Spiritual combat wielding a pocket knife where, a four foot broad sword was preferable.

[Peanutterrier2009]

My dad always told me never take a knife to a gun fight. But, I, the ever ready, tender hearted crusader, am always rushing in where angels fear to tred and demons dwell. I got my tail handed to me over the past four days. I became envolved in a discussion about an off color bit posted on my fb wall by my nephew. It showed the former G. Carlin just ripping a part the ten comandments. I let my nephew know I did not find the belittling of one beliefs funny. He and his wife are atheist and responding only brought me heart ache. I and Christianity sufferd a four day long gang beat down. In utter exhaustion, frustration and submission, I finally had to give it up. Nothing I said was heard. I made a statement regarding the decline of any foundational beliefs in our country today and all they did was attack religion. I was called more degrading names in four days than in the past five years. I just am not the spiritual warrior I'd like to be. I needed somebody who could wield a full on four foot broar sword, in a spiritual nature. That's not me. I got hurt pretty bad. I've been getting beat up by life since I got baptized in April. I'm happier than ever but, my life is falling a part. I feel aweful. It's really confusing and I don't understand. I have delt with depression and know how to fight that, no problem. This isn't the same! This is more oppressive and it's hard to figure out. I feel self doubt, insecure, unworthy and I lack self confidence. Everything is going wrong and I am getting tired. I cried and prayed throughout the early morning hours. I have never felt this sort of agony in the center of my being. I felt like I was being ripped a part inside and all I could do was cry out to God. I asked Him if things could be like they were the week after I was baptized again. I know I'm being attacked but, I don't know what to do, who to tell or why this is happening... I should be getting stronger, I'm going to the Temple for the first time in just a couple of weeks. Not for endowment but, for baptizems for the dead. Everytime I turn, something else is messed up. The husbands ex-wife, the boy, my health, this diesaster with my nephew launching all sort of hate filled junk to the point of having to block him, my niece and his wife from my fb site. I feel like I'm a mess right now. Please pray for me!!!!

[Vort]

The four-foot broadsword you need is not the words to put your ill-mannered nephew in his place or refute his mean-spirited and meaningless attacks. The armor you need was described by Paul in Ephesians 6:

Finally, my brethren [and Peanutterrier], be strong in the Lord, and in the power of his might. Put on the whole armor of God, that ye may be able to stand against the wiles of the devil. For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places. Wherefore take unto you the whole armor of God, that ye may be able to withstand in the evil day, and having done all, to stand. Stand therefore, having your loins girt about with truth, and having on the breastplate of righteousness; And your feet shod with the preparation of the gospel of peace; Above all, taking the shield of faith, wherewith ye shall be able to quench all the fiery darts of the wicked. And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God: Praying always with all prayer and supplication in the Spirit, and watching thereunto with all perseverance and supplication for all saints...

God does not slay his enemies until they utterly reject him and turn from him. The sword is there not to destroy your tormentors, but for your own protection, to turn away the darts and slashes of the adversary. Be strong, sister, and try to forgive the ill-mannered rantings of your nephew.

[Peanutterrier2009]

Thank you, I know this scriptue well. That's why I eluded to the sword. I just don't have the ability to stand up to what has now become four people on one issue and continues as we speak. Now I am being condemned because, I blocked the other parties to stop the attack and force a break or cool down time. I have said over and over that, I want to let it go and that we all just need to agree to disagree. That's not the aganda. Even if I were to completly submitt and suddenly accept all responsibility for the ordel and ask for forgiveness, the attacks on me personally would continue. The agenda is an open attack on God, and me for believing. Add to that the idea, I should not say anything when nasty antireligious stuff is posted on my wall and you get a picture of what is really going on. Include the fact that, my nephew has enlisted three other indiviuals to help him in his attack and the idea of why I could use a broad sword to back things down a bit may come into focus. I have never been a beat them up sort of person but, I do tend to bite off more than I can chew.

[Iggy]

Each time you respond you are allowing the conversation to continue. You want it to stop, so quit responding to them.

