Nate

Perhaps, and of course this is speculation unless someone has some reference that can clear things up. Im not sure if John could of had the temp ressurection cause Christ had not yet broke the bands and overcame death. When ever there are messengers there always seems to be Keys associated with that being. Moses and Elijah are givens but what keys would John have. Yes he was a forerunner but he was preforming ordinances in the flesh almost a couple months earlier. Perhaps he was a familiar face or even a precence of comfort for such and incredibly intense spiritual experience?. Duno, anyone have anything.

Ben Raines, any peticular person thats directed toward? Well said Outshined!

So according to modern day revelation on the Mt of transfigureation We know of two visitors Moses and Elijah. They were transfigured so that they could administer by the laying on of hads for that ordinence. We also know through the Prophet Joseph Smith that John the Baptist was in attendence. My question is what function could he have had because he was a disembodied spirit?

This is Mormon 5:1-2 All though this scripture does not refer to Moroni and it does to Mormon I hope that your comment of Moroni is not based on your point of view that the good never has to fight for the wicked (like moroni in Iraq) cause that is not the case. That is the worst case senerio in regards towards Bush that he would be the wicked that a righteous man was fighting for. Are you saying that Bush is the Anti-christ? How on earth do you get off calling him the devil incarnate? Is he worse than Suddam? Is Suddam the devil also? So is the devil fighting the devil? This is opening up a whole new can of worms (differ thread) 10 out of 10 terrorists agree anyone but Bush B)

I was thinking that when reading of these events of the scriptures do we really imagine the events in a way that was portrayed in this movie. I'm not saying that how its was portrayed was 100% correct but I think it wasn't too terribly far from the mark as far as the intensity. I cant say that i've ever shed a tear by "reading" about the atonement. i've shed a tear in bearing testimony of it and by seeing it portrayed in various movies (the passion one of them). Is the events that we read of rated "R" if the MPAA had there hands on the rating? Do were kinda sugar coat the in our minds to not really deal with it or do most of us not really understand what it really means to be "flogged"? Not making a point or anything but this thread has made me reflect on how I respond to the movie and the scriptures. You can read the scriptures and not have the spirit which equals some pretty boring reading. Its kinda hard to sit through The Testaments video and NOT feel the spirit of the Atonement. Some people learn better with a book in front of them and some with a visual. Maybe some need both, dual senses per say like how a baby has to stick everything in there mouth to better understand it. So what I'm trying to say is that we should put the scriptures in our mouth to understand it better

Thanks Earl, my father is named Earl and its a family name. I have 4 boys and havent named anyone Earl yet so I named my dog Earl so my dad wouldnt get mad. He didnt think it was that funny. :) Take no offence its just the name Earl has been an ongoing battle in my family. Its good to have a response with a scriptrual reference.

Conflicts may not be the exact word I would use. One of the most prominent teachings in the LDS church is that we believe in continued revelation to a Prophet of God today like in days of old. Most other christians disagree with our view on continued revelation in the establishing Christs church today like in the days of old. We believe that our church is run by Christ through a prophet of God and 12 Aposltles. Prophets have spoken to other civilizations in other lands such as the ancient Americas and we have those accounts in what is known to us as The Book of Mormon. We accept this as scripture as others do not. With a modern day prophet a lot of direction has been given to us as a people which you may have read about in this forum or from friends. We hold the direction that the prophets give us as from God himself so we abide by those commandments. This is one of many but time will not let me type.

As taught in the Chrurch we don't believe that Mary Magdeline was a prostitute.

Im use to being behind the power curve, thanks. :)

PC, what does COJCLDS mean?

Hence the reason I posted this thread, is there anything that I can referees from a GA in direct correlation to this movie being it deals with the Savior rather than participate in entertainment Then the question comes is this entertainment? Should it be viewed as educational? Would you watch a show on Discovery channel that documents a tribe which showed breasts of the women and view it as entertainment, probably not? If that same tribe had a movie made and it showed breasts now its R and you cant watch it? Of course not, its educational. What are we classifying this movie as? I'm not saying watch it cause its your choice and it should be personal. I just think that people are classifying this movie in the wrong category (entertainment) which we have guidelines from the prophet not to see "R". This show is not for children I agree but someone with a testimony, maturity and faith in Christ I feel will come out having a greater understanding of what actually came to pass for it was not pretty. Just like how you cant accurately portray the battle of the bulge without it being realistic, how can you accurately portray what a crucifixtion is and what The Christ went through without it being realistic. Its only Mels interpretation for the events and I don't think its 100% accurate but you have to hand it to him for the attempt that he made.

