False witness leads to disfellowship...

[Try2CTR]

If a woman tells lies to get her husband disfellowshipped - what is necessary to prove she bore false witness and are such church court decisions ever "overturned" and the innocent person reinstated?

This man has been virtually shunned by his ward and stake members due to her lies. The husband and wife are now divorced. He still attends church dutifully. As his friend, I have attended church with him on three occasions and in that time the only person who spoke to us was the bishop, and that was just once.

He has a protection order against her for stalking and bizzare erratic behavior and there is now a warrant for her arrest for reckless endangerment. Yet she can still hold a calling and continually spread lies about him in church (and virtually anyone who will listen).

Can or should anything be done, or just turn the other cheek and let it all get worked out on the other side?

[Anddenex]

If a woman tells lies to get her husband disfellowshipped - what is necessary to prove she bore false witness and are such church court decisions ever "overturned" and the innocent person reinstated?

The simple answer, is "yes." However, I would be more curious to know if she lied why the Stake President, Bishop, and the High Councilor's would have believed the lie?

I believe in all cases the accused has a right to defend himself/herself against false accusations, and if I am remembering correctly a specific number of High Councilors are asked to defend the accused.

Either through repentance, or through new information, a person's membership is reinstated.

This man has been virtually shunned by his ward and stake members due to her lies. The husband and wife are now divorced. He still attends church dutifully. As his friend, I have attended church with him on three occasions and in that time the only person who spoke to us was the bishop, and that was just once.

I would encourage the man to move to another ward, if financially possible. Although it is difficult, still encourage your friend to remain faithful. Especially, if they are still in the same ward.

Can or should anything be done, or just turn the other cheek and let it all get worked out on the other side?

The avenues we have been given are our Priesthood leaders. Contact the Bishop, and contact the Stake President and receive counsel.

Edited December 10, 2012 by Anddenex

[skippy740]

Disfellowshipping is different from excommunication. Not trying to belittle the situation, but to put it in perspective.

Typically, disfellowshipped members cannot partake of the sacrament, represent the ward or classes in prayer or be a home teacher (at least on their own). There may be more or less depending on the circumstances.

That said, if another congregation is available, I would attend it, even in another stake if possible.

I would hope that any further 'lies' being told by the ex-spouse would no longer be given any further consideration.

Are there kids in this marriage? The only other thing I can think of is if the ex-spouse claims child abuse in the future.

***

I must thank you for this post because I'm about to be divorced (with no apparent sign of avoiding it). Your thread helped me realize that if I wasn't in a separate ward & stake from my wife that my church life could've ended up a very differently than it is now.

[NeuroTypical]

I guess I would think about two things:

- How do you know they are lies?

- Why are the details of their divorce and his disfellowshipment any of your business?

I would think about stewardship. If I'm someone's friend, I can love and support them while they move through difficult periods in life. But I don't necessarily need to take sides or insert myself into what comes down to an argument between two people.

Battles for public opinion are often destructive wastes of time that accomplish nothing but increased levels of gossip. I'm guessing "keep out of it" may be your best advice.

There's a guy in my ward who is very, VERY easy to dislike. He's also mourning the loss of a son, and his family seems to be disintigrating. My baptismal covenant is to bear one another's burdens. I helped bear his, by letting him know that I share his hope about his son's experience in the afterlife. And I refuse to participate in any of the gossip or judging or unwanted advice-giving that's going on around him. I think there's a lot to such an approach.

[Try2CTR]

Thank you all... all perspectives are welcome and needed.

As for how I know they are lies, there is evidence that was not allowed during the process.

I guess I just need to stay out of it. :/ Hurts to watch a friend go through this. I have seen this woman in action. Scary. She's a very good actress.

[Try2CTR]

PS. All kids are grown and because of her actions want little to do with the church. They stand by their father.

[EarlJibbs]

Was he actually disfellowshipped? The shunning sounds like individual decisions. The OP makes it sound like there was an announcement of this persons shame and everyone joined in.

If he still has his full rights as a member and the other members are acting like that, you cannot necessarily change that. Being disfellowsipped, you work closely with the Bishop, or should. So maybe there is more than meets the eye.

[Try2CTR]

This entire situation has not been handled through the bishop...because while still married, the couple counseled with the Bishop and he suggested her issues needed to be dropped and that the husband did nothing wrong...she needed to move on. She then went "over his head" to the SP who then took the ball and ran with it. The SP even went so far as to call the ex wife to tell her the results of the counsel...so very quickly the news spread of the judgement. I've seen his vague communications on the subject and when repeatedly asked what the sin was the caused the action would either not respond or reply with "you know what you did". FYI, that SP has now been released.

This is a very sad situation that will take years to heal. Hopefully all will come out in the Lord's time. We all know our church leaders do their best to follow the Spirit and do the best they can, but they ARE human.

I am so very proud of this brother who has remained steadfast in his church attendance. He has the same mantra of Joseph Smith when he saw the first vision: "I knew it, and I knew God knew it". Right now, that's the best we can all do, knowing our Father knows ALL. We must be patient in waiting for the wrongs to be righted...all will be taken care of in the end.

I thank you all for your input.

[Suzie]

I always say there are two sides of the story and is quite probable that you are only seeing/knowing just one side but the most important details are only known by the couple in question.

[Guest kshRox]

If a woman tells lies to get her husband disfellowshipped - what is necessary to prove she bore false witness and are such church court decisions ever "overturned" and the innocent person reinstated?

This man has been virtually shunned by his ward and stake members due to her lies. The husband and wife are now divorced. He still attends church dutifully. As his friend, I have attended church with him on three occasions and in that time the only person who spoke to us was the bishop, and that was just once.

He has a protection order against her for stalking and bizzare erratic behavior and there is now a warrant for her arrest for reckless endangerment. Yet she can still hold a calling and continually spread lies about him in church (and virtually anyone who will listen).

Can or should anything be done, or just turn the other cheek and let it all get worked out on the other side?

I'm sorry to hear this.

I went through a similar experience during my divorce - Church got right in the middle and played favorites. I finally left, was the best thing I ever did. Sometimes others try to define us and some of us may be strong enough to weather the storm, others such as myself leave where we don't feel welcome or wanted for who we are.

I hope your friend remains true to who and what he is and doesn't break or bend into some emotionally scarred or crippled version of himself. It is incredibly hard to be labelled and slandered. For me it took years to really come through to the other side and not be twisted by anger or bitterness.

If <- by Rudyard Kipling is a great poem, you might want to share it with your friend.

A word of caution to you - be careful the temporary shelter you give now does not become your disappointment later when your friend moves on.

Good Luck