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Rob Osborn

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  1. Rob Osborn
    We certainly have mutating DNA, thats no doubt. But could that same random mechanism have brought about life itself? Evidence strongly shows it cant.
  2. Rob Osborn
    My view of ID theory is mainstream ID theory. ID theory is misunderstood by most because of all the Darwinian evoloutionists propaganda against ID proponents. Mainstream Evolutionary biology must deal with origins of life as it is a part of its own theory. Every biology class I ever took dealt with the origin of life. Every biology book I have owned has at least one or more chapters dealing with answering the origins of life.
  3. Rob Osborn
    Im sorry if I offended you, that wasnt my point. Your answer typically shows a bias towards secularism. Thats all.
  4. Rob Osborn
    Again, we are not asking if science can find the intelligent designer, thats not ID theory. If science can show evidence that life can only arise from life precedeing it, shouldnt we embrace it as part of science? Thats what ID theory is seeking to establish.
  5. Rob Osborn
    I find it strange that with all the advanced knowledge that LDS have that some members would still believe man evolved from a lower species. If we are the seed of God, doesnt that mean we are his literal offspring? The geneology of man according to scripture places us back to Noah, then from Noah back to Adam and Adam as being the son of God. Why would God, who according to our doctrine has a physical body with sex organs just like ours use millions of years of chance to get a son who looks just like him when God already has the seed within to create a son the first time through a known process? Thus why it truly boggles my mind.
  6. Rob Osborn
    Im just replying to a very typical secular evolutionist type of reply. Whether she is really like that or not doesnt matter, its the fact that the arguments used by secularism are biased against anything that may denote deity.
  7. Rob Osborn
    Its not the question of whether there is a God/designer. Your bias towards secularism is showing through. Intelligent design theory is about refuting random evolutionary processes from chance alone. ID theory doesnt say evolution isnt possible, its saying the mechanism fir evolution is flawed. ID seeks to show that intelligent designs in nature only come about by intelligent designs preceding it. Now, who or what drives that process of design in nature is not important to ID theory. Science is the drive to provide answers to what we observe. If what we observe as intelligence shows an intelligent process precedibg it then we shoukd acknowledge it. Thats science isnt it?
  8. Rob Osborn
    I think its notable to add that recognized secular science does not support nor uphold theistic evolution. To do such would be admitting acceptance of intelligent design theory. You will not get someone like Steven Peck at BYU to admit to any kind of theistic evolutionary model. He may acknowledge the Creator in his religious and Sunday worship, but thats where it stops. He even told me once that he doesnt really see where or how the Creator fits in and perhaps the Creator himself is probably the result of this evolution preceding him.
  9. Rob Osborn
    Both Duane Jeffery and Steven Peck are two I have had personal conversations with. Duane Jeffery retired this last year but notable is the fact that he is a board member for the National Center for Science Education (NCSE) and has been for a long time. The NCSE was purposely established for the entire reason to combat any form of creation science and intelligent design theory and uphold a godless paradigm for our existance on this earth.
  10. Rob Osborn
    Its the cicular dilemma. Until we can again raise children in a God centered environment without so much secular persuasion were gonna continue to see a rise in Christian believers who no longer believe in the Old Testament teachings. Then when you add in the pressure of peers at the teaching level it just steamrolls. This has led to our secular science that somehow is worshiped as the Almight nowdays.
  11. Rob Osborn
    We have to begin with the false notion that our universe had a known beginning. Not sure if you are aware but science has yet been unable to even view the far reaches of our universe. How can they know something of which they cant even see and know whats there?
  12. Rob Osborn
    I have spoken with several notable professors at BYU who honestly believe the Creator pretty much did nothing with the rise of life on this planet. They have to stick with that belief because otherwise they have to believe in intelligent design, but how dare they do such a thing amongst their secular peers at other colleges who would mock them.
  13. Rob Osborn
    Through secular conditioning of godless years of schooling this is most peoples belief. It kind of proves the whole point of our discussion.
  14. Rob Osborn
    I disagree. Tge law of the celestial kingdom pertains to the law of consecration in its fullest where all the saints are equal in temporal things. I live in a very poor ward and I can readily testify that there aŕe many worthy temple reccomend holders who are at opposite ends of the spectrum temporally yet both work just as hard in Zion for their keep. The law states- 14 Nevertheless, in your temporal things you shall be equal, and this not grudgingly, otherwise the abundance of the manifestations of the Spirit shall be withheld 3 For verily I say unto you, the time has come, and is now at hand; and behold, and lo, it must needs be that there be an organization of my people, in regulating and establishing the affairs of the storehouse for the poor of my people, both in this place and in the land of Zion 4 For a permanent and everlasting establishment and order unto my church, to advance the cause, which ye have espoused, to the salvation of man, and to the glory of your Father who is in heaven; 5 That you may be equal in the bonds of heavenly things, yea, and earthly things also, for the obtaining of heavenly things. 6 For if ye are not equal in earthly things ye cannot be equal in obtaining heavenly things; 7 For if you will that I give unto you a place in the celestial world, you must prepare yourselves by doing the things which I have commanded you and required of you. 2 For it must needs be that they be organized according to my laws; if otherwise, they will be cut off. 3 Wherefore, let my servant Edward Partridge, and those whom he has chosen, in whom I am well pleased, appoint unto this people their portions, every man equal according to his family, according to his circumstances and his wants and needs 3 But behold, they have not learned to be obedient to the things which I required at their hands, but are full of all manner of evil, and do not impart of their substance, as becometh saints, to the poor and afflicted among them; 4 And are not united according to the union required by the law of the celestial kingdom; 5 And Zion cannot be built up unless it is by the principles of the law of the celestial kingdom; otherwise I cannot receive her unto myself.
