Prodigal_Son

First off, awesome post A-train. I'm right with you on ALL of that. Which is nice. I swear everyone around me is asleep and uncomfortable confronting these issues. My mother was in town yesterday and shared with me a quote from Brigham - a prophecy - where he said that the saints would basically tank themselves through greed and rampant speculation (kinda like Kirtland). I consider this to be the most insidious evil in LDS society today. The keep-up-with-the-joneses addiction has literally reached a point where it just disgusts me. The misconception that so many WANTS are today's NECESSITIES. Young couples with a $10/hr job and 2 new cars. Comments about not being caught dead in a certain brand of apparel. Embarrassment that their kid's stroller isn't an Eddie Bauer. Poor as dirt, but with a big old plasma TV... I moved my family out of a subdivision and down a long dead-end road to get away from that crap. And it's made a BIG difference in my family. I've always been disturbed by how many Saints think that get-rich-quick is a ligitimate business pursuit. Don't get me started on all the crock MLM's here in UT. The challenge we face is: how do we affect Congress (state and national) into making these changes? What can WE as a people do to make these course corrections?

I made it up yesterday when I signed on.

While I get what you're saying, I'm not suggesting we need a new committee at church. Just us, working together. How can ANYONE read those passages of scripture and NOT see the danger of just letting these groups alone?

Was it just me, or was there a BIG difference in his power once the mantle of the presidency came upon him? I just remember thinking, WOW!, he's never touched me like this before. Then, upon mentioning this to my mother, she pointed out the mantle. (Duh).

Then why aren't we working to educate the masses? Why don't we put a bullseye on these groups?

The nature of my work keeps me from seeing any of it. But because of my work, I get to wear my ipod all day. Thus, the moment those mp3's are posted, I keep them on my ipod for six months. That way, by the time I've listened to the talks 12 times - maybe they start to sink in.

Definitely! Amen to that. This recent economic turbulence has really opened my/my wife's eyes. We've been living the dream, doing the whole more-more-more thing. We've spent the past several months reconsidering our priorities. So long as the current economic crunch doesn't break us , I'm really grateful it has come and we've had our eyes opened.

Good explanation. I thought, from your first post, that you believed they merely preached them out of existence. My interest is the precedent that this passage provides for us today. Mormon recorded this for you and I. We are living in a wealthy, free-trade era where Gadianton Robbers are interwoven in myriad different ways. The Saints talk about this every once in a while in class. But when are WE, the people of God, going to do "everything in our power" to fight these evils? I would just love to label some of these groups and, I don't know, maybe even collaborate as a group??? on how we can combat these conglomerations of wickedness right here, right now. Is this where I write it on my cloak? (No I don't at all consider myself a Moroni. )

a-train: killer link! I'm gonna have to rethink my whole hostile-takeover bid!

Our Canon is what we use to blast the unbelievers out of the water.

Great example. I have that book. Good story.

Look at how President Eyring talks about his father.

Oops. I forsook my Sunday nap to discover this forum. Maybe I shoulda slept. The area directly across (to the south) from the Orson Hyde Memorial Park? I shall forbear for the moment and beg off - because I'm working with a partner on starting my own biz. We've been working for another company doing these tours, and are looking to start our own, so as to do things "our" way. I'll be taking another tour through over Thanksgiving.

Yes and no. With a weakness the Lord is bound to step in and help. But illness is entirely different. While I believe that faith CAN heal illness, there is no guarantee stating that such a gift is guaranteed. We don't always know why we're given the trials we are. We don't know why some kids are born as crack babies and will suffer their whole lives with such physical trials... Then you're human like the rest of us. It's not that we are required to WIN the race. We're merely required to be PARTICIPATING IN that race. Big question. Blessings are sometimes coming from the priesthood holder and not from God. Sometimes our emotions take over and we (as priesthood holders) try and will things to happen. Unfortunately, these blessings don't quite work so well as a blessing given as a proper one where we are simply the mouthpiece to the will of God. Hang in there.

With all due respect, this has NOTHING to do with freedom of religion. And it IS OUR DUTY to keep that type of behavior in check. Think of it as FIRE INSURANCE (ala Sodom and Gomorrah).

If you're like my wife, you could go without shopping for a day. THAT kind of sacrifice would definitely be noticed.

I have a hard time believing that using "every means in their power" is completely contained in "hunt[ing] the band" and "preach[ing] the word of God among the more wicked parts of them". Doesn't fly.

Modern revelation ALWAYS trumps ancient revelation.

I did not mean to impune the LDS. I just think we should be trying harder. Makes me think of Faust's talk in General Conference about the forgiveness and mercy the Quakers exuded after their horrible incident.

President Faust labeled Athiests as those who exercise faith in non-religion.

Excuse my late arrival. I just cruised through this thread and wanted to comment a bit: I'm a tour guide to Israel and have never heard this. Moreover, Kimball and Lee both declared the "Garden Tomb" the site. I'd be very interested in any "new" information you may have... When the banks crash, paper money will only be good for burning to keep warm. I'm going to respectfully disagree. Modern revelation has reiterated that NO MAN KNOWS. And based on prophecies regarding the state of the world when the 2 are killed in the streets, it is unlikely that you will even know the murders happened. The seals, as I'm sure you're aware represent the 1,000 year dispensations. the big exciting events happen at the beginning of the 7th seal. The seal is opened, but unless we can fathom what Heavenly Father considers to be "the beginning" of this thousand years, speculation could be rampant.

I once asked a bishop about gross vs. net and before vs. after taxes. He responded, "the church doesn't specify. But as for me, if I'm going to err, I want it to be in the Lord's favor." Great advice. It's all about faith, isn't it?

So here's the tough one. At what point in time does this tenet of our faith become superceded by the need to revolt/overthrow/abolish an evil regime? The US is still hanging in there (just barely) but there are members in other parts of the world suffering serious oppression at the hands of their governments. Are we to submit no matter what?

I find the ramifications of this doctrine to be interesting. After 9/11 there was such an anti-islam movement here in the US. These people were heavily berated and belittled. Yet, according to this article of faith, we are supposed to be respectful and mindful of our own religious freedoms.

Maybe they were just looking for feedback on lyrics that THEY wrote... but were too embarrassed to admit it?