Does God want members of His Church to prosper financially?

[Connie]

How about the "labeling" you have been resorting to, Snow, i.e. "plagiarist" and "liar." ("Be honest - you have no such friend who had no such student who got a stove and rug. Isn't that so. It's untrue and we both know it...., which by the way I can prove." Since you're so sure you have proof, i wouldn't mind hearing it)

Look, i have some of the same questions and suspicions you have but at least i have not resorted to name calling, as that would be against the rules. I'm simply trying to glean as much truth as i can from this.

I'm still not convinced this is in accordance with celestial law. I think this is an attempt to mix Zion and Babylon. And, unfortunately, much like trying to mix water and oil, they will tend to separate themselves out over time. But since i am still in the midst of my own study of the law of consecration, i will forebear on any final judgment until i'm sure i am not missing any important pieces of the puzzle.

I did find the Wallace Wattles book. It can be read here: http://www.v-j-enterprises.com/scienceofgettingrich.pdf

[solomon-helaman]

Being rich is not Babylon, and being poor is not Zion. (Moses 7:18)

Being poor does not make you bad, but if you want to live a Celestial life you need to become rich, because there will be no poor living in mansions in heaven. Wattles book is a worldly perspective of how to get rich, but has many true priciples that we can learn from. It is by the laws of God that we become a zionistic society. Zion is not necessarily a place, but rather a state of mind, much like the Spirit World is. We need to change our state of mind to be as Moses said, "of one heart and one mind, and dwelt and righteousness, and there was no poor among them. I think it is very easy to connect Zion with being rich. I don't know if you noticed the title of Brigham Young's remarks in my last post. "The Order of Enoch—Study of Law—How to Become Rich."

[sgrGODSway]

friend (frnd)

n.

1. A person whom one knows, likes, and trusts.

2. A person whom one knows; an acquaintance.

3. A person with whom one is allied in a struggle or cause; a comrade.

4. One who supports, sympathizes with, or patronizes a group, cause, or movement.

--- I agree with solomon-helaman, who is not myself but someone who asked to read the book....like several of you, and he must have read it. --- I will respond to the rest of you, but it's best that I ignore Snow. I decided to check out posts by Snow in other discussions to see if I am unique or if he takes the same tone with others. I found that I am not unique. Snow attacks a lot! That's too bad. I can tell Snow is very intelligent, but very rough with others. All anyone has to do is read a dozen or so of Snow's posts to see this. Oh well, we live in a "freedom of speech" internet world on LDS.net so we have to take the negative comments along with the positive ones, as well as the personal attacks. I now choose to ignore Snow but I am happy to respond to anyone else. Snow has his freedom of speech and so do I. He is welcome to ignore me too.

Edited March 22, 2009 by sgrGODSway

[Snow]

friend (frnd)

n.

1. A person whom one knows, likes, and trusts.

2. A person whom one knows; an acquaintance.

3. A person with whom one is allied in a struggle or cause; a comrade.

4. One who supports, sympathizes with, or patronizes a group, cause, or movement.

--- I agree with solomon-helaman, who is not myself but someone who asked to read the book....like several of you, and he must have read it. --- I will respond to the rest of you, but it's best that I ignore Snow. I decided to check out posts by Snow in other discussions to see if I am unique or if he takes the same tone with others. I found that I am not unique. Snow attacks a lot! That's too bad. I can tell Snow is very intelligent, but very rough with others. All anyone has to do is read a dozen or so of Snow's posts to see this. Oh well, we live in a "freedom of speech" internet world on LDS.net so we have to take the negative comments along with the positive ones, as well as the personal attacks. I now choose to ignore Snow but I am happy to respond to anyone else. Snow has his freedom of speech and so do I. He is welcome to ignore me too.

Let's see if we got you down correctly.

1. You go around the internet posting on various message boards about your PDF - The Science of Getting Rich God's Way - normally $29.95 and a seminar that normally costs $500 that you are now giving away free.

2. Mostly you are ignored at the other message boards or you get negative responses about your promotion.

3. You don't have a legitimate job - rather you have a franchise of Robert Kiyosaki's (RICH DAD) CASHFLOW CLUB.

4. You host these CASHFLOW CLUBS where people come together and play a board that supposedly teaches principles like investment and accounting... and of course, getting rich.

5. CASHFLOW CLUB members can buy board game which looks like the board game Life for about $200.

6. There are other products and services - maybe even some multilevel upstream downstream stuff - for sale, all based around financial independence.

7. You are promoting your Get Rich PDF in conjunction with your CASH FLOW CLUB - that is, having the PDF and seminar on getting rich God's way is a a clever little way to distinguish you from the other CASH FLOW CLUB franchisees - and it targets a specific audience - Christians - and now Mormons.