  15. Rob Osborn
    The story changes however when one accepts the idea that perhaps man himself was placed on the earth before the animals. Then what? Or what about the idea that there was a global flood in Noahs day. These ideas change everything in regards to evolution.
  16. Rob Osborn
    One of the avenues I have long wondered about is the enigma of "intelligence" from a purely scientific view. Sure, in religious belief we know tge source of this intelligence comes from spirit matter. But in purely a secular scientific way, there is no answer to explain the existance and rise of intelligence. We can look at all forms of life and nature, even the galaxies in the universe and see order, purpose and design elements. Even right down to the DNA itself, it being a coded intelligent blueprint for making life, we can see the elements of design, purpose and order. But, taking to that understanding level of without "intelligence" itself existing, none of it makes any sense. For instance- The DNA itself does not encode for the intelligence required to build such life form. Its kind of like a blueprint for a building- the blueprint is true but without an intelligent operator or intelligent entity to read and understand fully what it is the blueprint itself cannot just spontaneously build buildings. The blueprint and instructions may even specify how certain tasks are to be completed but without an intelligently trained operator it still means absolutely nothing. And so it is with life, the protein builders themselves, made from the DNA itself are not programmed with an intelligent operation that tells them how to operate and function in regards to carrying out the work itself. For, if that were true, then intelligence is nothing more than a mathematical equation applied to chemistry. But that isnt true, matter, being acted upon gains no intelligence by itself. Properly understood, the protein itself requires an external component of intelligence in order for it to work. Nature itself cant create this intelligence that understands and comprehends and is self aware, so where does it originate? Science, by itself, without God, will never ever know.
  17. Rob Osborn
    Well, the baker (the intelligent designer) uses intelligence, combined with scientific laws to make a cake. You dont just happen to walk down a trail in the woods and happen randomly upon a chocolate cake sitting in the middle of the forest and assume mother nature made it.
  18. Rob Osborn
    Its an entire movement that is trying to remove God from every aspect schooling, belief, society, etc. Is it possible another human intelligence brought life to this planet? Yes. But science will never accept that possibility because that "human intelligence" may be thought of as "God" by some people. This really points to the underlying problem being not so much about science (science, by itself, unbiased doesnt care if there is a Creator or not) but rather a philisophical belief regarding the existance of deity. Of course we all know Satan wants to teach that there is no God and any belief in such is heresy.
  19. Rob Osborn
    http://creationwiki.org/Law_of_biogenesis
  20. Rob Osborn
    You dont understand intelligent design theory then. If science is self correcting as you say then how come the law if biogenesis hasnt been proven false as evolutionists argue it must? Where is the obvious self correction there? They are hanging on to a false premise that has shown over and over to be unobservable, untestable and against all known laws in science.
  21. Rob Osborn
    No, intelligent dedign is a scientific effort to counter 2 arguments- 1.that life evolved from unguided (random) events in nature. This process is now termed "abiogenesis". 2. That complex structures in biologic life forms arise through slow evolutionary process void of any intelligent process preceding it.
  22. Rob Osborn
    Its that part about "God who created life in the first place" that states you believe in intelligent design. But, to actually state that life could not have evolved without divine providence is another story. Where do you stand- Did life evolve because of the Creators intervention and causual effects or did it happen on its own?
  23. Rob Osborn
    I was taught a lil differently. Temple interview questions qualify us to go to the temple. Obedience to all the temple ordinances and covenants qualify us to enter the celestial kingdom. For instance- we do not have to live the law of consecration to enter the temple. But, we do have to live that law to enter the celestial kingdom. Right now, we havent been generally commanded as a complete body to live the law of consecration. But, that time is coming and we all will have to live it to enter the celestial kingdom.
  24. Rob Osborn
    Belief in the Creator= LDS beliefs Belief in the Creator= Belief in Intelligent Design Its interesting though that a lot of LDS reject intelligent design. To me its the grand paradox how the two could possibly coexist.
  25. Rob Osborn
    Im getting all too tired of this equality bull$%*@! I believe that as an employer I get to make the rules on who is hired, who is not based on any reason I want.