This comes from This is some good reading, a bit long but take a minute to read. I copied this article from the International Discussion/ LDS Deep Doctrine in a thread relating to The Passion of the Christ. [url=http://www.meridianmagazine.com/arts/040216Passionate.html]http://www.meridianmagazine.com/arts/040216Passionate.html Passionate Choice By Keith Merrill Are you going to see The Passion of The Christ? The decision is upon you. It opens in theaters February 25. Mortality is little more than the endless process of making important choices - and surviving the consequence. Your decision to see -- or not see -- The Passion of The Christ may ultimately itself be one of passion. Unless you've been in a coma -- or care nothing for movies or popular culture --you know by now that The Passion of The Christ is Mel Gibson's controversial feature film that focuses on the last 12 hours of Jesus' mortal life. I wrote about the film before I'd seen it. My perspective was professional. See "Shared Passion". This time I have seen the film. My perspective is personal. Word of the film has spread primarily as a result of myriad private screenings with Christian clergy, Jewish critics, selected media, high-profile hosts including, Michael Medved, Bill O'Reiley, Opra and Paul Harvey. And from time to time guys like me. My face-to-face dialogue with Mel Gibson about his film and my own efforts to portray the Christ in The Testaments was an exciting tale to tell But I could not even discuss it with my wife. Before the screening, we signed a confidentiality agreement with a promise to say nothing of our experience, nor share our reactions in private or in press. The long silence gave me time for the unforgettable images of the film to distill upon my mind. It gave me time to incubate my feelings and measure them against my understanding of the Savior. During the period of imposed silence, I gave much thought to what I would eventually say to you here. My feelings are conflicted. I wonder if I should write anything at all. I was released from my "vow of silence" a few weeks ago. This is the moment of truth. What do I tell you about the film? Do I recommend that you see it or take it off your list? Very little. Yes. No. Maybe. The Passion of The Christ is much more than "only a movie." In comparison to the movies of fantasy, escapism, hedonism, and even decadence that dominate our popular culture it is much, much more. As a motion picture, The Passion of The Christ is a brilliantly-crafted piece of art. Gibson's enormous talent as director was evident in Braveheart In this film he is even better. This film is distinguished by a personal passion that transcends his earlier work in significant ways. Gibson's deep belief in the Catholic tradition and the passion of Jesus is evident in every frame. I am grateful to Mel Gibson for his talent and his sacrifice. I am grateful that he created this intense vicarious experience as an emotional supplement in my quest to know the Christ and look upon his face. But that is me and you must decide for yourself. It is not a film for everyone by any standard. The controversy swirling about Gibson's film from its earliest beginnings has been focused on four issues. (1) No English is spoken in the film. The announcement that the dialogue would be in ancient Aramaic with English subtitles shocked Hollywood insiders and left audiences around the world trying to imagine the story of Jesus as a foreign language film. (2) The film is accused of being anti-Semitic. Jews and others have condemned the film as "fanning anew the flaming plague of prejudice that has afflicted the Jewish people for 2000 years." They express fears that the film could actually result in bringing violence to Jews. They are wrong. The Jewish community and anti-defamation league is fearful that the film emphasizes the role of Jews in the death of Christ. They are right. The Jews are depicted as culprits in the death of Jesus, but their fears ignore historical reality. In the version of the film I saw, the role of the Jews is not unduly "emphasized," but they are clearly and accurately implicated according to the Biblical history. (3) The film is extremely graphic in the depiction of the torture and death of Jesus. Whatever other issues you may consider in your decision to see or not see the film, it is important that you become fully aware of (a) the intensity of the experience and the gripping, painful realism of the torture and merciless treatment of Christ and ( Gibson's merciless graphic window on those awful events. Your sensitivity - and tolerance -- to the graphic realism of the events surrounding the capture, trial, torture and death of Jesus Christ as described in the New Testament must ultimately be your primary consideration. For your and for your family. (4) Mostly for Mormons. The film is rated R. Some of you have said that the MPAA rating board has made your decision for you. "If the film is rated R, I am not going." Others wonder how we can ever expect to depict with realism the greatest of the Book of Mormon stories on the big screen without the blood of battle - and the inevitable R-rating from the distorted "make love not war" morality of MPAA - and not support films like The Passion of The Christ. Consider seeing the film only if you are sincere in your quest to gain greater insight into the death of Christ. I say "death of Christ" because that is what the film is about. Consider seeing the film only if you seek a deeper and historically detailed appreciation of the last 12 hours of a life that changed the world. Consider seeing the film only if you can glean from the brutality of the images a better understanding of the ultimate purpose of His life. Consider the film only if you are confident it will engender good thoughts, inspire righteous choices and allow you to retain the Spirit of the Lord. The graphic nature of the images notwithstanding, nothing I saw deprived me of the spirit of the Lord. To the contrary, seeing the Savior through the eyes of his mother touched the deepest part of my soul. People experience films differently. Some are enveloped and engaged. Some are entertained. Some are objective observers. Some are consumed by the subjective power and vicariously experience feelings and emotions otherwise impossible. You must know thyself in facing the decision. Frankly, I will never be the same. When the film concluded, this "invitation only" gathering of "movers and shakers" in Washington, DC were shaking indeed, but this time from sobbing. I am not sure there was a dry eye in the place. The crowd that had been glad-handing before the film was now eerily silent. No one could speak because words were woefully inadequate. We had experienced a kind of art that is a rarity in life, the kind that makes heaven touch earth." I don't understand how you interperate that now i'm claiming Mel Gibson as our definitive authority, perhaps you could explain on that? Other than being a little aggressive and using an analogy of my wife how does this correlate to watching a movie about the Atonement?