8. The response on LDS.net is by far the best response you've gotten on any of the internet message boards you've posted on.

9. Mormons are notoriously susceptible to propaganda, fraud and get rich schemes, especially when the opportunities come from other Mormons. Utah (you are in Arizona) is often referred to as the fraud capital. Mormons are also notorious for bankruptcy - Utah often leading the nation in bankruptcy rates and sometimes called the bankruptcy capital.

10. You've made sure that we know that you are LDS and a returned missionary.

11. You joined this message board 2 weeks ago. Solomon-helaman joined right after that and many or most of his posts have been on your thread. His posts on this thread don't just respond to other posts but pump up your whole concept of getting rich. For example, he summed up one of his lengthy posts this way:

"There is nothing wrong with trying to be rich, and I would suggest that God wants righteous saints to succeed financially. We just need to continue with the focus to build up god's kingdom. Let's stop thinking like the poor and start thinking like the rich who are as He says, "His People".

It's interesting that both your and his posts are similar in content and look and feel. The use of asking questions and answering them yourself - use of bold text, the use of blocks of blue text - the prosperity gospel angle. You both calling out to ignore me - the critic of this kind of crass get-rich tripe. He agrees with you and then you post and agree with him - very nice to have shrill to pique the interest in your thread and lend credibility.

12. Your PDF - as we both know - is dishonest - it promotes a falsehood as evidence that your get-rich method works. You claim in it that you have a friend that taught your method to a student who then used it to get a rug and stove and bay widow for his house.

That's completely untrue - Why won't you admit that you plagiarized it from another book and you have no such friend?

Edited March 22, 2009 by Snow

[solomon-helaman]

I am sorry for only using Brigham Young quotes, but they are so good. I will start looking for some other prophet's quotes, but President Young understood the need for God's people to be rich. President Young knew what zion was exactly like and he was trying to help the saints understand too.

Necessity of Paying Due Attention to Temporal Duties.

Remarks by President Brigham Young, made in the Tabernacle, Great Salt Lake City, January 26, 1862.

"This people, in their notions concerning life, are similar to the whole world. We have brought our traditions from the world, but we wish to learn better, and get rid of every false notion and practice. As I told you the other day, it is impossible to believe a truth that is not embraced in “Mormonism,” whether it is found in the mental education or physical pursuits of mortals, in the spiritual refinement of the Gods, or in culling immortal fruits from trees that grow in the Elysian fields of Paradise. “The life that now is” more immediately demands our attention, and I am fearful that many spend their lives for naught. There are persons in this community who, if they could have their own will gratified and be possessed of plenty of means, would not do another day's work in their lives, unless they were urged to it. Such persons are told that they should devote their lifetime they now have to usefulness; but they have sufficient, they say, and have no need to be useful in performing any kind of labor. This is a mistake. Though I possessed millions of money and property, that does not excuse me from performing the labor that it is my calling to perform, so far as I have strength and ability, any more than the poorest man in the community is excused. The more we are blessed with means, the more we are blessed with responsibility; the more we are blessed with wisdom and ability, the more we are placed under the necessity of using that wisdom and ability in the spread of righteousness, the subjugation of sin and misery, and the amelioration of the condition of mankind. The man that has only one talent and the man that has five talents have responsibility accordingly. If we have a world of means, we have a world of responsibility. If we have an eternity of knowledge, we shall have an eternity of business to transact and to occupy every particle of the knowledge bestowed upon us.

"Then, instead of searching after what the Lord is going to do for us, let us inquire what we can do for ourselves, and the answer will be, We can make our own hats, bonnets, shoes, and clothing, and we can make our own heaven here below; and if there is anything that we cannot make now, we will wear what we have until we can make more."

This quote talks about how this world was created with the purpose of gaining an abundance. We should always be working on gaining more. I love President Young.

[Elgama]

the question was does the Lord want to prosper financially - I personally believe and has not changed as a result of this thread that the Lord wants us to prosper, if we were living the Law of Consecration perfectly as a church there would be no poor amongst, but as we are not living the law perfectly we will always have poor amongst us, it does not mean those who are rich or poor are any less valued, or righteous than another, or any less likely to prosper eternally.

I have needed church assistance in the past but even then I do not consider myself poor I have a roof over my head, and food in my belly - I also have access to clean water and healthcare. I have the basics and extra - how am I poor?

-Charley

[Connie]

Let's see if we got you down correctly.

1. You go around the internet posting on various message boards about your PDF - The Science of Getting Rich God's Way - normally $29.95 and a seminar that normally costs $500 that you are now giving away free.