I had a neighbor who persisted in arguing over the Gospel Principles of the LDS church. We had been fairly good friends, went on shopping trips together - his full sized truck really was an asset, so was his perspective on products, from a male point of view. I had him over to dinner when I fed the Missionaries, and he cooked several meals for them also.

He was a Big C Catholic (his words). He would not stop with the questions, pushing his point of view, demanding that I was being foolish and brainwashed.

Finally I quit taking phone calls from him, changed the locks on my house (my out of town landlord had given him keys to the house & he flat refused to give them to me- so I changed the locks), I bounced his emails to me. I felt that I was not a good enough Mormon because I couldn't answer his questions, and I fell flat in discussions and debates with him. He made me feel as though I was the most unworthy human in existence. I was a mess, yet I turned to my Priesthood leaders in the Branch- most often crying in frustration - they comforted me, and counciled me to be rid of the neighbor. I couldn't move- but I could ignore him.

He ended up doing the same thing to the Missionaries- finally our Branch Missionary Leader sat down and had a long discussion with him. What we all discovered is that my neighbor was never going to allow himself to understand our LDS belief. He got his thrills from debating us, belittling us, and it made him feel superior to toss scriptures around.

When us Mormons quit playing his game, he actually started in on his own Pastor at the Catholic church.

You are never going to win any faith based battle with your nephew & niece, ever. I am sure Vort, Dravin, Ram and some others can post the links to several LDS Apologetic forums, where they can join and will then get their daily dose of arguments from. At least it will keep them off your back.

After two years of ignoring my neighbor- and him moving from Oregon to North Dakota & me marrying and moving from Oregon to Arizona- we are now friends again.

What caused him to stop with the debates? He spent 4 months at a Monastery in the Dakotas (can't remember if it was South or North) and they pretty much cured him. Not with debate, but with SILENCE and HARD PHYSICAL LABOR. He didn't realize that when he signed up for the 4 month sabbatical what all it entailed.

Personally, I think it was THE best thing that ever happened to him. Being silent, no outside communication (TV, internet, newspapers, radio, or even conversation with the community out side of the monastery)- just a wee bit like being a LDS Missionary:). Then the hard physical labor. It was more intense than he thought- he was and is used to tending a garden, doing carpentry work (makes fantastic book cases, etc.) chopping wood and stacking it, etc. But what they did was much more intense.

Anyway, Peanut- you have to end the debates- the battle. A dog can't chase you if you don't run! Stop running. Turn inward to God in prayer- ask for blessings from your HT, your Bishopric, and your husband, for strength, comfort, and to reinforce your own prayer of banishing evil. Pray for your nephew and his sibs to have a softening of the heart, and for their safety and comfort. (I know this worked for me regarding my ex when I left & divorced him, and he was not nice back to me).

Peanut, where is your husband during all this? Has he become active in Church?

Don't know how much of a comfort this will be, but you are being attacked because satan has lost you, and he is really mad because of it. You also have to come to the realization that it is NOT your responsibility to fight and defend the LDS faith. It needs no defense. It is your responsibility to find uplifting and spiritual friends, words, and to seek comfort through the Holy Ghost. Hold tight to the rod- keep your heart turned to God.

I found that by playing LDS music all the time I was in the house helped me to stay focused on good and to build a wall against the battering of my neighbor. I was very fortunate that I had no other close neighbors who would be bothered by the music playing loudly 24/7- me I slept easily with the music playing.

[blackknight5k]

As a former Atheist with Atheist (ex)-friends I will tell you this - Arguing with a rabid Atheist or really anyone else with another extreme viewpoint than your own, it is not worth the time or the torment to argue with them endlessly. If they ask you a question, it's ok to answer, however if they are being rude and hardheaded, just walk away. Log off from the computer and go take some deep breaths, read a little bit, go for a walk, whatever but when you come back just leave them be.

I have a cousin that has caused so much ruckus over religion and child-raising that I will flat out refuse to talk to her anymore - does this make me a bad person? I don't think so, I gave her plenty of chances to calm down and discuss things rationally rather than with the "holier than thou" attitude that the majority of the people my age have these days.

tl;dr - just ignore them and don't argue

[applepansy]

It sounds like Satan is using the people around you to beat you down.