Now with that article I know what the heck that means, thanks. Im pretty much the same boat though the rapture I may have a differ interpratation. I do like the Left Behind as a good read I must admit though. Im working on the Babylon Rising right now. :) Ya that was to you PC, sorry for not being specific.

How is appreciating the Saviors Atonement immoral, suggestive or pornographic? Do you think that watching the Atonement as a premortal spirit which I know all of us did choose not to watch because it was "graphic in nature"? You can throw quotes of prophets all you want but if it helps you appreciate what Christ did for you than go ahead and partake, if it doesn't than as long as it helps others thats kinda the point. I could also argue on how the modern day prophets command us to learn more of Christ and to appreciate what he went through. Don't see "R" movies, no problem because its a commandment and there is good principle behind it but dont deny yourself an experience but following the letter of the law. Why is it rated "R"? If you want I can give you a link on an interview with Mel Gibson and the Director of The Testaments video, its a good perspective to have.

So that I understand this correctly. You believe in the Second comming but that the events we as (LDS) view to preceede the comming are more allegorical and past historical? Who then is the beast out of curiosity and how has his role already been played in the past? If im completly misunderstanding this my apologies.

I stand corrected, thanks. The article is educational. Which prison? I'm at Ft Lewis.

I personal tend to sway more towards the hemi than the pre-trib. The evangelical christians stemming with a lot of "The Left Behind" fuel have brought an uprising of popularity and attention. Though some info out there is scewed many hearts are being prepared for things to come.

Back to topic, does anyone have a quote or reference to that specific movie. I found an interview with the director of the Two Testiments or whatever its called on temple square but nothing from a General Authority.

Please explain more on this.

Outstanding! Thanks

This comes from Wikipedia. Most of christianity believes in the rapture as the start of the 7 year tribulation to precede the second coming. What is the LDS view on the rapture? What is the LDS view on the start of the "tribulation". Obviously some of the events foretold we are in the beginning stages but the stuff has not hit the fan and something drastic will happen to propel events forward towards the events in holy writ.

Thanks for the link. This thread has divided into two differ discussions. R rated movies and what i'm trying to find, a mystery quote. The link helps with the R rated movies side which I agree but i'm looking for something more specific to the Passion of the Christ. Ii'mtrying to help this sister to stop believing everything she hears especially when its catering false quotes to gospel pprinciples I think maybe Pres Hinkley could say something to this degree but i'm looking factual not hearsay. That was a good article though.

Think of what kinda rack he would have on his class A's (army stuff). Im now waiting for a ex marine to say "he would of been a marine!". B)

Part of the motivation of the LDS people comes from our history. Its quite unique and exciting. We look to our past and see who we came from and that helps us understand who we are. Family history just fills in the gaps from us to the great stories. You could compare it to the great stories of the bible, if a link could be made from you to Moses or even Christ its gives motivation for you to find your line. This is not the reason why we do genealogy but helps with our drive to do the work. Makes it exciting to preform this commandment. Kinda sounds corny but this sometimes is refered to as "The Spirit of Elijah".

I own the movie and have used it as FHE with the wife. I understand your comments and believe me I completely agree with you. Take no offence just lookin for a reference (if one even exists).