2. Mostly you are ignored at the other message boards or you get negative responses about your promotion.

3. You don't have a legitimate job - rather you have a franchise of Robert Kiyosaki's (RICH DAD) CASHFLOW CLUB.

4. You host these CASHFLOW CLUBS where people come together and play a board that supposedly teaches principles like investment and accounting... and of course, getting rich.

5. CASHFLOW CLUB members can buy board game which looks like the board game Life for about $200.

6. There are other products and services - maybe even some multilevel upstream downstream stuff - for sale, all based around financial independence.

7. You are promoting your Get Rich PDF in conjunction with your CASH FLOW CLUB - that is, having the PDF and seminar on getting rich God's way is a a clever little way to distinguish you from the other CASH FLOW CLUB franchisees - and it targets a specific audience - Christians - and now Mormons.

8. The response on LDS.net is by far the best response you've gotten on any of the internet message boards you've posted on.

9. Mormons are notoriously susceptible to propaganda, fraud and get rich schemes, especially when the opportunities come from other Mormons. Utah (you are in Arizona) is often referred to as the fraud capital. Mormons are also notorious for bankruptcy - Utah often leading the nation in bankruptcy rates.

10. You've made sure that we know that you are LDS and a returned missionary.

11. You joined this message board 2 weeks ago. Solomon-helaman joined right after that and many or most of his posts have been on your thread. His posts on this thread don't just respond to other posts but pump up your whole concept of getting rich. For example, he summed up one of his lengthy posts this way:

"There is nothing wrong with trying to be rich, and I would suggest that God wants righteous saints to succeed financially. We just need to continue with the focus to build up god's kingdom. Let's stop thinking like the poor and start thinking like the rich who are as He says, "His People".

It's interesting that both your and his posts are similar in content and look and feel. The use of asking questions and answering them yourself - use of bold text, the use of blocks of blue text - the prosperity gospel angle. You both calling out to ignore me - the critic of this kind of crass get-rich tripe. He agrees with you and then you post and agree with him - very nice to have shrill to pique the interest in your thread and lend credibility.

12. Your PDF - as we both know - is dishonest - it promotes a falsehood as evidence that your get-rich method works. You claim in it that you have a friend that taught your method to a student who then used it to get a rug and stove and bay widow for his house.

That's completely untrue - Why won't you admit that you plagiarized it from another book and you have no such friend?

I have been able to confirm much, but not all, of this information. I appreciate the trouble you went through to gather this information, though i have not been able to confirm all of your statements.

Just a friendly suggestion, Snow, if i may, You would get a lot farther, with me at least, if you cut the condescending tone out of many of your posts. Not to mention the flaming and name calling are against the rules (regardless of whether or not they're true).

[solomon-helaman]

My personal belief is that if you are not sitting idle and waiting for an "entitled" handout you are rich. It is a mindset. Blessings come by good works, good works come through faith, and faith comes because of the grace of God's infinate atonement. (Eph. 2:8-10) If we lack faith and don't do good works than we fall from God's grace, and lack in the eternal blessings of heaven.

Being rich financially is a tool to doing God's work, but if we are not able to create an abundance we are the unprofitable servant. (Matt. 25) Like I said this is my personal belief. I would not judge wheather a person is poor or not, that is for God to judge thankfully. But, as for myself this is my measuring stick. "Am I creating an abundance?"

[sgrGODSway]

Connie

Thank you.

The reason why some of what Snow has said can't be confirmed is because he has decided to come to his own conclusions instead of get all the facts...but that's ok.

I would be happy to answer any and all of your questions. I can do it in this post or you can just send me a personal message...or I'd even be happy to speak with you. You can send me a personal message and I'll give you my phone number if you like.

BTW...how do you know Leslie Householder? If you know her personally give her a call. I am sure she'd likely verify who I am and what I do. Snow is way off on these things...especially my motives:-) I do not have a Rich Dad Cashflow Club franchise and I have never sold the game to anyone. I am however the founder of the largest Cashflow Club in the country. We have just about 4,000 members in the PHX Metro area and membership is FREE. How's that for a profitable business? Pretty funny, huh? The Cashflow Club is how I have been giving back to our community for almost 6 years now. Since I don't sell the game, and most people reading this post live nowhere near me, plus I am giving the book away for FREE as a pdf ebook, there isn't any compensation coming to me for doing this. I just want to help people realize that they can prosper and live the Gospel too.

Connie, thank you for your kind tone. I am cool with healthy skepticism. You are just being smart and careful. That is why I am so willing to answer your questions, as well as the questions of others who genuinely want to know if what I share in the book is truth or not.

I have a simple answer for you and everyone. 3 Nephi 14:20 "Wherefore, by their fruits ye shall know them." Test out what I have shared in the book. If you don't, I guess you'll never really know? Reading the words isn't a test though. Working with the Laws is. Try it and see if you like the fruit. Do it with something small and simple. Work with a small righteous desire that you have and follow the process. I wish you the best with this!

