandry usually comes in the form of, "the men hold the priesthood because it's the only way they'll make it to heaven." As far as I can tell, this is a weak attempt at trying to reconcile the withholding of priesthood authority from women by the age-old classic argument "It isn't you, it's me."

It's as false and foolish to believe that men hold priesthood authority because they are worse than women as it is to believe that women aren't as good as men because they don't hold the priesthood.

Other such examples of misandry include implications that the men are good for loading/unloading trucks while the women are good at making the families feel welcome. There are other examples, but the short of it is that both men and women should be good at all of these things.

But Mormon culture has come to accept misandry as a form of penance for not extending the priesthood to women--an extremely foolish culturalism in the light of pure doctrine.

Misandry is a pretty tough word....don't you think? Is it misogynistic to believe that the male sex is usually stronger than the female sex and perhaps more suited for physical labor such as un-loading trucks? With or without the Priesthood or in or outside of the LDS faith these views are prevelant and largely acceptable.

I get what your saying though......but it's not as much a Mormon thing as it has become popular to portray males as inept dunces....like portraying blondes as ditzy sex symbols.

[volgadon]

But it´s in the scriptures. Why was it necessary once but not any more?

Where does it say that kneeling was necessary? All Moroni says is that they knelt with the church. It was the practice and custom of the day, not a necessary part of the sacrament.

[lizzy12]

only to those who live that culture.

The culture is meant to "enforce" or make the doctrine easier to live.

Ex. Law of chastity is Doctrine

Don't date before 16, group dates, dancing a "book of Mormon apart" (do they still do that?)

Is culture meant to reinforce the doctrine. Many times people confuse the 2 and if they live the culture like doctrine they will teach it as such.

But going on a date a 15 is not a violation of doctrine.

Anything the prophet says can be considered doctrine right?...so wouldn't dating before your 16 be a violation of doctrine?

And, do we need to repent for non doctrine sins?

[lizzy12]

In my ward the YW have the bigger budget yet the Young Men go out for ice cream every tuesday after their planned activity...then they ask to borrow from us (using our money for joint activities their in charge of). That bugs me a lot.

And in my ward the youth speaker is always last regardless of the gender.

[Dravin]

And, do we need to repent for non doctrine sins?

What on earth is a non-doctrine sin? I'm having a hard time thinking of something that is fully in compliance with the doctrines of Christ but is somehow a sin.

[Suzie]

I think he means mormon culturalisms. Some things that come to mind off the top of my head (not all of these are current practices)

• Only men give the closing prayer in Sacrament meeting
• A priesthood holder always gives the concluding remarks in Sacrament meeting
• Conservative politics--some examples that I've heard
  • "No good mormon can be a democrat"
  • Interpreting "Associating with groups whose teachings are contrary to the gospel" (temple recommend question) as a vote for the democratic party
  • "People who vote against Prop 8 should lose their temple recommend." (that was someone in my ward)
• Young Men's budgets more than double the size of Young Women's budgets
• Misandry
• Always home teaching on Sunday

I'm sure there are others. And yes, it is very possible to be a good member of the Church and escape mormon culture. In fact, I'd submit that those who escape mormon culture make better members of the Church than those that do not. But that's just my personal preference.

Wow, like I live in a ward in Mars or something. In my ward, women give closing prayers in sacrament, women also give the closing remarks (I have and I assure you I don't have a mustache) and YW budget is ALWAYS bigger than the YM one...Home teaching? What's that?

[rameumptom]

But it´s in the scriptures. Why was it necessary once but not any more?

Because there is Doctrine, Principles and Rules/Regulations/Guidelines/Teachings.

Each is built upon the former. Doctrine never changes, principles rarely change if ever, but rules and guidelines can change as often as is needed. The doctrine here is the Atonement of Christ. The Sacrament is an ordinance based upon the principles of Faith in Christ and Repentance, just as baptism by water is. The guidelines include the exactness in the worded prayer, kneeling to offer the prayer, etc.

When we understand and can separate out key doctrine and principles from the rules and guidelines of the day, then we truly begin understanding where everything fits in.

[rameumptom]

A "non-doctrine" sin would include breaking the Word of Wisdom. The Word of Wisdom is not a doctrine, but a rule/guideline. It is based upon the doctrine of we being children of God, and the principle that our bodies are temples of God. However, the WoW began as a guide for the "weakest of the saints" and only was made a rule in 1857 (IIRC).

It could be changed at any time. In fact, while the WoW does not include hard drugs and abuse of prescription drugs, many General Authorities have included these into the list of items that break the Word of Wisdom. It is possible that the day will come when we are allowed to drink wine, as they did in Jesus' day, or that other changes could occur with the WoW to update it.

So, there are "non-doctrinal" sins. These are breaking rules that are based upon doctrine, but are not the doctrine itself.

We see this in the Ten Commandments, as well. The Ten Commandments are a terrestrial law/set of rules, based upon the the Two key laws of Christ: Love God and mankind, which are the abiding principles, based upon the doctrine of Christ-like love and charity. The Ten Commandments are just a set of guidelines to get us to righteousness. But there are higher doctrines and principles that they lead us to.

[Dravin]

Well, if everything beyond Love they Neighbor and Love God are expounding on the underlying doctrines and are not doctrine themselves then using your example of the 10 Commandments, adultery is a non-doctrine sin and the actual sin is not loving thy neighbor (and not loving God considering he's told us not to do such on the subject), which is, I suppose, one way to look at it.

[rameumptom]

The doctrine, in the case of adultery, is the Divine gift of Creation. Adam and Eve were commanded to "multiply and replenish the earth." This divine order was because God is Creator, and shares that power with us. The principle regarding the doctrine of Creation, is it must be done according to God's method, which includes the principle of charity/love/agape. This is also tied to the principle of eternal family.

Adultery, along with other sexual sins, adulterate the sacredness of creation. Adultery is not based upon being Co-creators with God. Nor is it based upon establishing eternal family. Instead, it is based upon selfishness, greed, abusive power, and destructive forces. It destroys family. It leaves children without two parents to raise and bless them. Creation is made null and void.

So, adultery IS a rule. It is based on a terrestrial law, which is based upon celestial laws, doctrines, and principles. For those who have charity, or the true love of Christ, they will not cheat on their spouse, but remain forever faithful. This is why we excommunicate for adultery, as the person is no longer living a terrestrial law, the minimal requirement for remaining a member in good standing.

As Brigham Young once stated, we should also be excommunicating people for not paying tithes, as it also is a terrestrial law, based upon the celestial law and doctrine of consecration.