Blocking your nephew and others who are attacking you is the right thing to do. You can always send him a private message telling him you love him but won't stand there and be beat to a pulp with his words. When he can act civil then you will always be there for him.

[Peanutterrier2009]

Hi Iggy, already at your place. Last night, yet another country was heard from. My Ex-Brother-in-Law(their dad) piped up and accussed me of being childish because, I blocked the "kids"(now almost 30 years old). I just didn't respond. I hope not giving him audiance will let it die. They got the last word, hope it just goes away now. I told my Sis and Dad, when the kids can play nice and not throw sand and push others around, they will be allowed to play in my sand box again. I also asked them to not get involved and further incite the issue. I can deal withthis on my own. If they want to think poorly of me, I can handle it. It won't be the first time I've been held in low esteem. It's not worth ripping the family a part over this. NO ONE is listening. Not even me because, I've been in defense mode since they began the personel attacks. Some time and distance is my choice in this situation.

[Peanutterrier2009]

As a former Atheist with Atheist (ex)-friends I will tell you this - Arguing with a rabid Atheist or really anyone else with another extreme viewpoint than your own, it is not worth the time or the torment to argue with them endlessly. If they ask you a question, it's ok to answer, however if they are being rude and hardheaded, just walk away.

Couldn't agree more. I have had enough....

[Peanutterrier2009]

PS. Thanks everyone. Nice to know I have support. My husband has been wonderful in all this. Yes, he has been slient(on the net) but, at my side through the whole thing. I have an appointment with our Bishop on Sunday. I realize, I might need a little help fighting the underlying advisary right now.

[Still_Small_Voice]

What it appears is being done in my opinion is bullying. Pray for your family and focus on righteous and uplifting things. You have received some good advice thus far from others.

Satan hates it when I go to the temple. I got so weary of the opposition that I just go to the temple now without ever voicing my plans.

[LDSJewess]

My dad always told me never take a knife to a gun fight. But, I, the ever ready, tender hearted crusader, am always rushing in where angels fear to tred and demons dwell. I got my tail handed to me over the past four days. I became envolved in a discussion about an off color bit posted on my fb wall by my nephew. It showed the former G. Carlin just ripping a part the ten comandments. I let my nephew know I did not find the belittling of one beliefs funny. He and his wife are atheist and responding only brought me heart ache. I and Christianity sufferd a four day long gang beat down. In utter exhaustion, frustration and submission, I finally had to give it up. Nothing I said was heard. I made a statement regarding the decline of any foundational beliefs in our country today and all they did was attack religion. I was called more degrading names in four days than in the past five years. I just am not the spiritual warrior I'd like to be. I needed somebody who could wield a full on four foot broar sword, in a spiritual nature. That's not me. I got hurt pretty bad. I've been getting beat up by life since I got baptized in April. I'm happier than ever but, my life is falling a part. I feel aweful. It's really confusing and I don't understand. I have delt with depression and know how to fight that, no problem. This isn't the same! This is more oppressive and it's hard to figure out. I feel self doubt, insecure, unworthy and I lack self confidence. Everything is going wrong and I am getting tired. I cried and prayed throughout the early morning hours. I have never felt this sort of agony in the center of my being. I felt like I was being ripped a part inside and all I could do was cry out to God. I asked Him if things could be like they were the week after I was baptized again. I know I'm being attacked but, I don't know what to do, who to tell or why this is happening... I should be getting stronger, I'm going to the Temple for the first time in just a couple of weeks. Not for endowment but, for baptizems for the dead. Everytime I turn, something else is messed up. The husbands ex-wife, the boy, my health, this diesaster with my nephew launching all sort of hate filled junk to the point of having to block him, my niece and his wife from my fb site. I feel like I'm a mess right now. Please pray for me!!!!

Peanut my friend, of course I will be praying for you.

Keep in mind now that you are not responsible to convert your nephew and there is no battle if the warriors don't show up for the war. By trying to debate anyone who believes differently than you, all you are doing is fanning the fire.