[Snow]

Connie

Thank you.

The reason why some of what Snow has said can't be confirmed is because he has decided to come to his own conclusions instead of get all the facts...but that's ok.

I would be happy to answer any and all of your questions. I can do it in this post or you can just send me a personal message...or I'd even be happy to speak with you. You can send me a personal message and I'll give you my phone number if you like.

BTW...how do you know Leslie Householder? If you know her personally give her a call. I am sure she'd likely verify who I am and what I do. Snow is way off on these things...especially my motives:-) I do not have a Rich Dad Cashflow Club franchise and I have never sold the game to anyone. I am however the founder of the largest Cashflow Club in the country. We have just about 4,000 members in the PHX Metro area and membership is FREE. How's that for a profitable business? Pretty funny, huh? The Cashflow Club is how I have been giving back to our community for almost 6 years now. Since I don't sell the game, and most people reading this post live nowhere near me, plus I am giving the book away for FREE as a pdf ebook, there isn't any compensation coming to me for doing this. I just want to help people realize that they can prosper and live the Gospel too.

Connie, thank you for your kind tone. I am cool with healthy skepticism. You are just being smart and careful. That is why I am so willing to answer your questions, as well as the questions of others who genuinely want to know if what I share in the book is truth or not.

I have a simple answer for you and everyone. 3 Nephi 14:20 "Wherefore, by their fruits ye shall know them." Test out what I have shared in the book. If you don't, I guess you'll never really know? Reading the words isn't a test though. Working with the Laws is. Try it and see if you like the fruit. Do it with something small and simple. Work with a small righteous desire that you have and follow the process. I wish you the best with this!

Uh-huh.

Perhaps franchise was the wrong word. You have a CASH FLOW Club that uses Robert Kiyosaki's RICH DAD board game.

Now that that's been cleared up - am I factually mistaken in anything I posted?

When are you going to address the plagiarism issues and demonstrably false claims in your "book?"

Edited March 23, 2009 by Snow

[PastorBob]

According to the bible, we are to have only as much as we need.

Genesis 3: 19 In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou return unto the ground; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return.

Matthew 6: 24 No man can serve two masters: for either he will hate the one, and love the other; or else he will hold to the one, and despise the other. Ye cannot serve God and mammon.

Luke 18: 25 For it is easier for a camel to go through a needle's eye, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God.

Note: mammon = wealth.

[solomon-helaman]

According to the bible, we are to have only as much as we need.

Genesis 3: 19 In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou return unto the ground; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return.

Matthew 6: 24 No man can serve two masters: for either he will hate the one, and love the other; or else he will hold to the one, and despise the other. Ye cannot serve God and mammon.

Luke 18: 25 For it is easier for a camel to go through a needle's eye, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God.

Note: mammon = wealth.

You are right pastor, but think of it like a pie. You have four people wanting a piece of the pie. God teaches that we should get an equal share of the pie. This is where God wants us to create a bigger pie, so that we can all have bigger pieces. Creation is such an important process in this life. We need to be creating. Start out small, and the more you create the more you can enjoy, and the more that those around you can enjoy. God has given us an abundant earth. We need to create with that abundance.

You can read my earlier thread where I quoted Brigham Young explaining that Christ does not mean that we should not be rich, but that if you are rich and serve God you are his people. You can be rich and not serve mammon. We should not try to create wealth, but create what God would have us create. Use His Spirit to enlighten our minds and create abundance for ourselves and others, but always giving gratitude to Christ and His grace.

[Snow]

Being rich is not Babylon, and being poor is not Zion. (Moses 7:18)

Being poor does not make you bad, but if you want to live a Celestial life you need to become rich, because there will be no poor living in mansions in heaven.

So remarkable it's worth saying twice.

[a-train]

Note: mammon = wealth.

If indeed it is a sin for man to possess wealth, then let us condemn Him that hath given it to man. From whom did man obtain the wealth of this earth? God. Will we condemn God and bite the hand that feeds?

Just because a man possesses wealth, does not mean he is a servant of it. Indeed, man is to use the resources of the earth to serve God. An asset is something that serves the possessor. When the possessor must serve a thing, it is a liability. The resources we have are to be assets in serving God, but inasmuch as they become liabilities, they are to be cast off and put back into the common stock from whence another may perhaps make of them an asset.

Jacob taught: "But before ye seek for riches, seek ye for the kingdom of God. And after ye have obtained a hope in Christ ye shall obtain riches, if ye seek them; and ye will seek them for the intent to do good—to clothe the naked, and to feed the hungry, and to liberate the captive, and administer relief to the sick and the afflicted." (Jacob 2:18-19)

What can we learn from the parable of the talents? That we must use what we have to make an increase. But if we cannot make such an increase, it must be given to him that can.

