Predetermination?

[Jbs2763]

How much of our lives is predestined, or predetermined? In the pre-existence did we "meet" our future spouse? (think saturdays' warrior), pending free will? ie If we make the right decisions, will we end up with the person we knew before hand?

Like in my patriachtical blessing, it said i would serve a mission and be a husband and father, since i wasnt worthy at the time to serve a mission, and just recently got back to being active in the church. Did the possible woman i knew in the pre-existance find someone else? Or am i still destined to meet her? Is she perhaps one of the many who have suffered the pain of a divorce and some horrific thing that broke her heart that led to that divorce sinc ei wasnt there to meet her and be worthy at the time? I know if i would have gone on my mission at 19...i sure as heckfire would not be where i am today...Or would I? would i still be laying in my big rig in a truckstop in Ohio right now. Would I have had the determinatoin to finish college and study if i went to BYU instead ofa party school where i acted all silly?

And when God decided on his individual plan for us...did He plan on me screwing up for a while and coming back to the church when I did....cause all the stupid stuff i did has made me the person i am today?

just some random thoughts i had rolling down the highway.....

[Misshalfway]

We believe in foreordination.

LDS.org - Youth Chapter Detail - Foreordination

I think we did make some promises. I am not sure about the accuracy of Saturday's Warrior. I actually think that musical is a very romantically skewed view of things.

[Stampede]

How much of our lives is predestined, or predetermined? In the pre-existence did we "meet" our future spouse? (think saturdays' warrior), pending free will? ie If we make the right decisions, will we end up with the person we knew before hand?

Like in my patriachtical blessing, it said i would serve a mission and be a husband and father, since i wasnt worthy at the time to serve a mission, and just recently got back to being active in the church. Did the possible woman i knew in the pre-existance find someone else? Or am i still destined to meet her? Is she perhaps one of the many who have suffered the pain of a divorce and some horrific thing that broke her heart that led to that divorce sinc ei wasnt there to meet her and be worthy at the time? I know if i would have gone on my mission at 19...i sure as heckfire would not be where i am today...Or would I? would i still be laying in my big rig in a truckstop in Ohio right now. Would I have had the determinatoin to finish college and study if i went to BYU instead ofa party school where i acted all silly?

And when God decided on his individual plan for us...did He plan on me screwing up for a while and coming back to the church when I did....cause all the stupid stuff i did has made me the person i am today?

just some random thoughts i had rolling down the highway.....

you sound like me

no seriously....

it's creepy.....

I Was inactive for many years

and iw as also told in my partiarchial blessing that i would be called to serve a mission. but alas, i was a very rebellious teenager and due to choices in my life iw as also unable to serve a mission. and only in the last year came back to church and fixed my life back in shape.

But i feel i must share with you to not worry, because the lord has a plan for all of us, while those who we may have made promises to int he pre-existence may be disappointed with our actions, everythign that needs to be done will be done either by us or someone who is capable of fulfilling that calling.

We all make mistakes and we all live with mistakes but as i look back on my life and the things that have happened, i don't feel they could have happened any other way, the lord knows me and put me in places where i needed to be at the right time even though i was in an awful state.

I met my wife at a nightlcub, but i have had the privledge of seeing her and her family begging me in the pre-existence to find them and bring them to the gospel. (this was before i was active again in church mind you that i was given this insight) and after long talks with my mother and praying about things i know that i would have been in a position to meet her at some point in my life even if i had returned home from a mission.

i am so greatful that my father in heaven allowed us to be together even though i was in such an awful state of rebellion. she has made me a better person. other experiences i have had between my wife, the lord, and i have all made it very clear that we were supposed to be together.

all you need to do is ask the lord for guidance in all things, and when the time is right, you will know it, and the lord will bless you with all of the thing neccisary for you to take care of her and have a wonderful life.

[Flyonthewall]

How much of our lives is predestined, or predetermined? In the pre-existence did we "meet" our future spouse? (think saturdays' warrior), pending free will? ie If we make the right decisions, will we end up with the person we knew before hand?

Like in my patriachtical blessing, it said i would serve a mission and be a husband and father, since i wasnt worthy at the time to serve a mission, and just recently got back to being active in the church. Did the possible woman i knew in the pre-existance find someone else? Or am i still destined to meet her? Is she perhaps one of the many who have suffered the pain of a divorce and some horrific thing that broke her heart that led to that divorce sinc ei wasnt there to meet her and be worthy at the time? I know if i would have gone on my mission at 19...i sure as heckfire would not be where i am today...Or would I? would i still be laying in my big rig in a truckstop in Ohio right now. Would I have had the determinatoin to finish college and study if i went to BYU instead ofa party school where i acted all silly?