Here is my advice and I have used this advice a number of times on friends and family members. So here goes:

When an offensive or off color post is posted on your facebook wall, move your curser to the X in the upper right corner and simply delete. If the person continues to leave negative remarks, simply remove that person from your friend list. Next, send a private message to the offending person and say something like this: "Dear Name...., I have removed your post and have deleted you from my friend list on facebook until such time that we may be able to mutually respect each others beliefs. I do not wish to engage in religious or political discussions that can reasult in arguing and negativity. You are free to believe or not believe as you choose, and I expect you honor my choice to believe as I choose. I hope that we may be able to resume a positive respectful relationship in the future. I wish you well." Love, Sign your name.

I would not engage in any debate, and I would not tell him that I would pray for him since that in and of itself is challenging his non belief in prayer. I was in a Gospel Principles class recently where someone said, "salvation is forced upon no one." Right now it is not wise to try and be a missionary to your newphew, nor is it wise to feel responsible for their choices. Live by example in a state of letting it go, but also refusing to be a part of the negativity and contention. By refusing to engage and letting this go, you can better use your time to grow in your faith, and enjoy your experience in the Temple.

I don't know if and when your nephew will soften his heart. But I do know that you do not need to make negativity a part of your world.

Thoughts and prayers coming your way.

[Peanutterrier2009]

What it appears is being done in my opinion is bullying. Pray for your family and focus on righteous and uplifting things. You have received some good advice thus far from others.

Satan hates it when I go to the temple. I got so weary of the opposition that I just go to the temple now without ever voicing my plans.

Yeah, I'm a little slow but, I firgured out what's going on. Satan is using my none believing family memebers to get to me. It's not them but, satan working through them. This only makes things slightly better. It gives me a compassion for them. They don't know what they are doing. Yet, my true advisary is much more crafty and hateful than they ever could be. I had the missionaries in the house today. It changed the entier feel of our home. Things feel happy and warm here again, for the time being. I will see the Bishop this Sunday and I'm sure he will be able to offer some solid support to help check satan's attack. I know this can be stemned, I know who I serve and I know He is far more powerful than any of this nonesense. I don't like the feelings I get when satan's influence is at work. It's a new feeling for me. This has been a real learning experience. I know what the Holy Spirit's influence feels like, now I know what satan's influence feels like too. YUK!!!! Everything inside feels troubled and dark. The confusion, hostility and unrest is almost unbearable. Satan doesn't want us going to the Temple at all, does he. The Temple must be incrediable and an awesome sorce of strength and enlightenment.

[Peanutterrier2009]

Peanut my friend, of course I will be praying for you.

Keep in mind now that you are not responsible to convert your nephew and there is no battle if the warriors don't show up for the war. By trying to debate anyone who believes differently than you, all you are doing is fanning the fire.

Here is my advice and I have used this advice a number of times on friends and family members. So here goes:

When an offensive or off color post is posted on your facebook wall, move your curser to the X in the upper right corner and simply delete. If the person continues to leave negative remarks, simply remove that person from your friend list. Next, send a private message to the offending person and say something like this: "Dear Name...., I have removed your post and have deleted you from my friend list on facebook until such time that we may be able to mutually respect each others beliefs. I do not wish to engage in religious or political discussions that can reasult in arguing and negativity. You are free to believe or not believe as you choose, and I expect you honor my choice to believe as I choose. I hope that we may be able to resume a positive respectful relationship in the future. I wish you well." Love, Sign your name.

I would not engage in any debate, and I would not tell him that I would pray for him since that in and of itself is challenging his non belief in prayer. I was in a Gospel Principles class recently where someone said, "salvation is forced upon no one." Right now it is not wise to try and be a missionary to your newphew, nor is it wise to feel responsible for their choices. Live by example in a state of letting it go, but also refusing to be a part of the negativity and contention. By refusing to engage and letting this go, you can better use your time to grow in your faith, and enjoy your experience in the Temple.

I don't know if and when your nephew will soften his heart. But I do know that you do not need to make negativity a part of your world.

Thoughts and prayers coming your way.

Thank you for your advice. As always, wonderful, warm and insightful. There's a depth of compassion and wisdom that is easily detected in your writing. You've been doing this for awhile my friend. I have aready blocked my nephew. I know I can't help him right now. Things have calmed down for now. I will let the kids back on my site when they can play nice.