That is where we go wrong, we want to simply take the talent for ourselves and make no increase, just as did the slothful servant.

Does God want man to possess great wealth? To prosper? If He had not man's prosperity in mind when He gave to him the earth, then for what did He give it? Did he seek for man to live in poverty on such a plentiful sphere? Such awkward retardation irks the soul.

What would be the purpose in feeding the hungry, clothing the naked, and offering relief to our fellow man if indeed God does not want man to be so blessed? Why is it we are commanded to do these things if indeed God does not want man to prosper?

What is the meaning of "be fruitful" (Genesis 1:28)? Does this mean the opposite of prosperity? The antonyms listed in my thesaurus under the heading of "prosperity" are failure, loss, poorness, and poverty. Is this the will of God for man?

Is it God's will that man endure financial failure, financial loss, financial poorness, financial poverty?

God without any doubt wants man to prosper financially, but man doesn't want it. Financial prosperity means we must exchange our talents with the exchangers, we must live by the sweat of our brow. But man doesn't want that. Man wants to simply glut himself on others. He wants slaves, he wants to be provided for. He wants something for nothing, but he doesn't realize that he already has that. It just isn't his fellow man, but the earth and its resources.

-a-train

Edited March 23, 2009 by a-train

[WillowTheWhisp]

Malachi 3:

10 Bring ye all the tithes into the storehouse, that there may be meat in mine house, and prove me now herewith, saith the Lord of hosts, if I will not open you the windows of heaven, and pour you out a blessing, that there shall not be room enough to receive it.

11 And I will rebuke the devourer for your sakes, and he shall not destroy the fruits of your ground; neither shall your vine cast her fruit before the time in the field, saith the Lord of hosts.

12 And all nations shall call you blessed: for ye shall be a delightsome land, saith the Lord of hosts.

That doesn't sound like a Heavenly Father who wants us to be poor.

[Connie]

When are you going to address the plagiarism issues and demonstrably false claims in your "book?"

I'm still waiting for your proof of these claims that you stated you had. I wonder how you were even able to find such proof. I'm wondering if you even have any since all you seem able to do is state your claims over and over and over again without offering any proof.

sgrGODSway: I do not know Leslie personally. I watched her Stickman presentation on her website and read The Jackrabbit Factor many months ago. I came away from it with an appreciation for the power of thought (which i should have learned just by listening to my own mother but needed an extra kick in the head). My next step will be to re-read that and really focus on the financial aspect of it. It's funny i didn't really focus on the financial part of it since that's 90% of it.

[rameumptom]

I guess we can just toss out Jesus' Beatitudes, eh? Blessed are the poor in spirit, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven, just doesn't wash anymore.

Sounds like the Protestant Gospel of Wealth being preached here. It is just one more of Satan's methods to entrap and enslave people in his grip. Isn't this idea of envisioning stuff and then getting it without any work, how we got into this economic crisis in the first place? People sought a free lunch, not realizing that it eventually catches up to us.

No, it isn't a sin to be wealthy. It IS a sin to misuse your wealth, regardless of what your income is. Each of us is to be a steward of the things we have. We are to put first the kingdom of God, and then God will give us all things we stand in need of. This program turns that around, by having us use positive mental attitude concepts, and use them for selfish purposes. Sadly, I'm sure there will be many lost souls who will pay this buy $500 for his seminar.

[rameumptom]

Fast offering funds can not be used to pay for a mortgage but can be used for rent. The handbook of instructions has very specific guidelines.

The idea is "life sustaining" and if a repair on a car to go to work is needed that equates to replacing a horse or paying for the vet to heal the horse. Now, that is a far cry from becoming rich and theorizing God's laws into the equation to become so.

Just my thoughts...:)

That used to be true, but has now changed. Now, fast offering funds are to be used for "life sustaining" needs. If a struggling person has a mortgage on a $500,000 home he never could afford, then the bishop should probably not help with it. But there are many instances that if a temporary assistance can save a modest person in his modest home, then the bishop definitely can assist with fast offering funds.

[sgrGODSway]

Connie

The Jackrabbit Factor is a GREAT BOOK! Yes, by all means read it again. It will help.

For everyone who really wants to know what my book is about but would like to read an excerpt first I am putting the preface here:

Preface to The Science of Getting Rich GOD's Way - Are you honest in heart and do you need direction and help in your life?

If this describes you then you are the type of person we are looking to help. This book was written with you in mind. It is meant to be a tool you can use to create the type of life that is really worth living.

God wants all of His children to live happy, productive, prosperous lives. He wants us to develop our talents and abilities, serve others, and to experience true joy.