And when God decided on his individual plan for us...did He plan on me screwing up for a while and coming back to the church when I did....cause all the stupid stuff i did has made me the person i am today?

just some random thoughts i had rolling down the highway.....

Please keep in mind that not everything in Saturdays Warriors is doctrine, some of it was just to further the storyline. I don't hold the belief that we picked our spouses or family in the pre-mortal realm.

As for your patriarchal blessing, well, all those blessings are conditional upon your faithfulness. And since your life is not over, you still can see those blessings come true.

I do not believe that there is only one person in the world that will be the "one". There are many people out there that can fit the bill. It is possible to meet that special "someone" whether or not you went on a mission.

The best thing I can say is: Don't worry about the past. Learn from it and move forward with faith.

[WillowTheWhisp]

I know before I start that I'm going to tangle myself in knots trying to answer this one!

I do believe that we are pre-ordained to do certain things in life but that doesn't mean that will necessarily do them because we have our own freedom to choose whether we will or not.Maybe it's something like a family where the son has always inherited the father's house and followed in the father's footsteps in career etc but then one generation the son chooses not to but goes his own way and does his own thing. What happens to the house? Someone else lives in it. What happens to the careeer? Someone else does that thing.

If we accepted a calling in the pre-existence and didn't follow that once we got here then maybe there will be things in the life we do choose which will steer us back towards what we would/should/could have done. I know there have been times in my life when I have tried to make certain decisions but circumstances have come in my way to prevent it. When I have accepted those circumstances I have later seen the good that has been able to come from it.

If someone is told in their Patriarchal Blessing that they will serve a mission and they don't then perhaps they will do as a retired adult, or maybe it will even in the spirit world. I personally know of one young man who was blessed that he would serve a mission and return home with honour. He did not return to his home ward. He died in a road accident whilst serving his mission. In a prayer at his funeral service the person praying said that the elder had returned home to his Heavenly Father, a good and faithful servant. Perhaps that was what his blessing had meant.

I know there are people I have met in the pre-existence who I have later met on earth. It's been an instant recognition and very powerful. I also believe there are people who I and my late husband promised we would find and help to bring them home. Did we know that we would have the blessing of finding the church first? I don't know. I do know there is someone in my life at the moment who I made that promise to and I am finding it very difficult to handle. The things that had to happen in order for this to be fulfilled have been heartbreaking at times, including the death of my husband. I wish it could have been some other way but I know that it couldn't. That doesn't make it any easier though.

I know we have the choice whether or not to follow the path which is laid out before us. If we do follow it then it doesn't necessarily mean that everything will be easy. If we don't follow it that doesn't mean that there will not be many opportunities along the way to come back onto it. The main thing is that whatever we do I believe Heavenly Father knows and will help us and guide us if we listen.

My daughters and I used to spend the summer on a farm on the estuary of a river which was a salt marsh. There are pathways down on the marsh which are firm and which if you stay on them you will be safe. Being children they didn't always want to stay on the path and that sometimes meant they slipped into pools or got very muddy. They were never in any real danger as I didn't let them stray too far and we never tried the whole marsh/bay crossing without a 'sand pilot' - this is the guy who knows exactly where to walk to get safely across. The whole experience makes a great real life parable for them. Even if they got wet and muddy they could still wash off the mud, get back on the path and dry off in the sun. But people in the past who had tried to cross unaided had ended up being sucked under the quicksands and lost forever.

[Guest tomk]

How much of our lives is predestined, or predetermined? In the pre-existence did we "meet" our future spouse? (think saturdays' warrior), pending free will? ie If we make the right decisions, will we end up with the person we knew before hand?

Like in my patriachtical blessing, it said i would serve a mission and be a husband and father, since i wasnt worthy at the time to serve a mission, and just recently got back to being active in the church. Did the possible woman i knew in the pre-existance find someone else? Or am i still destined to meet her? Is she perhaps one of the many who have suffered the pain of a divorce and some horrific thing that broke her heart that led to that divorce sinc ei wasnt there to meet her and be worthy at the time? I know if i would have gone on my mission at 19...i sure as heckfire would not be where i am today...Or would I? would i still be laying in my big rig in a truckstop in Ohio right now. Would I have had the determinatoin to finish college and study if i went to BYU instead ofa party school where i acted all silly?

And when God decided on his individual plan for us...did He plan on me screwing up for a while and coming back to the church when I did....cause all the stupid stuff i did has made me the person i am today?

just some random thoughts i had rolling down the highway.....

This is not a topic I've thought much about.

Parts of my Patriarchal Blessing ( PB ) have come to pass in striking ways. I guess you could consider a PB a form of "pre-ordination". I received my PB when I was 16. The Patriarch said things and promised things that I don't see how he could have known at the time, except by the means that are ascribed - i.e., revelation.