This book was written because God has blessed my life and because I think credit should be given where credit is due!

God has placed a lot of good books, people, teachings, and experiences in my path so that I could learn how to co-create with Him, an amazing life! Over time I have internalized and applied this information and it has born good fruit in my life.

Much of what I have written in this book has its origins in scripture and also from a book written over 100 years ago by a man named Wallace Wattles. That book is titled The Science of Getting Rich. What I have done is take that material and given it more of a Christian twist and perspective. I believe Mr. Wattles was a Christian, but he wrote the book from a perspective that was more scientific.

Over the last few years a lot has come out concerning The Law of Attraction. The work that has made the biggest splash is a book and movie both titled The Secret. The Secret also has its origins in the book The Science of Getting Rich. The Secret teaches the Law of Attraction in more of a metaphysical new age sort of way. I think that book and movie have a lot of value, accept it really doesn't explain very well that God, our Father in Heaven, is the true source of power behind how the universe operates.

What I am sharing with you in The Science of Getting Rich GOD's Way is a clear version of how things really work. In fact I could have given my book the title How To Create The Life You Really Want Using God's Help and that would have been very appropriate.

I believe it is time for people who believe in God to become more prosperous. I honestly think that God can do more good with a prosperous, happy, trusting, faithful person to further His causes here on earth, than He can with a person who is only concerned about their personal day to day struggles for survival. Besides, that Laws that Govern the acquisition of money and things are just as much God's Laws as the Law of Gravity is. When we break either Law we suffer the consequences. When we obey either Law life is a lot better!

We are living in a time when there is a lot of uncertainty in the world we live in. The economy in the United States where I live, as well as in other countries, has deteriorated. This has happened because people have broken God's Laws that relate to living a financially prosperous life. Some have done it on purpose, but most have done it in ignorance. Unfortunately like disobeying the Law of Gravity, the consequences have been disastrous!

Here is the good news:

You can co-create with God a very happy, peaceful, financially prosperous life, in this economy as well as in any other economy!

When you learn HOW to obey God's Laws that create financial abundance, you will likely do so. You just need an explanation of what these Laws are and how you are supposed to follow them, and I believe the chances are great that as you practice doing so, you will see the results you are seeking. Most people just aren't aware of what the Laws are and how they are supposed to be followed.

I have more good news:

Once you start to obey these Laws as God would have you obey them, positive changes tend to come VERY RAPIDLY!

It is my hope that you will read this book and become part of a growing community of people who are devoted to God, who are creating great financial abundance, so they can better serve their families as well as “their neighbors.” As you do this you will please God and become a greater instrument for good. This will happen because you will have more resources to work with. Keep your heart and mind single to His glory, and let Him be your guide. Most of all, trust that He will lead you in obtaining your righteous desires “GOD's Way.”

Sincerely, Kevin Sparks – Author of The Science of Getting Rich GOD's Way

Once a person has read the whole book, and put the Laws into practice, you'll see that what I share works...and you'll find that it is Gospel based. The reason I took Wallace Wattles work and gave it a God-based perspective is because the original book had some Gospel errors. I just corrected some things and filled in some of the blanks so that it was in line with Gospel truth. Those changes make understanding and working with God's Laws easier for members of the Church as well as for any Christian. Wallace Wattles was very close, without my changes, to the truth. He shared it the best he could with the knowledge he had. His is one of the "best books" referred to in the Doctrine & Covenenants.

Edited March 23, 2009 by sgrGODSway

[Connie]

I guess we can just toss out Jesus' Beatitudes, eh? Blessed are the poor in spirit, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven, just doesn't wash anymore.

Sounds like the Protestant Gospel of Wealth being preached here. It is just one more of Satan's methods to entrap and enslave people in his grip. Isn't this idea of envisioning stuff and then getting it without any work, how we got into this economic crisis in the first place? People sought a free lunch, not realizing that it eventually catches up to us.

God gave us this world and all the things in it without our working for it. Everything is a gift of God. We have earned nothing. We are not to reject the free lunch given by God. "without a sincere religious awareness, the free lunch corrupts rich and poor alike. It is the recognition of divine law that both sanctions and requires the free lunch for everybody." -Hugh Nibley

No, it isn't a sin to be wealthy. It IS a sin to misuse your wealth, regardless of what your income is. Each of us is to be a steward of the things we have. We are to put first the kingdom of God, and then God will give us all things we stand in need of. This program turns that around, by having us use positive mental attitude concepts, and use them for selfish purposes. Sadly, I'm sure there will be many lost souls who will pay this buy $500 for his seminar.

This is exactly my dilemma: Is it right to use these powers of positive thought just to obtain wealth?

My tentative conclusion is that if God commanded me to use it because He knew i would use it well and for the good of others as part of my mission on earth, then i'd better do it. But if He knows i would only use these powers for selfish reasons and therefore tells me not to, then i'd better not.

I guess, then, the crux of the whole thing is to have a great relationship with God and take the counsel He gives through personal revelation and make sure there is a sense of what ones mission on this earth is. I can think of many who have wealth as part of their mission in life and also perhaps as part of their test. Wealth is a huge burden and responsibility--one that i'm not sure i want.

[a-train]

This is exactly my dilemma: Is it right to use these powers of positive thought just to obtain wealth?

And there is the issue. If the endeavor of man is simply to obtain subsistance on the backs of his brethren, then he is an idle glut and in opposition to the commandments of God. If having received a certain piece of property, he does nothing with it but hold it to his own, he will lose it. This is not only in the end of his life, but in the course of his days, just as in the parable of the talents.

Example: Suppose I buy a van. As long as the van is used in providing goods and services, it pays for itself. It is an asset. It is not only an asset to me, but it is so useful to my customers that they are paying me to use it. Both me and my customers are benefited by my possession of this van.

However, suppose I don't use it. Suppose it does nothing but sit in my driveway. It is constantly losing value, the tires rot, the filters still need changing, the taxes are still due, it is nothing but a liability. It is neither productive for me or my fellows. It is already as good as lost. But because I must maintain it with income from other assets, it causes me to lose wealth I otherwise could allocate to better things had I not possessed the van.

The same is true for every possession imaginable. It is either a liability or an asset. So long as it is an asset, it is good for both the possessor and his fellows to be in use. It's use brings new wealth into the economy. But when it becomes a liability, this is a signal to the possessor that it should be sold, it needs to go to someone who will make an asset of it.

The trouble comes when greed prevents us from letting assets be used as such. We cling to material possessions as they do nothing but drain us of wealth. Our love for these possessions can blind us of that fact.

I may love that van so much that I will not part with it even though I must take income accrued from other assets to offset its liability. Meanwhile, others who would make great use of the van are deprived of it. But suppose after a time of reflection and some counsel from my wife, I decide to sell it. I want the highest price for it. I want more than it is really worth. My attitude should be that I am glad that it is going where it will be used and I am paid market value for it. But greed is a strong emotion that will cloud any reasonable thought if not let go.

The slothful servant turned his master's talent into a liability. The servant simply wanted his master to give him subsistance without turning the talent to the exchangers. Thus the servant was not an asset, but a liability. And the good master, upon discovering this, promptly removed the capital from him and gave it to one that was productive with it.

The master was not greedy. There is nothing to suggest he was worldly. Indeed, he is the Saviour.

Wealth is not burdensome, liabilities are. So if our possessions are a burden, then they are liabilities and should be liquidated.

-a-train

Edited March 23, 2009 by a-train

[WillowTheWhisp]

I guess we can just toss out Jesus' Beatitudes, eh? Blessed are the poor in spirit, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven, just doesn't wash anymore.

Sounds like the Protestant Gospel of Wealth being preached here. .

In the sermon on the mount Jesus said (as you so rightly quoted) "Blessed are the poor in spirit." He didn't say "Blessed are the poor."

Remember we are taught about the 'philosophies of men mingled with scripture'? Scripture teaches us chastity. Apostacy corrupted this into 'blessed are the celibate' which gave us Catholic priests, monks and nuns who believe that the celibate lives they live bring them closer to God than marrying would. Whereas we LDS believe in the revelation that exaltation requires us to be married.

The scriptures teach "The love of money is the root of all evil."

Apostacy teaches "Money is the root of all evil" - just one word missing but what a difference that word makes.

Jesus said "Blessed are the poor in spirit, for theirs is the Kingdom of Heaven."

Apostacy teaches, "Blessed are the poor."

Why are people misquoting scripture in order to justify their personal opinions? Even more worryingly why are people claiming that what is in scripture is Satan's teaching? Surely is is Satan who twists scripture in order to mislead us?

In the parable of the talents we are told of three servants who were given a sum of money each to look after whilst the master was away. The one who simply buried his was regarded as unworthy. The usual interpretation we hear of this is that God means us to use and develop our talents and skills. Why? Why are we never encouraged to improve our lot financially?

God did not 'reward' Job with poverty.

When the Nephites were righteous they did not 'prosper' with poverty.

Why do we assume that Mary and Joseph were poor? Because there was no room for them in the inn and Jesus was born in a stable? He was born in a stable because 'there was no room' in the inn - it was full, not because they couldn't afford a room in the inn. Wise men from the east brought gifts of gold, frankincense and myrrh.Were they told to take the gold away? Joseph was a carpenter. It was a skilled profession. He wasn't a beggar. At the wedding in Cana Jesus turned water into wine and it was the best wine anyone had tasted - he gave them the best. He didn't tell them to be glad of the water.