There are parts of my PB that have yet to "come to pass." Much of it is phrased such that I must have total and complete reliance upon the Lord in order for those things to come to pass. Given my current situation, it will take nothing short of a miracle in order for these things to come to pass! But my God is a God of miracles.

If these things do not happen, I will sorrow for that, but I will not lose faith or despair. It may not happen because of my own lack of faithfulness. We CAN and we DO lose promised blessings when we continue in sin.

Regardless, I know that the Lord loves me. I hope for a glorious resurrection.

Agency is paramount. We can choose to receive what was promised us. We can choose not to receive it, as well.

I think President Hinckley is a fine example of someone who received blessings in the pre-existence and went on to fulfill them of his own free will and choice.

[BenRaines]

Remember that a PB is not something that you can tick off the items as they come to pass. They are all based on your righteousness. There are places where we will all come short and there are things that will come to pass that are not expressed there. PB is a very general map of the blessings instore for you if you remain true and faithful. A PB is not an absolute.

Ben Raines

[Guest tomk]

Remember that a PB is not something that you can tick off the items as they come to pass. They are all based on your righteousness. There are places where we will all come short and there are things that will come to pass that are not expressed there. PB is a very general map of the blessings instore for you if you remain true and faithful. A PB is not an absolute.

Ben Raines

I believe that is what I just said. Read what I said very carefully!!

But thank you for the reminder.

[skalenfehl]

I believe that we were foreordained to our callings on earth from the prophet of the church right down to deacon's quorum presidency. I'd like to think that we knew who our mortal parents, children and spouses were going to be, but I honestly don't know. There have been too many "coincidences" in my life for me to believe otherwise, but I will say that I have no doubt that Father in Heaven already knows each of our outcomes and all the choices that we will ever have made. We have only to live our lives and fill our measures of creation. We still have the right to choose, but we don't know what we will choose and that is still up to us to discover. This is why He has His arm extended to us "all the day long".

Some scriptural references:

Abr. 3: 23

23 And God saw these souls that they were good, and he stood in the midst of them, and he said: These I will make my rulers; for he stood among those that were spirits, and he saw that they were good; and he said unto me: Abraham, thou art one of them; thou wast chosen before thou wast born.

D&C 138: 53-57

53 The Prophet Joseph Smith, and my father, Hyrum Smith, Brigham Young, John Taylor, Wilford Woodruff, and other choice spirits who were reserved to come forth in the fulness of times to take part in laying the foundations of the great latter-day work,

54 Including the building of the temples and the performance of ordinances therein for the redemption of the dead, were also in the spirit world.

55 I observed that they were also among the noble and great ones who were chosen in the beginning to be rulers in the Church of God.

56 Even before they were born, they, with many others, received their first lessons in the world of spirits and were prepared to come forth in the due time of the Lord to labor in his vineyard for the salvation of the souls of men.

57 I beheld that the faithful elders of this dispensation, when they depart from mortal life, continue their labors in the preaching of the gospel of repentance and redemption, through the sacrifice of the Only Begotten Son of God, among those who are in darkness and under the bondage of sin in the great world of the spirits of the dead.

[MorningStar]

Remember, some people serve Senior missions later. :)

Also, I don't think it's church doctrine that we selected our spouses in the pre-existence.

[utcowboy]

Moringstar is again RIGHT!!! You still have the option to go on a mission, and there are lots of different missions. Have you considered that while you are driving your truck that you are an example to the people you meet along the way. And you have the ability to touch alot of lives!! Remember who you are and what you stand for, I tell my son this all the time though I don't think that it sinks into his head, but its good advice. Someone is always watching you whether you know it or not. Always try to do your best, be kind to those around you and always care for those that cannot care for themselves. I'm rambling so I close by saying with the love of the Lord in your heart you have the ability to bring a multitude of people to the Gospel of Christ just through your actions. God Bless and safe driving :)

[Guest tomk]

Remember, some people serve Senior missions later. :)

Also, I don't think it's church doctrine that we selected our spouses in the pre-existence.

Who were you addressing this comment to?

Just curious.

[MorningStar]

Who were you addressing this comment to?

Just curious.

To the OP. :)

[MorningStar]

Moringstar is again RIGHT!!! You still have the option to go on a mission, and there are lots of different missions. Have you considered that while you are driving your truck that you are an example to the people you meet along the way. And you have the ability to touch alot of lives!! Remember who you are and what you stand for, I tell my son this all the time though I don't think that it sinks into his head, but its good advice. Someone is always watching you whether you know it or not. Always try to do your best, be kind to those around you and always care for those that cannot care for themselves. I'm rambling so I close by saying with the love of the Lord in your heart you have the ability to bring a multitude of people to the Gospel of Christ just through your actions. God Bless and safe driving :)

There are also ward and stake mission leaders. :)