As for 'the Protestant Gospel of Wealth' - what the heck is that? I've heard of the Protestant work ethic but never the Protestant gospel of wealth.

Edited March 23, 2009 by WillowTheWhisp

[Connie]

As for 'the Protestant Gospel of Wealth' - what the heck is that? I've heard of the Protestant work ethic but never the Protestant gospel of wealth.

I would venture a guess that he is referring to the idea that wealth equates to righteousness and poverty equates to unrighteousness (is that a word?). I could be wrong, however.

a-train: thank you for your posts, you have given me much to think about.

[a-train]

Perhaps we could ask the question: "Does God want members of His Church to be physically healthy?" There are those who despite their obedience to the word of wisdom and great care may contract a horrible disease. This is simply part of their test in life, but this doesn't mean they should embrace disease and abandon healthy living and the word of wisdom. Such wreckless behaviour and excess is not God's will, He counsels frugality in the spending of our body as a resource.

Just the same, God wants us to live a lifestyle of frugality in all things. In this we will be blessed. However, this does not mean we are guaranteed to avoid financial disaster caused by outside forces beyond our control. Just as the healthy living individual can still lose his/her health, good stewards can endure financial ruin.

There ARE false preachers who tell us that one's material poverty comes only through their own personal sin, and that material wealth comes only to the righteous. Somehow these have forgotten how the wicked steal. There are others more subtle that tell us that we should simply pray for God to send us a money blessing and sit idle while keeping an eye on our mailbox.

The truth is that we have at our disposal a scarce (meaning limited) set of resources. We are to, with the help of the LORD, make value judgments and determine whether these things in our stewardship are assets or liabilities. We are to make as much of them into assets as possible and if we cannot make an asset of a given item, we should endeavor to sell it to someone who can and use the procedes to purchase real assets (thus making an asset of a liability).

There is something more to know about rich and poor. A rich man can be broke. There is a difference between poor and broke. Broke means you have no cash. Poor means you have no assets. Broke and poor means you have nothing.

What portion of our income do we allocate toward the purchase of new assets, or the maintenance of existing assets? Whatever portion that is, it is our capital improvement. If we are not making any capital improvements, we need to lower our expenses and start doing so. If that means getting rid of liabilities, (think car, house, boat, whatever) so be it. We need not be attached. We should have no emotion for a house or a car or what have you. It is simply a dead material object.

The greedy refuse to sell their liabilities. They waste and wear out their lives working to keep them. They think they are rich by virtue of doing so, but they are actually poor because they own nothing but liabilities and no assets.

The prophets have taught from the beginning that we are to be an industrious people. We are to be frugal, self-sustaining, builders of Zion. We are to manage assets, to be productive. Satan works very hard to entice us to spend our resources and time on consumption, on eating up wealth rather than building it.

The prophets have never been ambiguious on the subject. They have said plainly that our duty is to be debt-free, to have a savings, to pay our tithes and offerings, and to have our food storage.

-a-train

[sgrGODSway]

First of all, I am not selling a seminar to anyone on this post. I am giving the book away, and if you like the book, I am giving the seminar to you for free also...if you'd like it.

Next, even if I was selling the seminar the a-train's "van example" is perfect. If you payed for a seminar, and your benefit was greater than the cost to attend, you will have received a greater use value than the cash value of the cost attend.

I have a silly question? If all knowlegde should be shared for FREE, and there should be no compensation for the sharing of knowledge, why does the BYU charge students tuition to attend?

Here is one possible answer. Because there is a cost involved in sharing that information AND because the teachers feel they should be payed to teach. The Church must agree with this or else they wouldn't pay the teachers, or they'd just shut BYU down.

Many GAs and Apostles write books. There is a cost involved in get that book into the hands of willing readers. The interesting thing is that nobody complains when they see a book at Deseret Book and realize they have to pay for it if they want it. The great thing is that because the GA wrote the book, and someone wants to read it, a lot of people benefit. Let's look at who benefits:

1. The GA from the book sale, or the charity they may choose to give the proceeds to.

2. The publisher

3. Deseret Book...and the employees who work there and get paid a wage.

4. The reader of the book.

Oh yeah...also the

5. graphic designer

6. paper company

7. ink company

8. editor

9, etc...

This is a-train's "van example" in action!

It starts with an idea. The end result is a benefit to many.

Oh how terrible it is for the GA to share knowledge for a price, or is it?

BTW...GAs and Apostles teach for FREE too. I am not a GA, but that's what I am doing...giving information away for FREE. I feel in this instance a need to give back to show my gratitude to God for what He has allowed me to learn.

Edited March 23, 2009 by sgrGODSway